Top Placing Classes (NLJ250 and Federal Clerkships) Forum

[jnorsky]

jesus, they are all top ten law schools, cant everyone just be happy

[legends159]

Yeah. Because none of it changes the fact that 1Ls at NYU have summer jobs at market-paying firms and 1Ls at UVA / Michigan are trying to get whatever midlaw / government thing they can find.

Har har.

Yes, the true benchmark of gauging legal hiring: number of 1L SAs making market.

and based on anecdotal evidence...

You guys HONESTLY think that UVa and Michigan place better than NYU into firms? REALLY?!

Maybe, maybe not. Unsure why it would come as a shock though unless USNWR is as meaningful to you as it is to hiring partners. At best I can only say, I don't know. If it's NYC firms then no. If it's outside of NYC firms, I'm not sure.

[Aberzombie1892]

OK, I'll stop blowing up this thread after this:

Does this graph confirm the existence of MID-LAW?

OR, did they just have to put a line between 50K and 160K to make the graph not look dumb?

Everyone does realize that this chart only has like 50% reporting, right?

It's written right near the graph at its original posting.

[miamiman]

jesus, they are all top ten law schools, cant everyone just be happy

Lol. That kind of a statement suggests you're new to these parts. Enjoy the ride.

[women'ssoccer]

OK, I'll stop blowing up this thread after this:

Does this graph confirm the existence of MID-LAW?

OR, did they just have to put a line between 50K and 160K to make the graph not look dumb?

Everyone does realize that this chart only has like 50% reporting, right?

It's written right near the graph at its original posting.

Gotcha. Mid-Law jobs are not that prevolent on the graph because those who have those jobs are also those who didn't report.

[awesomepossum]

Just a thought: NYC is still the largest legal market in the country. It's not going to stay screwed forever. UVA and Mich are awesome, but taking the long view, I don't see how CCN will continue to suffer like this when the market corrects itself.

Word to the uninformed: Chicago doesn't have a large proportion of their students going to NYC. For U of M students, New York is the largest destination.



Just messing with you.

[jnorsky]

jesus, they are all top ten law schools, cant everyone just be happy

Lol. That kind of a statement suggests you're new to these parts. Enjoy the ride.

haha, not new, but not on all the time. this place helped me a lot with my LS stuff, but dam, people like to argue about stupid shit.

[Kronk]

Maybe, maybe not. Unsure why it would come as a shock though unless USNWR is as meaningful to you as it is to hiring partners. At best I can only say, I don't know. If it's NYC firms then no. If it's outside of NYC firms, I'm not sure.

It has nothing to do with the USNWR rankings. It has to do with the fact that NYU is a better school with a better faculty and exists in the largest legal market--BY FAR--in the United States. The pure size of the NY market is enormous. Not to mention it is one of the top markets for UVa grads after D.C.

[jawsthegreat]

Maybe, maybe not. Unsure why it would come as a shock though unless USNWR is as meaningful to you as it is to hiring partners. At best I can only say, I don't know. If it's NYC firms then no. If it's outside of NYC firms, I'm not sure.

It has nothing to do with the USNWR rankings. It has to do with the fact that NYU is a better school with a better faculty and exists in the largest legal market--BY FAR--in the United States. The pure size of the NY market is enormous. Not to mention it is one of the top markets for UVa grads after D.C.

What does it even mean when people say this?

[Kronk]

Maybe, maybe not. Unsure why it would come as a shock though unless USNWR is as meaningful to you as it is to hiring partners. At best I can only say, I don't know. If it's NYC firms then no. If it's outside of NYC firms, I'm not sure.

It has nothing to do with the USNWR rankings. It has to do with the fact that NYU is a better school with a better faculty and exists in the largest legal market--BY FAR--in the United States. The pure size of the NY market is enormous. Not to mention it is one of the top markets for UVa grads after D.C.

What does it even mean when people say this?

A more prestigious faculty. Which in itself doesn't mean they are better teachers. But I'm pretty sure it'd help you get a job if Dworkin or Epstein called over for you or wrote you a letter of rec.

[postitnotes]

Just a thought: NYC is still the largest legal market in the country. It's not going to stay screwed forever. UVA and Mich are awesome, but taking the long view, I don't see how CCN will continue to suffer like this when the market corrects itself.

Word to the uninformed: Chicago doesn't have a large proportion of their students going to NYC. For U of M students, New York is the largest destination.



Just messing with you.

Right. U of M sends about twice as many people to NYC as it does to Chicago. Chicago and California are tied as the second most common destinations, and DC is up there too.

I think one issue about NYU placement outside of NYC is that it is a recently risen school. Current hiring partners and judges don't have the same impression of it as a "t-6" as "young" people do. And no, not all employers nor judges (I can't imagine them obsessing over USNews) look up current rankings.

[Reedie]

What does it even mean when people say this?

Citation analysis and reputation surveys are probable the best metric--though those measure scholarship and not teaching. Nobody gives a fuck about teaching though.

[RVP11]

Maybe, maybe not. Unsure why it would come as a shock though unless USNWR is as meaningful to you as it is to hiring partners. At best I can only say, I don't know. If it's NYC firms then no. If it's outside of NYC firms, I'm not sure.

It has nothing to do with the USNWR rankings. It has to do with the fact that NYU is a better school with a better faculty and exists in the largest legal market--BY FAR--in the United States. The pure size of the NY market is enormous. Not to mention it is one of the top markets for UVa grads after D.C.

What does it even mean when people say this?

A more prestigious faculty. Which in itself doesn't mean they are better teachers. But I'm pretty sure it'd help you get a job if Dworkin or Epstein called over for you or wrote you a letter of rec.

USNWR's lawyer/judge scores disagree with you. And I'd say that's a better barometer of what actual practicing attorneys think of your school than the number of times your professors are cited or how famous they are.

I don't think BigLaw employers care that much about prestigious faculty members. That prestigious faculty is mostly just impressive to other schools' faculties.

[awesomepossum]

Maybe, maybe not. Unsure why it would come as a shock though unless USNWR is as meaningful to you as it is to hiring partners. At best I can only say, I don't know. If it's NYC firms then no. If it's outside of NYC firms, I'm not sure.

It has nothing to do with the USNWR rankings. It has to do with the fact that NYU is a better school with a better faculty and exists in the largest legal market--BY FAR--in the United States. The pure size of the NY market is enormous. Not to mention it is one of the top markets for UVa grads after D.C.

What does it even mean when people say this?

A more prestigious faculty. Which in itself doesn't mean they are better teachers. But I'm pretty sure it'd help you get a job if Dworkin or Epstein called over for you or wrote you a letter of rec.

That people sit around thinking about what is more prestigious makes me throw up a little. It's not just my hangover.

[Kronk]

That people sit around thinking about what is more prestigious makes me throw up a little. It's not just my hangover.

Did you read the second part of my sentence, champ?

[RVP11]

Yes, NYU is better than UVA or Michigan because there's a larger chance Ronald Dworkin will help you get a job.

[awesomepossum]

That people sit around thinking about what is more prestigious makes me throw up a little. It's not just my hangover.

Did you read the second part of my sentence, champ?

....seconded only by people who use the word "champ."

[Rand M.]

This has all been wonderfully amusing but I'm still waiting for someone to bail out CCN.



'Cause right now, given this and other like threads, I'm starting to call into question everything tls has taught me about t6 > t10 > t14

+1. This feels like an episode of LOST where we have just found out that our lovable Kate is actually ...a convict. Are there really no explainers at work here?

[Kronk]

USNWR's lawyer/judge scores disagree with you.

But USNWR's peer rep scores put NYU ahead. http://money-law.blogspot.com/2009/07/z ... n-law.html.

Also, Leiter's rankings put NYU way ahead: http://www.leiterrankings.com/faculty/2 ... pact.shtml

and

http://www.leiterrankings.com/faculty/2 ... ship.shtml


UVA is not known for it's faculty.

[Kronk]

....seconded only by people who use the word "champ."

It was meant to patronize you. It worked. hth

[09042014]

NYU will beat a UVa or UM student inside NYC outside they are pretty much peers.

[Reedie]

Yes, NYU is better than UVA or Michigan because there's a larger chance Ronald Dworkin will help you get a job.

Heh. If you want to get an academic job in law and phil it probably would be a big plus. Nobody hires virginia grads because they all know y'all just play softball all day. It's essentially just the most expensive softball league in the country.

[postitnotes]

Is anyone else surprised by Boalt's or U Penn's placement?

And honestly, I think Duke is very underrated given its bad rap on TLS. Duke > Boalt and Penn? Thoughts?

[Rand M.]

NYU will beat a UVa or UM student inside NYC outside they are pretty much peers.

I buy this. How about Columbia and Chicago outside of NY and Chicago?

[Kronk]

NYU will beat a UVa or UM student inside NYC outside they are pretty much peers.

Agreed. Unfortunately for UM and UVa a huge concentration of NLJ250 firms are in NYC (same with PI jobs). Also unfortunate for Mich and UVa is that NYC is Michigan's top market and UVa's second. Homecourt advantage, NYU.