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Hi Folks-

New to the forum and eager for counsel.

I am currently struggling whether or not I should apply this cycle.

The fact pattern:
I am gunning for Columbia or NYU to study in their respective tax programs. I am a non-URM, have a 3.6 from NYU and moderate "softs" (leadership in a few clubs/strong internships throughout university/worked 40 hours a week @ night throughout college to pay for school). Graduated in 2008 and have since been working my way up at a think tank in DC focused on federal tax policy. I have my recommendations submitted and am halfway to what I am hoping will be a strong personal statement.I just took the LSAT for the first time last Saturday (i know, i know -- extenuating circumstances prevented an earlier writing). Went well and am feeling confident I will hit somewhere in my PT range (172-177).

Obviously, I am little late in the cycle and wont be able to have my apps in until the first week of January. Given my relatively weak GPA, I am increasingly thinking -- after reading some posts elsewhere on the forum -- it might be better for me to wait till next cycle and maybe ED at one of the programs. Normally I would wait for LSATs to come back and make a decision from there but, complicating matters, I have recently been offered a position serving as an tax aide for a Congressman and I need to let them know ASAP (taking the job, assuming I get into the programs I want, I would attempt to defer.)

So -- finally -- my questions?

Assuming I hit my LSAT range, should I apply this cycle? Or is ED next a better idea?
If I do apply this cycle, does it hurt to reapply after a rejection?
How much would an additional year of WE in my relevant field bolster my applications?
Is it difficult/frowned upon to defer?

Sorry for the length.

Appreciate the help, everyone,
R

You only need one thread for one topic, for future reference.

I think you should apply next cycle. You'll be more prepared, you'll have some extra work experience at what sounds like a good job, and you'll be able to apply at the beginning of the cycle to maximize your results. Don't apply with the intention to defer. That's just silly.

Definitely wait until next cycle. It's getting pretty late to apply, especially if your numbers are under the medians of the schools you would like to attend.

Apply now, before score release. If you get one of them, go, if not, reapply

Apply now.

JamMasterJ wrote:Apply now, before score release. If you get one of them, go, if not, reapply

If OP waits until next cycle, OP will likely have better acceptances and better scholly offers to choose from than this cycle. OP has a great job lined up for the interim 18 months and could save a lot of money. Plus, we don't even know OP's score yet. Apply enxt cycle, hands down.

.

Appreciate the counsel.

Any sense if schools frown on reapplies?

rayz33 wrote:Appreciate the counsel.

Any sense if schools frown on reapplies?

doubtful.

..

Samara wrote:

JamMasterJ wrote:Apply now, before score release. If you get one of them, go, if not, reapply

If OP waits until next cycle, OP will likely have better acceptances and better scholly offers to choose from than this cycle. OP has a great job lined up for the interim 18 months and could save a lot of money. Plus, we don't even know OP's score yet. Apply enxt cycle, hands down.

well, OP isn't getting into HYS, and he probably isn't getting a lot of money from CCN, so unless he'd rather take a shot at a really large scholly from the lower T10, getting into one of CCN with a small shot at a little money is really as good as it can get.

..

no one's mentioned the fact that OP's got a cool job lined up - do you actually want to accept this job and keep it for a year? how do you feel about debt?

ilovesf wrote:no one's mentioned the fact that OP's got a cool job lined up - do you actually want to accept this job and keep it for a year? how do you feel about debt?

Job makes a lot of sense, given my career goals and applicability to my pursuit of law. Unless I completely hate the office, I full expect to ride it out for the full 18 months. Two downsides: 1) pays a little less than my current gig; 2) keeps me away from my personal life up in NYC for additional year.

Given I already have 3+ WE in my field, do you think the extra experience on the Hill help my apps out in any meaningful way?

Oh, and the debt scares the sh*t out of me. Partially, why I have been slow to head back to school.

rayz33 wrote:

ilovesf wrote:no one's mentioned the fact that OP's got a cool job lined up - do you actually want to accept this job and keep it for a year? how do you feel about debt?

Job makes a lot of sense, given my career goals and applicability to my pursuit of law. Unless I completely hate the office, I full expect to ride it out for the full 18 months. Two downsides: 1) pays a little less than my current gig; 2) keeps me away from my personal life up in NYC for additional year.

Given I already have 3+ WE in my field, do you think the extra experience on the Hill help my apps out in any meaningful way?

I think the extra year would have a marginal impact, but it sounds like this job is a move up the ladder, which would be good. I think the greater benefit of waiting comes from A) applying earlier in the cycle and B) earning some extra money to defray the debt (since you're worried about that) and C) be better prepared to make the decision that you think is best.

Northwestern's tax program is well-regarded, no? If you applied next cycle with a 172+, you would be a very strong candidate for their ED full-ride scholly, which would solve all of your debt-worrying problems.

acrossthelake wrote:

JamMasterJ wrote:

rayz33 wrote:Appreciate the counsel.

Any sense if schools frown on reapplies?

doubtful.

They frown if you turn them down and reapply. If they rejected you the first time, don't think.

^ what I meant to say

Samara wrote:

rayz33 wrote:

ilovesf wrote:no one's mentioned the fact that OP's got a cool job lined up - do you actually want to accept this job and keep it for a year? how do you feel about debt?

Job makes a lot of sense, given my career goals and applicability to my pursuit of law. Unless I completely hate the office, I full expect to ride it out for the full 18 months. Two downsides: 1) pays a little less than my current gig; 2) keeps me away from my personal life up in NYC for additional year.

Given I already have 3+ WE in my field, do you think the extra experience on the Hill help my apps out in any meaningful way?

I think the extra year would have a marginal impact, but it sounds like this job is a move up the ladder, which would be good. I think the greater benefit of waiting comes from A) applying earlier in the cycle and B) earning some extra money to defray the debt (since you're worried about that) and C) be better prepared to make the decision that you think is best.

Northwestern's tax program is well-regarded, no? If you applied next cycle with a 172+, you would be a very strong candidate for their ED full-ride scholly, which would solve all of your debt-worrying problems.

Love the idea of $$ and deff have Northwestern on the list as a target for their tax program. If I were to hit the upper end of my LSAT range (176-177), any chance for $$ from Columbia/NYU? Pardon my lack of knowledge, but does ED increase significantly the chance for scholarship dollars? $$ from the big two in NYC would be ideal. (recap on credentials: 3.6, strong and relevant WE, moderate softs, what I hope to be good LORs and statement.)

Really do appreciate all the insight.

rayz33 wrote:Love the idea of $$ and deff have Northwestern on the list as a target for their tax program. If I were to hit the upper end of my LSAT range (176-177), any chance for $$ from Columbia/NYU? Pardon my lack of knowledge, but does ED increase significantly the chance for scholarship dollars? $$ from the big two in NYC would be ideal. (recap on credentials: 3.6, strong and relevant WE, moderate softs, what I hope to be good LORs and statement.)

Really do appreciate all the insight.

It looks like on LSN that about a third of the applicants with your numbers (assuming 175+) at NYU and Columbia got money, with an average of about $20-30k. (Except, curiously, last year at Columbia no one at those numbers got money.) So, you could get a little money, but applying at this point in the cycle you are much less likely to get anything from those schools.

ED does not increase your scholarship chances. (NU-style ED programs excepted, of course) If anything, it decreases your chances. Why would they offer you money if you have already committed to them? If I were you, with your WE and such, the only place I would consider applying ED to would be NU if you want to do the $150k scholly deal. Your chances are solid for RD at CCN and you can get good scholly offers from the lower half of the T14.

ETA: According to LSN, looking at applicants with 175+ and 3.5-3.65, about 15% waitlisted, no rejections reported. (A couple non-withdrawn pendings that may be rejections) So you are in good shape for NYU/Columbia RD.

Yeah NYU/CLS are more open to late applications assuming you break 175+. I took the December LSAT last year and heard back from CLS towards the end of the first wave of RD VCEs...You might not get money from them, but NYU will probably throw something your way to steal your score away from CLS. That said, this is an entirely different conversation if you get pretty much anything below a 175.

I still think that the job. Next year apply early with WE and hopefully a great score.

OP here. I have accepted the position on Capitol Hill. Excited and appreciate all the counsel.

I am still thinking of applying to my top schools (NYU/Columbia) this cycle as hedge, in case the 'grass is not always greener' proves to be true. Again, I do not know my LSAT -- waiting on Dec (my only) and hope to hit my PT range 172-177. Of course, if I am out of range, I will retake and wait for the next cycle.

If I am to get into my top schools, I would weigh matriculating this cycle or deferring if the job is all that I hope it to be. If I don't get in, I will simply reapply to a broader swath of schools on the first day of next year's cycle, with bolstered WE and hope for the best.

Couple quick follow-ups Qs:

Does this strategy/plan of attack/line of thinking make sense?

If so, would it be taboo to include my new employment on my resume this cycle? Or might it potentially raise flags (hmmm... he just accepted this position -- is he likely to enroll? defer? etc.?)?

Should I just screw this cycle, and apply early to my "tops" next cycle and hope for $$?


Thanks, folks.

You're not super likely to get a scholorship unless you hit the upper end of your practice tests, and even then, it's not too common.

You could get in this cycle with no $, defer, and go next year - I would not reccomend that.

Wait until you get your score, if it's a 175+, finish your entire application and wait until next cycle. If it isn't, you mine as well study, re-take, and aim for the 175+ mark.

You have the possibility of recieving some money if you apply EARLY next year, and it certainly won't hurt your chances of acceptance.

Samara wrote:If OP waits until next cycle, OP will likely have better acceptances and better scholly offers to choose from than this cycle. OP has a great job lined up for the interim 18 months and could save a lot of money. Plus, we don't even know OP's score yet. Apply next cycle, hands down.

+1

LawSchoolChampion wrote:You're not super likely to get a scholorship unless you hit the upper end of your practice tests, and even then, it's not too common.

You could get in this cycle with no $, defer, and go next year - I would not reccomend that.

Wait until you get your score, if it's a 175+, finish your entire application and wait until next cycle. If it isn't, you mine as well study, re-take, and aim for the 175+ mark.

You have the possibility of recieving some money if you apply EARLY next year, and it certainly won't hurt your chances of acceptance.

I like it. See what comes back from the December writing and retake as needed. Apps out first day next cycle. Much appreciated.

One question: Any harm in using the LORs dated for this cycle for next? Could ask for re-submissions, no problem -- just curious.