Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

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legal-eagle
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby legal-eagle » Sun Feb 23, 2014 7:26 pm

Anyone know anything about Rutgers Newark International Human Rights clinic? i received a full scholarship and most likely will be attending there in the Fall but haven't been able to find much besides the small section that they post on their site.

Do students that participate in these kinds of clinics do this during the year or can we wait until the summer? if its during the year, is there credit offered?

That might be a dumb question but i'm not sure how clinics work in law school lol i saw a bunch being offered at Rutgers


thanks in advance

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BlueLotus
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby BlueLotus » Sun Feb 23, 2014 7:33 pm

legal-eagle wrote:Anyone know anything about Rutgers Newark International Human Rights clinic? i received a full scholarship and most likely will be attending there in the Fall but haven't been able to find much besides the small section that they post on their site.

Do students that participate in these kinds of clinics do this during the year or can we wait until the summer? if its during the year, is there credit offered?

That might be a dumb question but i'm not sure how clinics work in law school lol i saw a bunch being offered at Rutgers


thanks in advance


Ignore the fancy sounding "international" clinics and summer programs that TT/TTT/TTTT schools hawk. I reckon you'd be highly unlikely to land a FTLT position in "international law" coming from RU-N (unless you have some crazy good connections). That's not my elitism, but just a reflection of the fact the IHR is a very elitist field when it comes to hiring decisions. RU-N for free would be a good choice if you're cool with working for the NJ Public Defender, or something like that.

legal-eagle
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby legal-eagle » Sun Feb 23, 2014 7:38 pm

BlueLotus wrote:
legal-eagle wrote:Anyone know anything about Rutgers Newark International Human Rights clinic? i received a full scholarship and most likely will be attending there in the Fall but haven't been able to find much besides the small section that they post on their site.

Do students that participate in these kinds of clinics do this during the year or can we wait until the summer? if its during the year, is there credit offered?

That might be a dumb question but i'm not sure how clinics work in law school lol i saw a bunch being offered at Rutgers


thanks in advance


Ignore the fancy sounding "international" clinics and summer programs that TT/TTT/TTTT schools hawk. I reckon you'd be highly unlikely to land a FTLT position in "international law" coming from RU-N (unless you have some crazy good connections). That's not my elitism, but just a reflection of the fact the IHR is a very elitist field when it comes to hiring decisions. RU-N for free would be a good choice if you're cool with working for the NJ Public Defender, or something like that.




That makes sense actually a few lawyers i know told me the same thing about the international law category in general. i may look into environmental/animal rights instead.. i feel like that category is neglected in comparison. thanks for the honest response! NJ public defender doesn't sound bad either =)

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sublime
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby sublime » Sun Feb 23, 2014 7:42 pm

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Last edited by sublime on Sun Feb 23, 2014 7:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Jchance
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby Jchance » Sun Feb 23, 2014 7:55 pm

worldtraveler wrote:And anyone wanting to do more work with international governments or human rights policy needs to check out the Fulbright Clinton Fellowship. It's shockingly not very competitive for some of the countries.


Can you expand on what qualifications are "shockingly not very competitive"?

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worldtraveler
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby worldtraveler » Sun Feb 23, 2014 8:04 pm

legal-eagle wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:
legal-eagle wrote:Anyone know anything about Rutgers Newark International Human Rights clinic? i received a full scholarship and most likely will be attending there in the Fall but haven't been able to find much besides the small section that they post on their site.

Do students that participate in these kinds of clinics do this during the year or can we wait until the summer? if its during the year, is there credit offered?

That might be a dumb question but i'm not sure how clinics work in law school lol i saw a bunch being offered at Rutgers


thanks in advance


Ignore the fancy sounding "international" clinics and summer programs that TT/TTT/TTTT schools hawk. I reckon you'd be highly unlikely to land a FTLT position in "international law" coming from RU-N (unless you have some crazy good connections). That's not my elitism, but just a reflection of the fact the IHR is a very elitist field when it comes to hiring decisions. RU-N for free would be a good choice if you're cool with working for the NJ Public Defender, or something like that.




That makes sense actually a few lawyers i know told me the same thing about the international law category in general. i may look into environmental/animal rights instead.. i feel like that category is neglected in comparison. thanks for the honest response! NJ public defender doesn't sound bad either =)


I have never met anyone in the IHR field who went to Rutgers. But if you're going for free and are also interested in domestic PI opportunities, it's not a bad plan. Clinics should be during the year. And regardless of career prospects, clinics can be great training experiences.

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worldtraveler
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby worldtraveler » Sun Feb 23, 2014 8:04 pm

Jchance wrote:
worldtraveler wrote:And anyone wanting to do more work with international governments or human rights policy needs to check out the Fulbright Clinton Fellowship. It's shockingly not very competitive for some of the countries.


Can you expand on what qualifications are "shockingly not very competitive"?


Look into the program. Some of the countries have really high acceptance rates and few applications.

quijotesca1011
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby quijotesca1011 » Sat Mar 08, 2014 11:01 pm

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Last edited by quijotesca1011 on Mon Apr 28, 2014 7:06 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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spleenworship
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby spleenworship » Sat Mar 08, 2014 11:06 pm

Tagging for later reading and possible questioning.

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worldtraveler
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby worldtraveler » Sun Mar 09, 2014 12:42 am

quijotesca1011 wrote:Checking in...

Very strong interest in international human rights law, specifically in an NGO (e.g., HRW, Human Rights First, etc.) or international organization (UN, ICDH) in the Americas (have language expertise and professional experience in the region).

Accepted: Harvard, NYU, Georgetown (withdrew)
Held: Columbia (withdrew)
Pending: Yale

Leaning towards Harvard (strong preference for personal reasons), unless there is a strongly compelling professional reason to wait for Yale's response (pretty sure it will be negative anyway) -- I know that for clerkships Yale is considered king, but I'm wondering for other prestigious PI whether there is a significant difference between H & Y?

A little nervous about the prospect of taking on significant loans (will be applying for financial aid but expecting mostly loans) but reading about LRAPs/LIPPs is making that seem more bearable. I'm pretty positive I will never be switching away from public service (I know everyone says 'you never know', but I'm really as positive as you can get, and already have professional experience in the field that has confirmed that it's where I want to be) so those programs are pretty appealing (especially because I really don't mind paying off more of my loans if I can - e.g., if my salary goes up, I don't mind at all paying off more of them -- it's just a matter of making sure that I will be capable of paying them off and covering living expenses, so having them be proportional to my income seems like a lifesaver)...


1. Are you completely fluent in Spanish and Portuguese? Spanish is an absolute necessity and Portuguese would be a huge help. The Americas are unfortunately one of the more competitive regions for area experts (unless you have an expertise on the Caribbean; don't know why that gets so neglected). Some of this is because those countries have good law schools and produce plenty of their own int'l lawyers.

2. Yale is absolutely worth waiting for. Their postgraduate PI opportunities are really unparalleled. To be quite honest if you know you want this field, do not turn down Yale.

3. Look into all the threads about PSLF/LRAP possibly changing and make your decision wisely.

texas4ever
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby texas4ever » Sun Mar 09, 2014 3:25 pm

BlueLotus wrote:Anyone here do a Boren Fellowship? Thinking of doing one for Hindi.


Yes, I did one. It can be useful in a job interview, but really only if you learned to read law in the language you're studying, and only if your research project matches a particular need in the government office you apply to. Learning to read law in my target language was extremely difficult, though I managed it.

That said, I think it's a really great experience, and I wouldn't trade it for anything.

quijotesca1011
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby quijotesca1011 » Mon Mar 10, 2014 12:49 am

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Last edited by quijotesca1011 on Mon Apr 28, 2014 7:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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whippersnappery
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby whippersnappery » Thu Mar 13, 2014 4:54 pm

worldtraveler wrote:2. Yale is absolutely worth waiting for. Their postgraduate PI opportunities are really unparalleled. To be quite honest if you know you want this field, do not turn down Yale.
.


Interesting. Do you think this is the case for any other schools (H/S/NYU come to mind)? I know the usual advice is that for any PI work, take the money and run, even if it's a lower-ranked school.

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BlueLotus
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby BlueLotus » Tue Apr 08, 2014 8:51 pm

spleenworship wrote:Tagging for later reading and possible questioning.


Didn't know you were interested in IHR too!

I believe in Spleen. :wink:

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spleenworship
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby spleenworship » Tue Apr 08, 2014 9:03 pm

BlueLotus wrote:
spleenworship wrote:Tagging for later reading and possible questioning.


Didn't know you were interested in IHR too!

I believe in Spleen. :wink:


I doubt I'm competitive, but you never know. It might happen someday of I'm educated on the subject and aware of the opportunities.

quijotesca1011
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby quijotesca1011 » Wed May 21, 2014 11:47 pm

Hi all, following up to earlier discussions of joint degrees. Thanks WT, your pro/con list was very useful.

I was wondering what the comparison would be between pursuing:

- a joint MPP at a US school (thinking HKS since I'll be at HLS; obviously would have to apply and that's a significant road ahead, but just for curiosity's sad)

- a LLM later on at a foreign university (possibly France or Geneva to cement language skills at the same time; if not in Latin America since that's my region of interest) later on in my career

In terms of, is one more respected or useful in the IHR field?

Another question (I'm sorry, it may be stupid). Boren and FLAS have been mentioned a few times in these threads. What would that look like in conjunction with law school ? do a summer language institute in conjunction with an internship abroad (I assume you wouldn't want to forgo a summer internship to do just language study one summer?) Or using a boren fellowship to study abroad?

Thanks as always!

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Pragmatic Gun
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby Pragmatic Gun » Thu May 22, 2014 3:09 pm

Hey d00ds, I'm so glad I found this thread. I'm reapplying next year, as this cycle I really undersold myself.

I'm interested in pursuing IHR work surrounding the ICC and international criminal tribunals. I know of one, the CICC, which has a legal internship. Other than that, I'm not sure which ones work directly with the ICC.

So from I gathered in this thread, I would have to go to a T14 to have a shot at this. Other than Yale, what's a well-regarded law school among the IHR crowd?

I appreciate any information or a reality check. Those are always welcome!

TIA.

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worldtraveler
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby worldtraveler » Thu May 22, 2014 7:53 pm

Pragmatic Gun wrote:Hey d00ds, I'm so glad I found this thread. I'm reapplying next year, as this cycle I really undersold myself.

I'm interested in pursuing IHR work surrounding the ICC and international criminal tribunals. I know of one, the CICC, which has a legal internship. Other than that, I'm not sure which ones work directly with the ICC.

So from I gathered in this thread, I would have to go to a T14 to have a shot at this. Other than Yale, what's a well-regarded law school among the IHR crowd?

I appreciate any information or a reality check. Those are always welcome!

TIA.


I think I've said this to you in other threads, but a T14 doesn't even cut it.

You need HYSCCNB, probably euro citizenship, french, experience as an attorney, and insane connections. Internships are easy to get, but that isn't going to help you that much.

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worldtraveler
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby worldtraveler » Thu May 22, 2014 7:55 pm

quijotesca1011 wrote:Hi all, following up to earlier discussions of joint degrees. Thanks WT, your pro/con list was very useful.

I was wondering what the comparison would be between pursuing:

- a joint MPP at a US school (thinking HKS since I'll be at HLS; obviously would have to apply and that's a significant road ahead, but just for curiosity's sad)

- a LLM later on at a foreign university (possibly France or Geneva to cement language skills at the same time; if not in Latin America since that's my region of interest) later on in my career

In terms of, is one more respected or useful in the IHR field?

Another question (I'm sorry, it may be stupid). Boren and FLAS have been mentioned a few times in these threads. What would that look like in conjunction with law school ? do a summer language institute in conjunction with an internship abroad (I assume you wouldn't want to forgo a summer internship to do just language study one summer?) Or using a boren fellowship to study abroad?

Thanks as always!


you can use FLAS during the school year so long as your school lets law students apply

I don't see why you're comparing the LLM with the joint degree. It's not like they're mutually exclusive.

A joint degree all just depends on the cost, your interests, etc. There isn't a set rule of whether it's a good idea or not.

quijotesca1011
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby quijotesca1011 » Thu May 22, 2014 8:09 pm

worldtraveler wrote:
you can use FLAS during the school year so long as your school lets law students apply

I don't see why you're comparing the LLM with the joint degree. It's not like they're mutually exclusive.

A joint degree all just depends on the cost, your interests, etc. There isn't a set rule of whether it's a good idea or not.


Ah okay I didn't really understand how the FLAS works for grad students . Now I looked up more info.

I know they aren't mutually exclusive, I just figure I can't spend endless amounts of money on education and/or as much as I love being in school I can't do that forever. So I've been trying to figure out if there's a preference for one or the other in the field or if one serves you if you want to focus on X or the other if you want to focus on Y (because I would have to start the process of applying for the join degree soon, and part of deciding whether I wanted to do so was weighing whether I want to pursue additional education now or late until later in my career and pursue a LLM). but it's fine I'll talk about it more in depth with advisors and people who know me personally.

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observationalist
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby observationalist » Tue Aug 12, 2014 2:01 pm

Bumping thread, have spent four years in Latin America (Chile) after taking the bar exam teaching law, working for environmental NGOs and putting together a network of attorneys in my adopted country to focus more on public interest enviro law (vs traditional biglaw trajectory, which also exists in Chile). I'm in a niche area but if anyone's out there with questions I'm game.

Also part of the LST team, and our newest board member Mike Spivey is putting together a fundraiser to raise $10k in case anyone out there can help: https://fundrazr.com/campaigns/1p3lb/ab/e3Z2ff

lurkerrr
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby lurkerrr » Tue Aug 19, 2014 7:41 am

Thank you! One question: I'd like to work for international organizations, especially ones like HRW, UN, etc. I'm considering among GTown, Michigan, Northwestern. GTown obviously has great internship or externship opportunities in IHR area, Michigan has nice international law faculty as well (plus I really really really want to spend my three years in Ann Arbor, UM, that's something I should consider), Northwestern has this JD-LLM in IHR, David Scheffer is there, that's something! so among all, which one do you recommend more? thanks again!

Lacoste
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby Lacoste » Wed Aug 20, 2014 2:28 pm

This field seems like its competitive, real competitive. How does a student find a job after college because he is not only competing with fellow IHR graduates, but also with students who have received Master's degrees in an IR field?

What I've gathered is that schools in the T10 are ideal if you want to make it in this field, but I am still concerned about job placement. Any insights?

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worldtraveler
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby worldtraveler » Thu Aug 21, 2014 8:28 am

lurkerrr wrote:Thank you! One question: I'd like to work for international organizations, especially ones like HRW, UN, etc. I'm considering among GTown, Michigan, Northwestern. GTown obviously has great internship or externship opportunities in IHR area, Michigan has nice international law faculty as well (plus I really really really want to spend my three years in Ann Arbor, UM, that's something I should consider), Northwestern has this JD-LLM in IHR, David Scheffer is there, that's something! so among all, which one do you recommend more? thanks again![/quote

I take it you haven't applied yet? Apply and see what your options are, then worry about this stuff. Pointless to fall in love with a school if you can't get in anyway.

Lacoste wrote:This field seems like its competitive, real competitive. How does a student find a job after college because he is not only competing with fellow IHR graduates, but also with students who have received Master's degrees in an IR field?

What I've gathered is that schools in the T10 are ideal if you want to make it in this field, but I am still concerned about job placement. Any insights?


A job after college or after law school? After college most people end up in admin roles if they get a job with an NGO at all. Otherwise, that's why Peace Corps, Princeton in Africa/Asia, Fulbright, etc are good options.

For your second question, look through the thread for a lot of advice.

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girlmonster
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Re: Thread for people wanting to do international human rights

Postby girlmonster » Mon Aug 25, 2014 8:01 pm

If I'm mostly interested in working in advocacy for an NGO, what specific skills should I try to develop during law school? I know you posted a lot on general things we should do, but how do these skills differ (it at all) from the skills and experience one should focus on for litigation or direct client services work? Also, what do you think the biggest differences are between advocacy and litigation for human rights?

Thanks, worldtraveler!




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