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Humble brag? Seriously though LSAT>All the things. Retake for 180

The easiest, and perhaps only, way for you to get HYS is to retake.

argggh i hate the lsat :/

but i will consider this opinion.

probably in at CC. Some have a shot at H/S with your numbers, but not many. For a realistic shot at HYS, retake. If you're happy with your academia changes at Chicago, then you don't have to retake--but a few more points could get you HYS.

Thanks - i'll give that some thought. it's a good thing uchicago has a strong program for academia...

Yale will like this application.

This person has awesome softs, is at Stanford's LSAT median, and is above its gpa median. Why wouldn't s/he get in there?

Thanks Tiago and Philepistemer!

I did notice that possibly stanford weighs GPA more than the typical school, so possibly that will weigh in my favor. I also did hear that Yale is more academic.

everyone here is probably intimately familiar with this data, but I did notice a high gpa/lower LSAT trend here: http://stanford.lawschoolnumbers.com/stats/1213

While not guaranteed, there does appear to be atrend where higher gpas and weaker lsats (near where I am) are getting in somewhat. Obviously the data are self-selected (more neurotic people are entering the data and using the tool, and I'm no exception so possibly it's reflective lol) and the sample size very small (they should let you combine cycles to increase sample size). Also, obviously, having a higher lsat would help, but I'd greatly prefer not to retake if it isn't necessary because i'm a sucky test taker.

philepistemer wrote:This person has awesome softs, is at Stanford's LSAT median, and is above its gpa median. Why wouldn't s/he get in there?

Indeed OP's softs are really cool, but the issue with Stanford is that they have many more qualified applicants (just on a numbers basis) than there is room to admit. As such, it's more of a crapshoot than anywhere except for Yale.

OP is looking at UChi $$ right now, but even a two-point improvement would make OP pretty much a lock at Harvard. So a retake might make a big difference.

Hey Monochromatic,

do you think retaking is a good idea, even if there's the possibility I get a lower score?

Also: is it a bad idea to just submit my app as early as possible (e.g., early september), but schedule to take the october lsat. if I get a higher score, just update my application with that score?

It doesn't really matter if you get a lower score, because only your highest one really matters. If you were PTing higher than 170, you have nearly nothing to lose by retaking.

I'd submit your apps come September 1. Although if you really want to be an academic, you should have your eyes on Yale. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Yale's season starts November 1. Either way, there's plenty of time for an October retake to be considered.

I agree with Mono 100%. Your softs are dope, you have a shot but just improve a couple points and then you won't have to worry nearly as much. Don't fight an uphill battle when you have another option: retake, and stroll around the hill.

By the way, you should be incredibly proud of yourself and your achievements thus far and with your credentials you'll likely make an excellent academic. My undergrad research advisor just got the NSF policy fellowship in DC and he's stoked to go there, so I can imagine how amazing that must've felt for you to notch that accomplishment in your belt.

Best of luck!

Monochromatic Oeuvre wrote:

philepistemer wrote:This person has awesome softs, is at Stanford's LSAT median, and is above its gpa median. Why wouldn't s/he get in there?

Indeed OP's softs are really cool, but the issue with Stanford is that they have many more qualified applicants (just on a numbers basis) than there is room to admit. As such, it's more of a crapshoot than anywhere except for Yale.

OP is looking at UChi $$ right now, but even a two-point improvement would make OP pretty much a lock at Harvard. So a retake might make a big difference.

With OP's softs S will not be a crap shoot. All but guaranteed in at S with current #s IMHO. One of the rare applicants that's a lock at S and up in the air at H actually.

Cobretti wrote: With OP's softs S will not be a crap shoot. All but guaranteed in at S with current #s IMHO. One of the rare applicants that's a lock at S and up in the air at H actually.

You dun know S.

I agree OP has a decent shot at all of HYS though.

Thanks everyone for the mix of encouragement and advice!

So far the conversations been really helpful. The take-away so far is that retaking the lsat would make things easier for me, but may not be necessary.

Would you rather attend HYS or CCN with a full ride?

I'll think about it.

Then yeah, your assessment is correct. 171/2/3 would help a lot towards a guarantee of being admitted/chance at Chi/NYU fullrides but given your softs, I would be surprised if you get shut out of HYS now (though not unheard of given your #s)

really interesting. so do you think even that one point could make enough of a difference to warrant sacrificing a summer ?

sonyvaio18 wrote:really interesting. so do you think even that one point could make enough of a difference to warrant sacrificing a summer ?

Average improvement is at least two (even for those who don't take studying all that seriously) with the chance to improve more than that and really no downside if you don't.

Hey Mono,

that's really great. I'll think about this some more. I might just do some light studying then.

Do you know where I can find that they don't care about your lower score? I got the sense that for Harvard they average your two scores, so there could be a penalty of a lower score...

OP:

I disagree with the retake sentiment here. You probably want Y or S. You will likely get one of them. Maybe in at H too, but less likely with that 170. Being at one above the other median of a school creates a situation where they will evaluate you based on softs. Y and S care more about softs than most. I would let it ride. Imagine the downside risk-- you retake and get a 169 or 168. This would instantly put you out at Y and S, and may also put you out at Columbia and Chicago. I wouldn't risk it.

My advice is not to retake.

You should go to Y (and maybe S) if you want academia. So long as you can write a good personal statement and get good recommenders, I don't think that I would worry about the LSAT. You have the kind of ba ckground that would really appeal to these two places. Y admissions is run by professors who are likely to be impressed by your background and S really doesn't care about the LSAT once you're at a 170.

For what it's worth, I got into both S and H (didn't apply to Y) with a 171 on my higher score, a lower GPA than yours, and less impressive softs. I think that especially with applications down the way they are, you should be in good shape. There just aren't a lot of applicants with interesting life stories and a PhD and prestigious nationally-competitive scholarships out there.

sapien wrote:My advice is not to retake.

You should go to Y (and maybe S) if you want academia. So long as you can write a good personal statement and get good recommenders, I don't think that I would worry about the LSAT. You have the kind of ba ckground that would really appeal to these two places. Y admissions is run by professors who are likely to be impressed by your background and S really doesn't care about the LSAT once you're at a 170.

For what it's worth, I got into both S and H (didn't apply to Y) with a 171 on my higher score, a lower GPA than yours, and less impressive softs. I think that especially with applications down the way they are, you should be in good shape. There just aren't a lot of applicants with interesting life stories and a PhD and prestigious nationally-competitive scholarships out there.

Yea I think you stand a good chance at HYS as it is.

Apply and if you dont get Y or S, retake june 2014