Top Law Schools

Ok, so here's the deal.

I'm a senior at a top 15 school (transferred from a state school... my degree GPA is more than .2 better than at my previous school and I have a fairly significant upward trend). I'm currently interviewing for jobs - if I get a good offer, I'm not going to law school (maybe a JD/MBA a couple of years down the line). If I don't get an offer, I'm planning on going to law school. The question then is which schools I should apply to. Assume mediocre/average PS and activities. I'm going to include an addendum that basically says I was practicing 175+ before June and choked on the real thing.

Impossibilities (might apply only to have no regrets)
HLS
Stanford

Reaches
Columbia
Chicago
Boalt
Northwestern

Targets
Penn
Michigan
UVA (fee waiver)
Duke
Cornell

Safety
UCLA (fee waiver)
Vandy
UT - Austin


-I'm a big splitter for Boalt (under 25th GPA over 75th LSAT)... Do I have any real chance with how GPA-focused they are?
-UChicago is my top choice (and I may retake in December if I don't get a job in order to try to lock up Chicago and Columbia)... should I ED there?
-Duke claims to average scores... will they take an 8 point difference into account? How are my chances there?

Will I get $$$ at any of the schools above? (Michigan? Cornell?)



Thanks.

We have almost identical stats, so I'm gonna take a stab at this.

You're in at all safeties and targets except maybe WL at Virginia (unless you're in-state).

WL/Out at Columbia, WL/in at Chicago. Out at Northwestern and Boalt.

Sorry if it sounds pessimistic (these are my stats too) and good luck!

I think that sounds about right but I don't know that much. Anyone else wanna take a shot?

Will I most likely get into Penn or is it a toss-up?

chicago is a tossup i think.

worth re-taking, then?

i figured i would walk in to the test and try to kill it. if i feel at all that i've messed up, i would just cancel and walk out and that would be it.

My guess is that it will be more beneficial for you to apply early than to re-take when you're not 100% sure you'll do better and wait until January to send in applications.

I suppose that makes sense. So would it be best to just ahead and ED at my top choice?


Anyone have any insight on my odds at Penn or if I'll get some $ at Mich or Cornell?

Fee wavier from UVA! woohoo that's $75 less I'll be spending.

boilercat wrote:Fee wavier from UVA! woohoo that's $75 less I'll be spending.

Yeah I got that today as well and though the same thing, especially since I'm considering EDing there.

bump? Chances at Penn and Chicago ED?

Money from Mich?

boilercat wrote:I'm going to include an addendum that basically says I was practicing 175+ before June and choked on the real thing.

I wouldn't do this, personally. I know it sucks not to hit your practice score, but most people don't, and I think this will just come across as whining unless there was some good reason you choked.

Chichaca wrote:

boilercat wrote:I'm going to include an addendum that basically says I was practicing 175+ before June and choked on the real thing.

I wouldn't do this, personally. I know it sucks not to hit your practice score, but most people don't, and I think this will just come across as whining unless there was some good reason you choked.

agreed. why would admissions officers view this as something positive, especially when you've already taken the exam twice and didn't hit your reported practice score on either test? i think you let the score increase (which is quite high) speak for itself

patrickchillis wrote:

Chichaca wrote:

boilercat wrote:I'm going to include an addendum that basically says I was practicing 175+ before June and choked on the real thing.

I wouldn't do this, personally. I know it sucks not to hit your practice score, but most people don't, and I think this will just come across as whining unless there was some good reason you choked.

agreed. why would admissions officers view this as something positive, especially when you've already taken the exam twice and didn't hit your reported practice score on either test? i think you let the score increase (which is quite high) speak for itself

Was going to mention this, until I saw you two had already gotten to it! Agreed, an "I choked" addendum probably isn't a good idea.

Also, I wouldn't waste the money on Northwestern since you don't have any WE. You should be in at your targets/safeties, and maybe some really good "Why X?" essays would help you out a little bit at the reaches?

With crazy-similar stats to yours (3.69 and 163-->171), I am still developing my strategy (since I won't be applying till next year), but my most likely course of action right now seems to be an ED at Chicago (my first choice as well). Best of luck to you!

Impossibilities
Yale
Harvard
Stanford

Reaches
Columbia
Boalt, Penn, Virginia (all love high GPAs)
Northwestern (loves W/E)

Matches
Chicago
NYU
Michigan (would be safety except for YP)

Safeties
Duke
Cornell
UCLA
Vandy
UT - Austin

IMO you should be a lock at Chicago ED.

I'm hearing these numbers are a toss up at NYU. Am I wrong? It's 171 and 3.6 right?

ValiantVic wrote:I'm hearing these numbers are a toss up at NYU. Am I wrong? It's 171 and 3.6 right?

I feel pretty secure at NYU with 172/3.6.

Last year, 172s between 3.3 and 3.7 went 15 for 15 at NYU. 171s in the same range were 8 for 11.

Oh, and I wouldn't bother applying to Boalt. I nixed them from my list a couple days ago, realizing everyone with comparable numbers was reject last year. I didn't get a fee waiver, and I don't feel like drafting a 4-page PS.

I don't think that a 3.6 is safe at Chicago or NYU unless you have a 173+. It's basically right at the 25th percentile for GPA, and a 171 is the median. I think you might as well ED one of them, but I think it will be tougher than you might think. HourUMD, which is incredibly generous recently, only gives you a 48% chance at Chicago. 68% at NYU, but NYU is tougher to get in now than five years ago.

VoidSix wrote:I don't think that a 3.6 is safe at Chicago or NYU unless you have a 173+. It's basically right at the 25th percentile for GPA, and a 171 is the median. I think you might as well ED one of them, but I think it will be more tough than you think.

Last year's cycle indicates otherwise. I realize the OP is one point lower than me, but I think with early cycle submission and good LOR and PS, waitlist is the worst case scenario.

EDIT: Only in regard to NYU. I feel less secure about Chicago.

In other words, put a lot of time in on your personal statement, write "Why Chicago?" or "Why NYU?" essays, and hope for the best.

Fiddy?

Most of those waitlists end up rejections.

Edit: Just saw your edit. NYU is easier to get into than Chicago, I still think 171 will be up in the air. But I think 172 / 3.6 is for the most part safe.

Edit #2: While this site neglects quite a few top law schools, NYU is included. I think it is pretty good, considering it has the most data and isn't self-selecting like LSN. Slightly over 50% for 172 / 3.6, slightly under 50% for 171 / 3.6.

http://officialguide.lsac.org/UGPASearc ... SidString=

VoidSix wrote:Most of those waitlists end up rejections.

Edit: Just saw your edit. NYU is easier to get into than Chicago, I still think 171 will be up in the air. But I think 172 / 3.6 is for the most part safe.

Edit #2: While this site neglects quite a few top law schools, NYU is included. I think it is pretty good, considering it has the most data and isn't self-selecting like LSN.

http://officialguide.lsac.org/UGPASearc ... SidString=

Sounds about right. Oh boy, if I get waitlisted at NYU--barring a semi-unexpected acceptance from Columbia--I am going to be all over them to make sure I'm right near the top of that list. I'd pretty much do anything to stay in the t5 after coming so close.

I find it very hard to take the LSAC calculator seriously. My odds are no better than mid-50s% for anything in the t14 over there. It really goes against every indication I've received in here and from other data. Around 30% for Penn according to them. 45% ish for Michigan. No better than a coin flip at UCLA? Please.

Blazers4Life wrote:

ValiantVic wrote:I'm hearing these numbers are a toss up at NYU. Am I wrong? It's 171 and 3.6 right?

I feel pretty secure at NYU with 172/3.6.

Last year, 172s between 3.3 and 3.7 went 15 for 15 at NYU. 171s in the same range were 8 for 11.

Were these EDs?