Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

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Old Gregg
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Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby Old Gregg » Thu Apr 05, 2012 8:45 pm

http://www.law.umich.edu/careers/classs ... stats.aspx

I counted all the law firms I recognized (generally, a bit more than the V100), added in all clerkships of Fed District Court and above, and came up with around 40% for the class of 2011.


Brutal.

xcountryjunkie
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby xcountryjunkie » Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:06 pm

Some of the drop offs at particular firms from C/O 2009 to 2011 are just as brutal:

Dechert: 5 (CO 2009) --> 1 (2011)
Dewey: 4 --> 0
Gibson Dunn: 10 --> 2
Kirkland: 15 --> 2
Latham: 11 --> 3
Milbank: 8 --> 2
Ropes & Gray: 6 --> 0
Shearman: 6 --> 0
Skadden: 11 --> 0
Weil: 7 --> 2

dixiecupdrinking
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby dixiecupdrinking » Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:18 pm

xcountryjunkie wrote:Some of the drop offs at particular firms from C/O 2009 to 2011 are just as brutal:

Dechert: 5 (CO 2009) --> 1 (2011)
Dewey: 4 --> 0
Gibson Dunn: 10 --> 2
Kirkland: 15 --> 2
Latham: 11 --> 3
Milbank: 8 --> 2
Ropes & Gray: 6 --> 0
Shearman: 6 --> 0
Skadden: 11 --> 0
Weil: 7 --> 2

Yeah, what the hell happened? It's not like these firms all got together and decided they don't like Michigan students anymore. It's almost like people weren't even interviewing.

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sanguar
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby sanguar » Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:20 pm

Perhaps it was OCI in 2009... You know, when the bottom had fallen out.

dixiecupdrinking
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby dixiecupdrinking » Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:22 pm

sanguar wrote:Perhaps it was OCI in 2009... You know, when the bottom had fallen out.

Still. Not a single person went to Skadden? Maybe I'm underestimating how bad things were across the board but still.

Regardless, props to Michigan for publishing this (scary) detailed info.

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thelaststraw05
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby thelaststraw05 » Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:28 pm

My understanding is that OCS was super dumb and told everyone that NY wasn't hiring and that they should all bid Chicago. NY hired, Chicago did not.

People who bid NY profited, the large portion of the class that bid Chicago was left out in the cold. My feel from around campus is that things are much better now than they were then.

xcountryjunkie
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby xcountryjunkie » Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:31 pm

I just did a rough tally using the same standard as OP (V100ish + other market firms).

C/O 2009: 236 SAs
C/O 2010: 157 SAs
C/O 2011: 102 SAs

Ouch.

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ehall20
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby ehall20 » Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:46 pm

Sorry if it's inappropriate for me to post here as a 0L, I just got a good laugh from the nonlegal employment:
*Actor, dentist's office, independent contractor, pharmacy, restaurant, sheep farmer, chief writer at Univision, startup, e-commerce consulting, Thomson Reuters, nonlaw university faculty position (2)

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thelawschoolproject
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby thelawschoolproject » Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:50 pm

This frightens me. :|

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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:53 pm

thelawschoolproject wrote:This frightens me. :|


Unintentional anon

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JoeMo
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby JoeMo » Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:54 pm

thelawschoolproject wrote:This frightens me. :|


Then don't go.

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thelawschoolproject
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby thelawschoolproject » Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:56 pm

JoeMo wrote:
thelawschoolproject wrote:This frightens me. :|


Then don't go.



Um..okay? You're cool.

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JoeMo
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby JoeMo » Thu Apr 05, 2012 10:01 pm

thelawschoolproject wrote:
JoeMo wrote:
thelawschoolproject wrote:This frightens me. :|


Then don't go.



Um..okay? You're cool.


Not at all. But you're saying you're scared. If there's another school that doesn't scare you perhaps you'd be happier there. If no such school exists you might be better off waiting a year to see if what everyone else keeps saying is now the case is in fact reflected in next year's numbers. Going to LS with this doom & gloom attitude is probably not the wisest idea. So in short, if you're truly scared then don't go.

kaiser
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby kaiser » Thu Apr 05, 2012 10:03 pm

More than anything else, I give them kudos for actually being man enough to show the full info breakdown. Yeah, OCI in 2009 was brutal, but tell us something we don't know. You know a school is gutsy when they are willing to say that one of their JD graduates went on to become a sheep farmer upon graduation.
Last edited by kaiser on Thu Apr 05, 2012 10:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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beachbum
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby beachbum » Thu Apr 05, 2012 10:03 pm

Yeah, that's pretty terrifying. Props to Mich for releasing this data, though.

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thelawschoolproject
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby thelawschoolproject » Thu Apr 05, 2012 10:07 pm

JoeMo wrote:
Not at all. But you're saying you're scared. If there's another school that doesn't scare you perhaps you'd be happier there. If no such school exists you might be better off waiting a year to see if what everyone else keeps saying is now the case is in fact reflected in next year's numbers. Going to LS with this doom & gloom attitude is probably not the wisest idea. So in short, if you're truly scared then don't go.


I'm a little confused about how I can say that the 2009 employment disaster frightens me and you arrive at the conclusion that I have a "doom & gloom attitude" and therefore am "scared" of going to law school.

I think that being frightened by the situation in 2009 is a legitimate concern, but I also realize that things have changed. Your comment seemed trite to me, and I don't know if you meant to come across as a jerk or not.

With that said, though, do any 3Ls have any personal opinions they'd be willing to share regarding their job search? I met a few at ASW and each of them seemed to already have a job lined out--and jobs that they were happy about, at that. But, I'm not sure if that's to be expected.

ETA: I also give props to Mich for releasing such things. I already had a considerable amount of respect for them, but this just reaffirms that.

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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Apr 05, 2012 10:15 pm

thelawschoolproject wrote:
JoeMo wrote:
Not at all. But you're saying you're scared. If there's another school that doesn't scare you perhaps you'd be happier there. If no such school exists you might be better off waiting a year to see if what everyone else keeps saying is now the case is in fact reflected in next year's numbers. Going to LS with this doom & gloom attitude is probably not the wisest idea. So in short, if you're truly scared then don't go.


I'm a little confused about how I can say that the 2009 employment disaster frightens me and you arrive at the conclusion that I have a "doom & gloom attitude" and therefore am "scared" of going to law school.

I think that being frightened by the situation in 2009 is a legitimate concern, but I also realize that things have changed. Your comment seemed trite to me, and I don't know if you meant to come across as a jerk or not.

With that said, though, do any 3Ls have any personal opinions they'd be willing to share regarding their job search? I met a few at ASW and each of them seemed to already have a job lined out--and jobs that they were happy about, at that. But, I'm not sure if that's to be expected.

ETA: I also give props to Mich for releasing such things. I already had a considerable amount of respect for them, but this just reaffirms that.


Michigan student here. There are still some 3L's who I would say got the back end of ITE. But the 2L class seems really set. Most people I know got exactly what they wanted (biglaw through OCI, regional firms that were their first choices, or PI/gov jobs) and the few that didn't were at the bottom of the curve.

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thelawschoolproject
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby thelawschoolproject » Thu Apr 05, 2012 10:19 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Michigan student here. There are still some 3L's who I would say got the back end of ITE. But the 2L class seems really set. Most people I know got exactly what they wanted (biglaw through OCI, regional firms that were their first choices, or PI/gov jobs) and the few that didn't were at the bottom of the curve.


Thanks! This is helpful!

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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Apr 05, 2012 10:36 pm

What does bottom of the curve mean? 10%-30%?

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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Apr 05, 2012 10:56 pm

One from the class of 2010 is employed at Michigan State University Athletic Department. Sacrilege.

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NinerFan
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby NinerFan » Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:11 pm

Anonymous User wrote:One from the class of 2010 is employed at Michigan State University Athletic Department. Sacrilege.


Might have gone to MSU for undergrad. Undergrad loyalties > most others

goodolgil
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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby goodolgil » Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:13 pm

I'm class of 2013. As a 1L it seemed like it was a disaster for 3Ls and better for 2Ls, but not perfect. As far as I can tell as a 2L this year almost everyone got what they wanted. I'd be really surprised if biglaw placement wasn't at least 50%.

For instance, I know there's 9 2Ls working at Davis Polk this summer, while on that list is 2,1,1. Obviously preferences fluctuate, but SA offer rates have to be way more than they were 2 years ago. Also, there were at least 15 people at the S&C callback dinner, and they offer basically everyone they call back.

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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:20 pm

I can confirm the Davis Polk numbers. I think they made at least 15 offers this year, too. A number decided to go elsewhere.

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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:24 pm

At the Gibson Dunn dinner I saw at least 15 people as well.

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Re: Michigan Law Releases Full Employment Stats

Postby Anonymous User » Thu Apr 05, 2012 11:28 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I can confirm the Davis Polk numbers. I think they made at least 15 offers this year, too. A number decided to go elsewhere.


I'm pretty sure that DPW is 7, not 9. Either way, you're correct that many more offers were made.




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