3.23/172 Non URM with 2yrs WE Forum

[NJPitcher]

I'll chime in as a 3.18/173 (no retakes).

You'll ride a lot of WL in the T14, and you'll get $$ at UCLA/Vandy on down. I'd be shocked if you wind up with any money at the 14s, but outside they'll want your LSAT and odds are you'll get money. Here's my LSN if you want my whole cycle: http://lawschoolnumbers.com/njpitcher

I wrote no LOCIs and made no real attempts to get off waitlists, but both NYU and Penn let me in off of WL. I tend to think NYU is an easier shot since they have a larger class and a higher acceptance %, so as long as you hit their numbers you have a shot - just be prepared to pay sticker. I'm not sure how I feel about the ED giving you an advantage at any of these places though, as I tend to think that in their eyes they're already reaches for you, so odds are you'll accept if admitted (in other words the ED doesn't tell them much they don't already know).

If you really want NYC then I'd prob apply NYU/NU/Cornell/Fordham, and pepper any other apps you think might give you some bargaining power. You'll also get some fee waivers with your LSAT, so take advantage of those.

Not to hijack, but I'm in a very similar situation as the OP (sans WE, though). NJPitcher, your results are very encouraging, particularly the fact that you got to NYU and Penn RD, but the bolded portion above seems to go against the majority of wisdom I have heard on this board. Your logic sounds solid though. Can anyone expand on this?

My opinion is total conjecture, and not founded in any research of any sorts. LSN may have the ability to tell you if ED would give the borderline people a significant advantage, but I haven't done that research at all, and I'm purely going on anecdotal evidence. Totally the worst kind of statement to make, and I'd hate other people who aren't myself for making such a claim, so take it for what it's worth. I tend to think that the possibility of $$ and having options outweighs any slight advantage granted by ED. While it may help you get NYU, I tend to think that 95% of the time you'd get NYU anyways when you get it ED, and by EDing you merely take away your options. Again, totally based in nothing other than what I would do myself were I an admin officer trying to help my stats.

[Ramsey]

I saw her score myself and as far as I know she doesn't have anything particularly odd or negative that might have been hurt her chance more than anybody else.

My intention of sharing her rather unlucky situation was to warn OP that he might want to apply broadly: while some schools consider only the highest score, there are many school that explicitly state that they will average the scores if they differ by more than 5 points. Taking LSAT even before one is ready (and OP did twice) is a bad judgment that warrants an addendum.

Besides, OP is a splitter, meaning that he should be ready to embrace the worst as well as the best.

My friend 1) did not write an addendum and 2) applied to only 3-4 schools in T15-35 range. She (and all of her friends) was confident that she would get into at least a lower T-14 school.

I hope OP's cycle turns out different from hers, but consider writing an addendum if your ED doesn't go so well.

Congrats on your score!

Having that said, I think 151-161-172 track may hurt you against those with less extreme score improvement... My friend had 3.60 from Ivy/157-163-170/MA from top school and rich international experiences. She ED'ed to Georgetown but waitlisted. She didnt get into any T-25 (applied all early in the cycle) and she's now attending a school in T30-T35 (wait listed, then admitted).

You may be not as unlucky as she, but just make sure that you apply to a wide range of schools. I won't be surprised to see you admitted to mid T-14, but if i were you, i won't save on application fees and cast a wide wide net up to T-35.

An addendum explaining your dramatic score rise might help.

Those are autoadmit numbers for basically all of 19-25 so your friend clearly has something else wrong with their app or your definition of T25 is not actually the Top 25 on USNWR.

Or that 170 doesn't really exist, and she's saving face by saying the third time was a charm. a 3.6/170 doesn't strike out in the T-30.

[UDFlyers90]

[quote="Ramsey"]I saw her score myself and as far as I know she doesn't have anything particularly odd or negative that might have been hurt her chance more than anybody else.

My intention of sharing her rather unlucky situation was to warn OP that he might want to apply broadly: while some schools consider only the highest score, there are many school that explicitly state that they will average the scores if they differ by more than 5 points. Taking LSAT even before one is ready (and OP did twice) is a bad judgment that warrants an addendum.

Besides, OP is a splitter, meaning that he should be ready to embrace the worst as well as the best.

My friend 1) did not write an addendum and 2) applied to only 3-4 schools in T15-35 range. She (and all of her friends) was confident that she would get into at least a lower T-14 school.

I hope OP's cycle turns out different from hers, but consider writing an addendum if your ED doesn't go so well.

Do you know when she submitted her applications? Most likely a late application could result in this (I realize she EDed Gtown but you can ED there until March 1st and even that is a soft deadline) The other possible explanation is she put together a rather lazy application. (a la like this guy did) Unless those 3-4 schools in that range were Vandy, UT, UCLA and BU/BC I just don't see those numbers not pulling in something worth attending.

OP I suppose I could say my cycle is an example of worst case scenario of what could happen as a splitter. Applied in January after December 2011 LSAT, numbers were 3.05, 176 and I got pwned. No T14 acceptances to speak of, rejected at chicago, michigan, penn and duke and waitlisted at UVA (although accepted deferred admission) and gtown. Best acceptance was to WashU with a traditional washu splitter scholly.

That being said in retrospect I might have had the worst application strategy of any 176 applicant ever and I doubt you will duplicate my mistakes. Stupidly didn't apply to Vandy, Cornell, Northwestern or NYU..all schools that I had a fightin' chance of being admitted to at least off the waitlist. I also prepared my application when I was a 3.0 165 candidate and prepared accordingly. Blinded by my shiny new LSAT score I applied immediately after getting my 176 and was convinced at the time that my upward grade trend and strong LSAT would open the t14 of my choice to me. Obviously this didn't work out too well and I will be reapplying.

Best advice is to not do what I did, and apply to every t20 that takes splitters (even if it tends to be after a waitlist) and ED to the school you would absolutely attend at sticker. Also prepare a strong personal statement, during the application process it is your only selling point that you still have control over up to the minute you submit your application, I am fairly confident that writing the PS of an illiterate TTTT student convinced adcomms in the t14 that I was a lazy fella who just happened to luckily do well on the LSAT.

Good Luck!

[dsc1943]

+1 to applying to as many schools as possible.

I was in a similar situation this cycle (3.08/175 1.5 yrs work experience but only took LSAT once) I applied to 17 schools including all schools from 4-14 besides Michigan and Chicago. Be prepared for a bunch of waitlists. The only T14 I was admitted outright to was NU I was admitted to NYU off the waitlist a couple weeks ago so that's a possibility for you. Be prepared for an unpredictable cycle though b/c I was waitlisted at schools like Fordham and UC Hastings (I'm assuming I would have gotten in but didn't bother riding them out)

[patentlybored]

tag

[mbd1200]

I think your chances are significantly better at NYU than most have expressed in this thread, especially if you get your application in early and/or ED. http://myLSN.info/dispresults.php?sk=zb9av

NYU is LSAT hungry and they like people who get their applications in early. If that's your dream school, go for it. You've got a very legitimate shot. Worst case scenario, you're on their waitlist and applying regular decision to a bunch of schools that aren't your top option, which is what you should be doing anyway.