Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

(BLS, URM status, non-traditional, GLBT)
ComatoseClown
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Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby ComatoseClown » Sat Oct 23, 2010 12:37 am

Paraphrased opinion from an "exploring law careers website": In the coming generation, the American legal profession would benefit from a higher number of diverse and minority lawyers.

With this, do law schools give an admissions boost to Asians, even though they're not considered URM? Secondly, I notice there aren't as many Indian Asians in law schools as there are Oriental Asians (Chinese, Korean, Japanese, Vietnamese, etc). Do law schools, in designing their next entering class, go to an extent to differentiate among an ethnicity class (e.g. Oriental versus non-Oriental Asians, or the various Latino origins like Mexico, Peru, etc.), in order to increased "ethnic diversity"?

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Grizz
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby Grizz » Sat Oct 23, 2010 12:41 am

Nope sorry.

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DoubleChecks
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby DoubleChecks » Sat Oct 23, 2010 12:41 am

to answer your questions:

1. no

2. i dont think so, though it is possible -- however, even if they did, it would be a near insignificant boost imo

DreamShake
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby DreamShake » Sat Oct 23, 2010 1:55 am

ComatoseClown wrote:Paraphrased opinion from an "exploring law careers website": In the coming generation, the American legal profession would benefit from a higher number of diverse and minority lawyers.

With this, do law schools give an admissions boost to Asians, even though they're not considered URM? Secondly, I notice there aren't as many Indian Asians in law schools as there are Oriental Asians (Chinese, Korean, Japanese, Vietnamese, etc). Do law schools, in designing their next entering class, go to an extent to differentiate among an ethnicity class (e.g. Oriental versus non-Oriental Asians, or the various Latino origins like Mexico, Peru, etc.), in order to increased "ethnic diversity"?



1. No. If anything, it's quite the opposite. There was an interesting article not too long ago about how/why URM's tend to take seats in T14 schools that would otherwise be populated by Asians. Focused heavily on Berkeley and the huge drop-off in AA students they experienced immediately after they were told they couldn't use race/ethnicity as a dispositive factor in admissions.

2. In some cases. There's a strong distinction between Puerto Rican/Mexican and other Hispanics, with the former getting a legit URM boost and the others getting a more negligible boost (if any). Not too sure about the other cases, although I doubt it.

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burger lover
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby burger lover » Sat Oct 23, 2010 9:37 am

let's face it. other than the possibility of a DS about adding mad karaoke skills to the school, i don't think that anyone considers asians "diverse" anymore.

fair? probably not.

especially because i have mad karaoke skills.

bdubs
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby bdubs » Sat Oct 23, 2010 10:20 am

When schools say that they are seeking diversity I would take them at their word. If their class statistics show few Asians relative to their representation in the US, then you might get a boost. I think it would be easier in places where it is difficult to attract Asian students to attend, so you would have to convincingly demonstrate that you are interested in the school.

Edit: This probably only applies to schools outside of the top tier. Most likely in areas with a smaller Asian population (i.e. South, maybe Midwest).
Last edited by bdubs on Sat Oct 23, 2010 11:59 am, edited 1 time in total.

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rayiner
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby rayiner » Sat Oct 23, 2010 11:01 am

Indians are overrepresented in law school, just by a lesser amount than east Asians. In the populous states (NY, VA, CA, IL, etc) Indians make up less than 2% of the population. In my section of 62 at NU, 5 people (8%) were Indian/Pakistani/etc.

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bk1
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby bk1 » Sat Oct 23, 2010 12:32 pm

burger lover wrote:let's face it. other than the possibility of a DS about adding mad karaoke skills to the school, i don't think that anyone considers asians "diverse" anymore.

fair? probably not.

especially because i have mad karaoke skills.


You do realize that 3/4 or more almost every law school is white?

bdubs
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby bdubs » Sat Oct 23, 2010 12:45 pm

bk1 wrote:
burger lover wrote:let's face it. other than the possibility of a DS about adding mad karaoke skills to the school, i don't think that anyone considers asians "diverse" anymore.

fair? probably not.

especially because i have mad karaoke skills.


You do realize that 3/4 or more almost every law school is white?


You do realize that a bit more than 3/4 of the US population is white, right?

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Borhas
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby Borhas » Sat Oct 23, 2010 12:47 pm

Asians are overrepresented they get a boost down

justadude55
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby justadude55 » Sat Oct 23, 2010 12:49 pm

Borhas wrote:Asians are overrepresented they get a boost down

i don't think it works like that. i'm pretty sure that with all non-minorities, it's all #'s.

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bk1
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby bk1 » Sat Oct 23, 2010 12:51 pm

bdubs wrote:You do realize that a bit more than 3/4 of the US population is white, right?


That's false.

bdubs
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby bdubs » Sat Oct 23, 2010 1:01 pm

bk1 wrote:
bdubs wrote:You do realize that a bit more than 3/4 of the US population is white, right?


That's false.


White is 77.1%, without Hispanics it is 69% both are close enough to 3/4 of the population that it is appropriate to expect at least 75% enrollment at LS to be counted as white.

http://censtats.census.gov/data/US/01000.pdf

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bk1
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby bk1 » Sat Oct 23, 2010 1:05 pm

bdubs wrote:White is 77.1%, without Hispanics it is 69% both are close enough to 3/4 of the population that it is appropriate to expect at least 75% enrollment at LS to be counted as white.

http://censtats.census.gov/data/US/01000.pdf


You do realize there is a difference between saying "around" and saying "a bit more," right?

Being an ass aside, all I meant to say to you was that 1/4 of law schools are minorities whereas more than 1/4 (almost 1/3) of the US pop are minorities. What I meant to say to the other poster was that when 2/3, or 3/4 or whatever, of a school is white, it is a pretty retarded statement to not call Asians, or any minority for that matter, diverse.

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MoS
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby MoS » Sat Oct 23, 2010 1:08 pm

If you find a school that doesn't have an asian population, maybe. But good luck with that.

bdubs
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby bdubs » Sat Oct 23, 2010 1:26 pm

bk1 wrote:
bdubs wrote:White is 77.1%, without Hispanics it is 69% both are close enough to 3/4 of the population that it is appropriate to expect at least 75% enrollment at LS to be counted as white.

http://censtats.census.gov/data/US/01000.pdf


You do realize there is a difference between saying "around" and saying "a bit more," right?

Being an ass aside, all I meant to say to you was that 1/4 of law schools are minorities whereas more than 1/4 (almost 1/3) of the US pop are minorities. What I meant to say to the other poster was that when 2/3, or 3/4 or whatever, of a school is white, it is a pretty retarded statement to not call Asians, or any minority for that matter, diverse.


Last I checked 77.1% is a bit more than 75%, just sayin.

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bk1
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby bk1 » Sat Oct 23, 2010 1:28 pm

bdubs wrote:Last I checked 77.1% is a bit more than 75%, just sayin.


When I said white I meant to imply only white, but yes I get your point and we are arguing for no reason. :P

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kalvano
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby kalvano » Sat Oct 23, 2010 6:06 pm

justadude55 wrote:
Borhas wrote:Asians are overrepresented they get a boost down

i don't think it works like that. i'm pretty sure that with all non-minorities, it's all #'s.



This made me lulz.

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burger lover
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby burger lover » Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:28 am

bdubs wrote:
bk1 wrote:
burger lover wrote:let's face it. other than the possibility of a DS about adding mad karaoke skills to the school, i don't think that anyone considers asians "diverse" anymore.

fair? probably not.

especially because i have mad karaoke skills.


You do realize that 3/4 or more almost every law school is white?


You do realize that a bit more than 3/4 of the US population is white, right?


all numbers aside, there is no question that asians bring diversity to any school~ even the ones at which they are "overrepresented". i think the OP brought up a valid point that is often overlooked, namely that "Asian-Pacific Islanders" is a broad and diverse umbrella that deserves more attention than it usually gets.

when i said that asians aren't diverse, i was referring strictly to the context of education and admissions.
to be honest, a discussion of URM does leave asian students out in the cold.
i don't agree with that or how it, by implication, diminishes the significance of the immigrant experience, but what can you do? asians just don't get a boost anymore.

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Na_Swatch
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby Na_Swatch » Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:33 am

Hey I'm just thankful asians don't get the negative effect that is present in UG admissions.

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burger lover
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby burger lover » Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:36 am

Na_Swatch wrote:Hey I'm just thankful asians don't get the negative effect that is present in UG admissions.


+1

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Helmholtz
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby Helmholtz » Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:43 am

I have heard asians get a boost at howard. Don't know how true that it is.

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dcman06
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby dcman06 » Mon Oct 25, 2010 8:35 pm

Depends on Ancestry. The Asian American groups known for being high achievers, such as Korean, Chinese, and Indians, are likely to get docked points for AA reasons. These three groups alone should account for most Asian Americans in a law school. Other Asian American groups will be given preference, but probably not as much as Blacks (esp. Black men) and Hispanics. Filipinos, Thai, Vietnamese, Pakistanis, Cambodians and Hmong should fare better off with the same stats as a Korean, Chinese, or Indian. Japanese people I'll say are in between both of these groups.

Some law schools will actively want more Asian Americans than others, in particular Southern schools not in T-14 (no Duke, no UVA for example), and schools in the central part of the country.

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DoubleChecks
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby DoubleChecks » Mon Oct 25, 2010 10:31 pm

dcman06 wrote:Depends on Ancestry. The Asian American groups known for being high achievers, such as Korean, Chinese, and Indians, are likely to get docked points for AA reasons. These three groups alone should account for most Asian Americans in a law school. Other Asian American groups will be given preference, but probably not as much as Blacks (esp. Black men) and Hispanics. Filipinos, Thai, Vietnamese, Pakistanis, Cambodians and Hmong should fare better off with the same stats as a Korean, Chinese, or Indian. Japanese people I'll say are in between both of these groups.

Some law schools will actively want more Asian Americans than others, in particular Southern schools not in T-14 (no Duke, no UVA for example), and schools in the central part of the country.


I havent read anything that points to the fact that Koreans, Chinese, and Indians get DOCKED points at law schools. Undergrad, prob. But I dont know about law schools, or at least I havent seen the data on that. And other Asian groups will be given preference but "probably" not as much as Black men and Hispanics? lol more like definitely.

And though I don't know the current state of Japanese Americans in US higher education, it's interesting you put them in between the 2 groups as they used to be the highest achieving Asians in America.

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Na_Swatch
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Re: Do Asians, even though they're not URMs, get a boost?

Postby Na_Swatch » Mon Oct 25, 2010 10:39 pm

dcman06 wrote:Depends on Ancestry. The Asian American groups known for being high achievers, such as Korean, Chinese, and Indians, are likely to get docked points for AA reasons. These three groups alone should account for most Asian Americans in a law school. Other Asian American groups will be given preference, but probably not as much as Blacks (esp. Black men) and Hispanics. Filipinos, Thai, Vietnamese, Pakistanis, Cambodians and Hmong should fare better off with the same stats as a Korean, Chinese, or Indian. Japanese people I'll say are in between both of these groups.

Some law schools will actively want more Asian Americans than others, in particular Southern schools not in T-14 (no Duke, no UVA for example), and schools in the central part of the country.


There isn't any strong evidence for Asian's being docked points in LS admissions... Also no evidence supporting the fact that Thai, Vietnamese, etc. get higher consideration. On the margins though (i.e. almost exactly the same applicants with just these differences) it might be plausible.




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