UVA vs UT

(Rankings, Profiles, Tuition, Student Life, . . . )

Which one?

UVA (20k/yr) [total tuition cost: ~66k]
41
63%
UT (15k/yr + in state tuition discount) [total tuition cost: ~29]
24
37%
 
Total votes: 65

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Richie Tenenbaum
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UVA vs UT

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Tue Mar 30, 2010 3:31 pm

Updated:

UVA (20k/yr) vs UT (in state + 15k/yr).

Poll reset.
Last edited by Richie Tenenbaum on Fri Apr 02, 2010 12:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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mcflooter06
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby mcflooter06 » Tue Mar 30, 2010 3:38 pm

I had to make a similar decision. I got accepted to both UVA and UT, but I had a scholarship to UT, not UVA. UVA offers better national placement, as well as great clerking opportunities, from what I heard at the ASD. I chose Texas, because I plan on practicing in Texas. I also would love the opportunity to clerk, which is definitely still there at UT. If UT offers you money, I would say take it. If not, I think it really just comes down to personal preference, where you would rather spend 3 years of your life, and what you think is best for you.

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dgouzoul
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby dgouzoul » Tue Mar 30, 2010 3:40 pm

I am as much of a UVA troll as the next guy, but I think if you KNOW you want to work in Texas, UT is the choice here for you, especially if there is $ from UT

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Tue Mar 30, 2010 4:25 pm

dgouzoul wrote:I am as much of a UVA troll as the next guy, but I think if you KNOW you want to work in Texas, UT is the choice here for you, especially if there is $ from UT


You don't think UVA would give me as good of a shot (if not better) for Texas?

zanyventer
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby zanyventer » Tue Mar 30, 2010 4:30 pm

did you visit uva? i visited ut and was not impressed.

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jcunni5
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby jcunni5 » Tue Mar 30, 2010 4:32 pm

IMO go to UVA everyone at ut I s going for Texas law so it will b more competitive if u have ties to texas you'll better off goin to UVA which has good placement in Texas anyway and firms usually like a little diversity however either way you'll be fine and if ur SO loves Austin that might be a good enough reason

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Tue Mar 30, 2010 7:20 pm

Anyone have a good idea for how class rank matches up between the two for Texas?

Would top 30% at UT = top 40% at UVA? Bottom quarter at UT be around the same as bottom third at UVA? Or does UT rank really equal UVA's for firm prospects in Texas (or is actually better)?

Anyone have a good idea about class rank for competitive clerkships at either?

yournamehere
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby yournamehere » Wed Mar 31, 2010 1:53 am

there are 60 people up on the clerkship board at UT. that covers everything from COA clerks to Fed Magistrate Clerks. I think the class of 2010 is 400ish people, so you can do the math.

Esc
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby Esc » Wed Mar 31, 2010 2:14 am

I think both schools will do you really well. UVA probably has somewhat better clerkship/academia placement, but if you and your SO are interested in staying in Austin, I'd go with UT. UT essentially owns the Austin market (the local networking opportunities here are great). Austin is a very, very difficult market to crack, and if you want a decent shot at it, you pretty much either need to go to UT Law, have gone to UT undergrad, or have grown up here.

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Wed Mar 31, 2010 11:42 am

Esc wrote:I think both schools will do you really well. UVA probably has somewhat better clerkship/academia placement, but if you and your SO are interested in staying in Austin, I'd go with UT. UT essentially owns the Austin market (the local networking opportunities here are great). Austin is a very, very difficult market to crack, and if you want a decent shot at it, you pretty much either need to go to UT Law, have gone to UT undergrad, or have grown up here.


Yeah, I've seen some of the number breakdowns of some of the firms in Austin and UT simply dominates (and if not UT law, most all had UT undergrad). What are your thoughts on places outside of Austin? (DFW, Houston, etc)

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Wed Mar 31, 2010 6:25 pm

More thoughts?

showNprove
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby showNprove » Wed Mar 31, 2010 6:28 pm

Richie Tenenbaum wrote:More thoughts?

PM'ed you

Esc
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby Esc » Wed Mar 31, 2010 8:06 pm

Richie Tenenbaum wrote:
Esc wrote:I think both schools will do you really well. UVA probably has somewhat better clerkship/academia placement, but if you and your SO are interested in staying in Austin, I'd go with UT. UT essentially owns the Austin market (the local networking opportunities here are great). Austin is a very, very difficult market to crack, and if you want a decent shot at it, you pretty much either need to go to UT Law, have gone to UT undergrad, or have grown up here.


Yeah, I've seen some of the number breakdowns of some of the firms in Austin and UT simply dominates (and if not UT law, most all had UT undergrad). What are your thoughts on places outside of Austin? (DFW, Houston, etc)


Its hard to tell how UT does compared to UVA in the DFW or Houston markets. On the one hand, UVA grads are rarer and likely appeal more to a hiring partner than a similarly ranked UT grad. On the other hand, the UT alumni network is very strong in Texas, and there are a lot of networking opportunities, which is a big help. There are some judges who hire exclusively from UT, FWIW.

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Fri Apr 02, 2010 12:35 pm

UPDATE:

UVA (20k/yr) vs UT (in state plus 15k/yr)

Basic background info:
Strong ties to Texas and would most likely want to return
Would love a clerkship, esp. a circuit one, if grades allow that to be a possibility.
Ultimate dream is legal academia (though I recognize that as a long shot at either).

So just found out that Texas is offering 15k a year, making it a decent amount cheaper then UVA. Total tuition costs for each boil down to ~66k for UVA and ~29k for UT with cost of living being somewhat equivalent (Austin may be a little more expensive).

So far I have the breakdown as follows:

City-wise (for both during law school and after): UT
Clerkships: Slight advantage UVA?
Shot at Academia: UVA
Best school for getting a job in Texas: ???? I've heard UVA might stick out a little more in the sea of UT grads, but networking is of course going to be better at UT. Ultimately, I use to think UVA would be better, if only by a little bit; now i'm starting to think they are pretty much on par with one another?
Impressions after ASD: UVA

I loved the UVA ASD and was just so-so on the UT ASD. Should that be something that is strongly taken into consideration?

Is UVA worth the extra ~35k for the slight increase (or is it bigger than a slight increase?) in a shot at my dream job and greater degree portability in the future?

edit: Did not notice until now that I managed to get some need based grants from Texas as well, though it's not guaranteed since it's from the state itself. So it's close to ~45k now between the two (assuming the grant money doesn't disappear).
Last edited by Richie Tenenbaum on Fri Apr 02, 2010 5:57 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Esc
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby Esc » Fri Apr 02, 2010 3:45 pm

35k is a significant but not outcome-determinative difference. Each school has its pros and cons for your situation. I say if you felt more comfortable at UVA you should go for it.

yournamehere
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby yournamehere » Fri Apr 02, 2010 5:17 pm

i love the fact that you slipped outcome-determinative in there esc. woolley's getting inside your head!

270910
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby 270910 » Fri Apr 02, 2010 5:24 pm

UVA will do better at everything.

Something people with specific market goals often forget is that if you wind up in a class rank position where you're hosed for ANY job at the lower ranked school, you can still probably get SOMETHING from the higher ranked school.

Ex: median at UT? Thanks for playing, kid. median at UVA? You may or may not get Texas, but you'll have a fighting chance at NYC or other southern markets.

UVA places better in everything, there's no question about it. Go to UVA.

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vanwinkle
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby vanwinkle » Fri Apr 02, 2010 5:28 pm

Esc wrote:Its hard to tell how UT does compared to UVA in the DFW or Houston markets. On the one hand, UVA grads are rarer and likely appeal more to a hiring partner than a similarly ranked UT grad.

This part appears to be true. UVA does well placing into the Texas markets, especially those with Texas ties already. There are quite a few UT undergrads here who came to UVA with an eye on returning to Texas, and they seem to be doing fairly well for themselves.

I will say that, as a UT undergrad and a UVA 1L, I love both cities and would be torn in your shoes. I miss Austin, and would love the chance to live there again, but UVA is such a great school and the city of Charlottesville is also highly enjoyable, especially as a change of pace from an otherwise Texas-centric life.

If you want clerkships and academia, come to UVA. They're doing fairly well in that regard and are making efforts to establish themselves as a leader in the lower T14. They have a dedicated clerkship director who does nothing but help grads secure clerkships and summer internships with judges, and for those who show promise and are interested in academia the school will do everything it can to prepare you for that path.

Recognizing that they're somewhat limited possibilities (you need to do pretty well in law school here to have a shot at clerkships/academia when you graduate), I think that if those are things you want, you should definitely come to UVA. UVA is also likely to give you better chances in law firm placement in Texas, both because of their higher ranking/prestige and the relative rarity of UVA Law grads with Texas ties compared to UT grads. UVA will also give you options outside of Texas if you either change your mind or find it difficult to find work there when you graduate.

I think it's worth $35K, but this is a decision I doubt you could seriously go wrong with either way. UT-Austin for (relatively) cheap isn't a bad move at all, either. I think this is a wonderful choice you get to make, and while I encourage you to come here, I don't think I'd call it a "wrong" decision if you didn't.

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Sauer Grapes
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby Sauer Grapes » Fri Apr 02, 2010 5:29 pm

Did you negotiate for your UVA scholarship? How long did it take them to respond?

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catharsis
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby catharsis » Fri Apr 02, 2010 5:30 pm

im biased because i met you at UT's ASD.. i hope you choose UT lol. :wink:

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Fri Apr 02, 2010 5:56 pm

Just found out that I have some need-based grants from Texas as well that adds up to close to 15,000 total for the 3 years as well as discovering my totals were in a little off in going off of older UT tuition rates.

The difference is now looking to be around 45,000 instead of 35,000.

Sauer Grapes wrote:Did you negotiate for your UVA scholarship? How long did it take them to respond?


Didn't negotiate for it. It was actually the first scholarship offer of my cycle and received it when they sent out the emails to everyone about the financial aid breakdown on their first ASD.

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Fri Apr 02, 2010 5:59 pm

catharsis wrote:im biased because i met you at UT's ASD.. i hope you choose UT lol. :wink:


:D :D Thanks!

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RVP11
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby RVP11 » Fri Apr 02, 2010 6:05 pm

Richie Tenenbaum wrote:
dgouzoul wrote:I am as much of a UVA troll as the next guy, but I think if you KNOW you want to work in Texas, UT is the choice here for you, especially if there is $ from UT


You don't think UVA would give me as good of a shot (if not better) for Texas?


Do you have some real connection to Texas already? Are you a Texan?

UVA will beat UT, even in Texas. This depends on how much you're willing to pay for that. $45,000 might not be that much in the big picture.

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vanwinkle
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby vanwinkle » Fri Apr 02, 2010 6:07 pm

RVP11 wrote:Do you have some real connection to Texas already? Are you a Texan?

Richie Tenenbaum wrote:Basic background info:
Strong ties to Texas and would most likely want to return

Did you even read the thread?

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RVP11
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Re: UVA vs UT

Postby RVP11 » Fri Apr 02, 2010 6:09 pm

vanwinkle wrote:
RVP11 wrote:Do you have some real connection to Texas already? Are you a Texan?

Richie Tenenbaum wrote:Basic background info:
Strong ties to Texas and would most likely want to return

Did you even read the thread?


None of that appeared in the first post. I was responding to OP based on the thread title and the OP.

I passed over his expanded post because I usually coast by most people's advice in threads like this. It's often 0Ls spoonfeeding BS to the OP or posting responses that are definitely tl;dr-worthy.




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