Top Law Schools

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jag13 wrote:Hello everyone, just wanted to gauge everyones opinions on my chances at the following schools.

I have a 149 LSAT in Dec'15, then a 158 LSAT in Feb'16. I suffer from test anxiety and freaked out in December, then went back in Feb. and did much better.

3.0 GPA, didn't care about school, upward trend.

URM. M. First Generation American

Softs
Started a business during college, still running it, international clients in 24 countries, profitable, and revenue in 6 figures.

The schools I'm looking at are
UF
FSU
U-MIAMI
EMORY
UNC CHAPEL HILL
WAKE FOREST

Ok, so...highly recommend using mylsn.info

It's a great resource and can give you a bunch of awareness about where you will fall given your numbers. Ran your situation and this is what I got:

http://mylsn.info/9vopgj/

In a nutshell, zero chance at Emory and UNC. Coin flip at FSU and UF (but you'd be paying sticker...not good). WF: unlikely but maybe. Miami you'll absolutely be admitted and you'll end up with $40K +or-.

So, now that's covered. I'd seriously soul search why you want to be a lawyer and consider if any of these options is a via route for your goals. I sincerely doubt you'll have a happy ending if you pursue the options available to you right now. Highly recommend take a class, getting a tutor, and/or studying hard for a retake. Get over 160 and a lot of options become available to you at a much reduced price. Good luck.

Disregard the previous poster. My stats are fairly similar and I'm a urm (check the one other post in my profile) and I broke into the t-14 and got into other schools equivalent and better than the schools on your list. Once you are below both medians as a urm it doesn't really matter. The quality of your ps/ds and unique or elite work experience (TFA/Wall Street) can help you bridge the gap. A 3.4-3.5 gpa 160-162 urm will probably have the same cycle you have and they don't help the numbers of the schools either. If you can produce top shelf writing and can articulate why a particular school is a great fit for you, you can honestly get into most of those school. Again my number are very similar to yours so I am giving you the perspective of someone who was in your shoes this past cycle. Feel free to pm me for more info. Also one of the schools on your list gave me a full tuition scholarship (just food for thought).

They are eh softs. Good softs are rhodes scholar/ olympic athlete. Otherwise softs wont make a difference.

Justtrying2help wrote:Disregard the previous poster. My stats are fairly similar and I'm a urm (check the one other post in my profile) and I broke into the t-14 and got into other schools equivalent and better than the schools on your list. Once you are below both medians as a urm it doesn't really matter. The quality of your ps/ds and unique or elite work experience (TFA/Wall Street) can help you bridge the gap. A 3.4-3.5 gpa 160-162 urm will probably have the same cycle you have and they don't help the numbers of the schools either. If you can produce top shelf writing and can articulate why a particular school is a great fit for you, you can honestly get into most of those school. Again my number are very similar to yours so I am giving you the perspective of someone who was in your shoes this past cycle. Feel free to pm me for more info. Also one of the schools on your list gave me a full tuition scholarship (just food for thought).

This post is one person's annecdata. The mylsn.info link I provided allows you to view a bunch of aggregated data and adjust them for your URM status and hypothetical LSAT retakes. There's always going to be outliers but I wouldn't construct your plans based on those outlier outcomes. Especially given mylsn's reputation for accurately predicting admissions outcomes.

Also, I'd like to highlight that u/justtrying2help didn't mention $$ received at the end of his "Disney fairy tale". Even if you do defy the odds and break into the T14 with a 3.0/158, you'll be financing in excess of a quarter of a million dollars for a shot at trying on the glass slipper. That's not an "opportunity"...that's a really dangerous gamble that will handcuff your options and turn you into yet another person on the picket lines complaining about how Uncle Sugar financially crippled you by forcing...FORCING!...you to take on huge amounts of student debt.

All this to say, retake man. You can do better than a 158. The number and quality of options available to you at 160+ (and especially 165+) are incredible and it's not worth selling yourself short (or mortgaging a decade of your life) by following some shitty advice from a shitpoaster on TLS.

ponderingmeerkat wrote:

Justtrying2help wrote:Disregard the previous poster. My stats are fairly similar and I'm a urm (check the one other post in my profile) and I broke into the t-14 and got into other schools equivalent and better than the schools on your list. Once you are below both medians as a urm it doesn't really matter. The quality of your ps/ds and unique or elite work experience (TFA/Wall Street) can help you bridge the gap. A 3.4-3.5 gpa 160-162 urm will probably have the same cycle you have and they don't help the numbers of the schools either. If you can produce top shelf writing and can articulate why a particular school is a great fit for you, you can honestly get into most of those school. Again my number are very similar to yours so I am giving you the perspective of someone who was in your shoes this past cycle. Feel free to pm me for more info. Also one of the schools on your list gave me a full tuition scholarship (just food for thought).

This post is one person's annecdata. The mylsn.info link I provided allows you to view a bunch of aggregated data and adjust them for your URM status and hypothetical LSAT retakes. There's always going to be outliers but I wouldn't construct your plans based on those outlier outcomes. Especially given mylsn's reputation for accurately predicting admissions outcomes.

Also, I'd like to highlight that u/justtrying2help didn't mention $$ received at the end of his "Disney fairy tale". Even if you do defy the odds and break into the T14 with a 3.0/158, you'll be financing in excess of a quarter of a million dollars for a shot at trying on the glass slipper. That's not an "opportunity"...that's a really dangerous gamble that will handcuff your options and turn you into yet another person on the picket lines complaining about how Uncle Sugar financially crippled you by forcing...FORCING!...you to take on huge amounts of student debt.

All this to say, retake man. You can do better than a 158. The number and quality of options available to you at 160+ (and especially 165+) are incredible and it's not worth selling yourself short (or mortgaging a decade of your life) by following some shitty advice from a shitpoaster on TLS.

I actually did post the $$$ in my first ever post. I only have 2 other than this one. If you took the time to read you'd know that. I could graduate Michigan law with 180k debt, Vanderbilt with 85-90k, or Wake Forest debt free. I chose one of these options. My results were good but not uncommon amongst urms. I don't have an olympic medal, Pulitzer Prize, work for TFA, Nobel Prize or any great honor. I'm an exceptional writer when I take the time and proofread (I may or may not be published ). And since when does telling your true story make someone a shitpoaster. That's absurd!

jag13 wrote:Hello everyone, just wanted to gauge everyones opinions on my chances at the following schools.

I have a 149 LSAT in Dec'15, then a 158 LSAT in Feb'16. I suffer from test anxiety and freaked out in December, then went back in Feb. and did much better.

3.0 GPA, didn't care about school, upward trend.

URM. M. First Generation American

Softs
Started a business during college, still running it, international clients in 24 countries, profitable, and revenue in 6 figures.

The schools I'm looking at are
UF
FSU
U-MIAMI
EMORY
UNC CHAPEL HILL
WAKE FOREST

Jag,

To begin, how much your URM status means is highly dependent on which URM group you identify with. Not sure about other schools, but unless you are African American or Native American, you will have 0 chance at Emory.

Next, why are you attending law school? You have a company that is bringing in 6 figures in revenue and is growing?

There is little or no chance, unless you plan to attend part time, that you can run that business while in law school. Best of luck.

Justtrying2help wrote: And since when does telling your true story make someone a shitpoaster. That's absurd!

Telling a true story does not make you shit poaster. Telling someone to dismiss hard data and instead ONLY listen to your personal anecdote is.

Telling someone that your URM outcome is indicative of all URM outcomes is a shitpoast. Implying someone shouldn't retake because you didn't have to is a shitpoast. Doing someone a disservice by rejecting all nuance and any implication that there might be a spectrum of possible outcomes is a shitpoast.

The way you contribute and not shitpoast would be thusly: "Hey dude, I had a positive outcome with similar numbers to yours! It can be done. Please PM me, and we can talk about ways to make your application as robust as possible. Do be aware the odds are stacked against you though so, I recommend a retake. But, have some confidence. There are positive outcomes out there for you...justtrying2help"

That would be the way to ACTUALLY help, ACTUALLY offer encouragement, and still continue to allow the hard data to speak for themselves.

ponderingmeerkat wrote:

Justtrying2help wrote: And since when does telling your true story make someone a shitpoaster. That's absurd!

Telling a true story does not make you shit poaster. Telling someone to dismiss hard data and instead ONLY listen to your personal anecdote is.

Telling someone that your URM outcome is indicative of all URM outcomes is a shitpoast. Implying someone shouldn't retake because you didn't have to is a shitpoast. Doing someone a disservice by rejecting all nuance and any implication that there might be a spectrum of possible outcomes is a shitpoast.

The way you contribute and not shitpoast would be thusly: "Hey dude, I had a positive outcome with similar numbers to yours! It can be done. Please PM me, and we can talk about ways to make your application as robust as possible. Do be aware the odds are stacked against you though so, I recommend a retake. But, have some confidence. There are positive outcomes out there for you...justtrying2help"

That would be the way to ACTUALLY help, ACTUALLY offer encouragement, and still continue to allow the hard data to speak for themselves.

My outcomes appear to be better than your best case scenario so I understand your jealousy. You would probably kill to have my cycle.

Justtrying2help wrote:

ponderingmeerkat wrote:

Justtrying2help wrote: And since when does telling your true story make someone a shitpoaster. That's absurd!

Telling a true story does not make you shit poaster. Telling someone to dismiss hard data and instead ONLY listen to your personal anecdote is.

Telling someone that your URM outcome is indicative of all URM outcomes is a shitpoast. Implying someone shouldn't retake because you didn't have to is a shitpoast. Doing someone a disservice by rejecting all nuance and any implication that there might be a spectrum of possible outcomes is a shitpoast.

The way you contribute and not shitpoast would be thusly: "Hey dude, I had a positive outcome with similar numbers to yours! It can be done. Please PM me, and we can talk about ways to make your application as robust as possible. Do be aware the odds are stacked against you though so, I recommend a retake. But, have some confidence. There are positive outcomes out there for you...justtrying2help"

That would be the way to ACTUALLY help, ACTUALLY offer encouragement, and still continue to allow the hard data to speak for themselves.

My outcomes appear to be better than your best case scenario so I understand your jealousy. You would probably kill to have my cycle.

I rest my case...

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Justtrying2help wrote:

ponderingmeerkat wrote:

Justtrying2help wrote: And since when does telling your true story make someone a shitpoaster. That's absurd!

Telling a true story does not make you shit poaster. Telling someone to dismiss hard data and instead ONLY listen to your personal anecdote is.

Telling someone that your URM outcome is indicative of all URM outcomes is a shitpoast. Implying someone shouldn't retake because you didn't have to is a shitpoast. Doing someone a disservice by rejecting all nuance and any implication that there might be a spectrum of possible outcomes is a shitpoast.

The way you contribute and not shitpoast would be thusly: "Hey dude, I had a positive outcome with similar numbers to yours! It can be done. Please PM me, and we can talk about ways to make your application as robust as possible. Do be aware the odds are stacked against you though so, I recommend a retake. But, have some confidence. There are positive outcomes out there for you...justtrying2help"

That would be the way to ACTUALLY help, ACTUALLY offer encouragement, and still continue to allow the hard data to speak for themselves.

My outcomes appear to be better than your best case scenario so I understand your jealousy. You would probably kill to have my cycle.

That was the most pretentious thing I've seen all day.

TheMikey wrote:

Justtrying2help wrote: My outcomes appear to be better than your best case scenario so I understand your jealousy. You would probably kill to have my cycle.

That was the most pretentious thing I've seen all day.

Strange dude. Now he's blowing up my PMs.

x

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Don't waste your URM status on those presTTTigious schools! #Retake

Justtrying2help wrote:Disregard the previous poster. My stats are fairly similar and I'm a urm (check the one other post in my profile) and I broke into the t-14 and got into other schools equivalent and better than the schools on your list. Once you are below both medians as a urm it doesn't really matter. The quality of your ps/ds and unique or elite work experience (TFA/Wall Street) can help you bridge the gap. A 3.4-3.5 gpa 160-162 urm will probably have the same cycle you have and they don't help the numbers of the schools either. If you can produce top shelf writing and can articulate why a particular school is a great fit for you, you can honestly get into most of those school. Again my number are very similar to yours so I am giving you the perspective of someone who was in your shoes this past cycle. Feel free to pm me for more info. Also one of the schools on your list gave me a full tuition scholarship (just food for thought).

+1

But, breaking into the 160s is a big hurdle to cross and should be considered. Congrats though on improving as much as you did the first time around. If anything, it speaks to your capabilities to continue improving. If you had improved only maybe 3 points it would be iffy to retake as you may have hit your potential. But your large jump suggests it's not your capabilities to perform on the LAST holding you back but your test day anxieties. It's anecdotal, but my close friend saw a therapist while she was studying for her retake to be able to calm herself quickly during the test and she jumped from a 150 to a 163. No change in study habits, just some guidance on how to calm her anxiety. That may not work for everyone, but since you probably can break the 160s, it may be worth looking into.

jag13 wrote:Started a business during college, still running it, international clients in 24 countries, profitable, and revenue in 6 figures.

Why the hell would you want to go to law school? Get an MBA or something if you really just want a "fancy" piece of paper to hang on your wall and wow your friends with.

Better yet, I'll trade you my law degree for your business. Win-win.