UGa vs. WUStL vs. GMU Forum

[Attorney]

EDIT: Apparently it is not possible to delete topics. Don't bother reading this thread, as new options have opened up. Georgia offered a scholarship a few days after this post (I spoke too soon) and Indiana accepted with the MOAS (Mother Of All Scholarships). See you in Bloomington!
Which one?

FINANCES
Georgia comes out the cheapest even though I'm in-state at George Mason. Georgia Law is keen to point out that some 80% of non-residents become residents for 2L and 3L. I estimate the total cost of attendance to be $90k at Georgia, $120k at George Mason, and $155k at Washington in St. Louis. I probably won't get a scholarship anywhere, because my work experience falsely identifies me as Ri¢hie Ri¢h.

MARKETS
I prefer DC to Chicago to Atlanta. It's probably not a deal-breaking preference though, because DC is so damn expensive.

RANKINGS
As everyone here already knows: WUStL is top 20, Georgia is top 30, Mason is top 40.

[fatduck]

i don't think i would pay sticker at any of those schools. if i had to choose i would choose georgia.

[MrPapagiorgio]

I say Georgia only because WUSTL is rarely worth sticker, and George Mason for employment in the DC market is gonna be tough. Ultimately, I don't think any of the three with your specific considerations are good choices.

[Sandro]

you sure COA at UGA is only 90k ? their COA figure for instate is like 31k from last year, plus you would be paying 15k+ tuition 1L as OOS.

[Attorney]

you sure COA at UGA is only 90k ? their COA figure for instate is like 31k from last year, plus you would be paying 15k+ tuition 1L as OOS.

I should have made more clear that these are my figures instead of theirs. Based on what I can find for apartments, and how I don't eat but a few times a week, and so forth. Schools hugely overstate the cost of living versus what it actually costs me to live in real life.

i don't think i would pay sticker at any of those schools. if i had to choose i would choose georgia.

No one really pays "sticker" at UGa, since in-state is <$15k and everyone is in-state for a majority of their time spent there. I wouldn't consider in-state to be "sticker" at Mason either... it's only $22k a year. Basically it's like a $60,000 scholarship at Mason for being in-state (versus a similarly ranked private school) and even more at Georgia whether one is in-state or not. So what I'm saying I guess is that no one pays OOS sticker at Georgia and as a VA resident I wouldn't at Mason either.

George Mason for employment in the DC market is gonna be tough

I suppose I'll have to see how well Mason grads did in the Great Recession. As of when the economy was still in-tact, GMU Law grades made a reported* median of $150,000 starting most years and virtually all of them were going into the DC market. Speaking of which, your sentence above was kinda strange... nearly all GMU grads go into the DC market, so what you really meant was "George Mason for employment is gonna be tough". Ha? Oh, ye TLS and your "only T14s get employed" mantra.

*We all know reported medians are a bit higher than actual medians, however.

[CanadianWolf]

In-state at Georgia is about $15,000, maybe a bit less.

[fatduck]

i should have clarified that by 'sticker' i meant 'the prices you listed for those schools'

[Attorney]

i should have clarified that by 'sticker' i meant 'the prices you listed for those schools'

Any T1 school is worth even $45,000 a year versus not attending law school at all (to me and lots of other people, say those working at McDonald's on the night shift). To say T1s aren't worth half that, to the vast majority of people anyway, is ignorant at best. I guess mathematically you'd be assuming that everyone could make say $80,000 or $100,000 a year easily without law school, in which case I would agree with you from a purely economic standpoint. But I am currently working as a volunteer greeter at Wal-Mart. Not only do they not pay me, but I had to shell out $12 for the blue vest/uniform.

[fatduck]

i should have clarified that by 'sticker' i meant 'the prices you listed for those schools'

Any T1 school is worth even $45,000 a year versus not attending law school at all (to me and lots of other people, say those working at McDonald's on the night shift). To say T1s aren't worth half that, to the vast majority of people anyway, is ignorant at best. I guess mathematically you'd be assuming that everyone could make say $80,000 or $100,000 a year easily without law school, in which case I would agree with you from a purely economic standpoint. But I am currently working as a volunteer greeter at Wal-Mart. Not only do they not pay me, but I had to shell out $12 for the blue vest/uniform.

wouldn't it be so much more fun with 100k in debt?

i didn't mean to imply that no one should go to any of those schools, or that it's necessarily a bad decision. i just think it's pretty risky. too risky for me, maybe not too risky for you. if you aren't concerned with the debt i would go to wustl (your ceiling will be higher). georgia would be the safest option.

[Attorney]

wouldn't it be so much more fun with 100k in debt?

i didn't mean to imply that no one should go to any of those schools, or that it's necessarily a bad decision. i just think it's pretty risky. too risky for me, maybe not too risky for you. if you aren't concerned with the debt i would go to wustl (your ceiling will be higher). georgia would be the safest option.

I'm not a risk-lover myself really. Not anymore. So I think you are helping to convince me that even if I am willing to take on the risk of law school (I am, as it's the only thing that interests me these days) that I may not be willing to take on the additional risk of the maximum debt load. Thanks for helping me process through it.

[MrPapagiorgio]

George Mason for employment in the DC market is gonna be tough

I suppose I'll have to see how well Mason grads did in the Great Recession. As of when the economy was still in-tact, GMU Law grades made a reported* median of $150,000 starting most years and virtually all of them were going into the DC market. Speaking of which, your sentence above was kinda strange... nearly all GMU grads go into the DC market, so what you really meant was "George Mason for employment is gonna be tough". Ha? Oh, ye TLS and your "only T14s get employed" mantra.

Check my history. I am not a "T14 or bust" guy, perhaps to a fault. And fine, if you want to go to the third-best school in a region that attracts students from at least 15 better schools (T14+GW), then go for it.

[Attorney]

George Mason for employment in the DC market is gonna be tough

I suppose I'll have to see how well Mason grads did in the Great Recession. As of when the economy was still in-tact, GMU Law grades made a reported* median of $150,000 starting most years and virtually all of them were going into the DC market. Speaking of which, your sentence above was kinda strange... nearly all GMU grads go into the DC market, so what you really meant was "George Mason for employment is gonna be tough". Ha? Oh, ye TLS and your "only T14s get employed" mantra.

Check my history. I am not a "T14 or bust" guy, perhaps to a fault. And fine, if you want to go to the third-best school in a region that attracts students from at least 15 better schools (T14+GW), then go for it.

This is so true for Big Law, but the Harvard/Columbia grads usually aren't going for the same jobs that Mason grads are. GMU has never placed well in Big Law yet the D.C. market is so broad and deep that GMU has always placed pretty well in fairly lucrative jobs in smaller law firms.

For instance, when the economy still existed, the reported stats here on TLS profiles show that Mason grads made a median of $150,000 (71% reporting) versus some similarly ranked schools like FSU, where the median was $67,500 (58% reporting). And while 2009 and 2010 stats were surely terrible at all these places, as of 2011 we are now back in an era of record corporate profits and an economy that is growing solidly. Legal jobs will be back, as will jobs in general (crossing my fingers).