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Looking at LSN would help a lot...

I know that some people with 3.4-3.6s were admitted with mid to high 150 LSATs to Pitt.

Youd prolly make Nova, but idk that its a guarantee.

It would definitely be sticker at Pitt, Temple, Nova, or Penn State.

A retake would do you wonders with that GPA. A few points would get you money at Pitt prolly.

If you were dead set on Pitt and not retaking, duquesne would be a go, but a bad idea financially.

Kage3212 wrote:Hello All,


I understand a lot of you will suggest a retake but I really only want to do that if its entirely necessary.

It is absolutely necessary. Anything less would be uncivilized.

Retake for Pitt with some money or a much better school that can get you to Pittsburgh.

please retake.

bport hopeful wrote:Looking at LSN would help a lot...

I know that some people with 3.4-3.6s were admitted with mid to high 150 LSATs to Pitt.

Youd prolly make Nova, but idk that its a guarantee.

It would definitely be sticker at Pitt, Temple, Nova, or Penn State.

A retake would do you wonders with that GPA. A few points would get you money at Pitt prolly.

If you were dead set on Pitt and not retaking, duquesne would be a go, but a bad idea financially.

+1

If you are content with hanging out in or around Pittsburgh and have no qualms about being in debt for the rest of your life, go to Duquesne. However, if you want the PA schools you have listed, then you will have to retake, as those numbers aren't really competitive at the schools you're considering. It essentially comes down to either retaking, getting a job with your Bachelor's, or sticking it out at Duquesne/Drexel/Widener. In accord with the other opinions on here, your best option is a retake. Good luck!

I would sincerely suggest retake.

I wish I had retook.

firemed wrote:I would sincerely suggest retake.

I wish I had retook.

+1

i had similar numbers as you (155/3.94 GPA), and great softs and still got dinged at Temple. i, too, bombed one section on the lsat and keep kicking myself for not retaking it, but it is what it is. definitely retake. you'll regret it if you don't and probably won't get into either school (though villanova's a possibility).

Thanks to everyone who has replied thus far. It seems evident that despite my desire not to retake, I will once again be sharpening my skills to sit for the test again. Any insight as to how much a January application will hurt my cycle?

Kage3212 wrote:Thanks to everyone who has replied thus far. It seems evident that despite my desire not to retake, I will once again be sharpening my skills to sit for the test again. Any insight as to how much a January application will hurt my cycle?

Why not take in October?

Kage3212 wrote:Thanks to everyone who has replied thus far. It seems evident that despite my desire not to retake, I will once again be sharpening my skills to sit for the test again. Any insight as to how much a January application will hurt my cycle?

I'm a little rusty on LSAC procedures, but can't you still register for the October LSAT? two months should be plenty of time to cram for it and you'd get your score back soon enough to have your apps in before Thanksgiving. I wouldn't wait until the December LSAT, if you can avoid it.

Balancing full time employment, a full week of vacation in September, 4 day trip later this month, it seems that October would be completely rushing things. If I am sitting again I want to ensure that I do marginally better and have no doubts of a drastic improvement.

Kage3212 wrote:Balancing full time employment, a full week of vacation in September, 4 day trip later this month, it seems that October would be completely rushing things. If I am sitting again I want to ensure that I do marginally better and have no doubts of a drastic improvement.

Same boat as you my man. Did a bit worse on my LSAT (150) only got into Duquesne. I wanted to take the LSAT again in Oct but, like you, balancing a full time job has made me reconsider that. I'm going to give it my all the rest of Aug and all of Sep, Oct, and Nov. Hoping to at least get a 160 because at Pitt a 160 and, I believe, a 3.4 automatically gets you 10k a year but not sure if it is grade contingent to get it years 2 and 3.

Kage3212 wrote:Balancing full time employment, a full week of vacation in September, 4 day trip later this month, it seems that October would be completely rushing things. If I am sitting again I want to ensure that I do marginally better and have no doubts of a drastic improvement.

Um... I worked full time and studied full time for the LSAT. I still had time for fun stuff with family and such as well. You need to be able to succeed with a lot of time pressure and a HUGE workload when you get to law school. Might as well start practicing now is my advice.

But whatever, if you take the December one you better score 165+ or your application will land you on the WL... all the other people who did better on retakes/first-takes in October will already have their app in.

I had similar numbers when I applied a few years ago and took the LSAT for the first time (I applied in two cycles; I had a 3.98/154 my first cycle, and a 163 LSAT the second time; also, I was a PA resident). I got WL'ed at both Pitt and Temple. After retaking, I got accepted into Pitt, Temple, and PSU with significant scholarships (also, I got into 'Nova, but without money). It stinks studying for the LSAT again, but think of it this way--with your high GPA, a high LSAT will lead to major scholarship money, which means you should treat studying for the LSAT as a job! Good luck.

GatorStudent wrote:I had similar numbers when I applied a few years ago and took the LSAT for the first time (I applied in two cycles; I had a 3.98/154 my first cycle, and a 163 LSAT the second time; also, I was a PA resident). I got WL'ed at both Pitt and Temple. After retaking, I got accepted into Pitt, Temple, and PSU with significant scholarships (also, I got into 'Nova, but without money). It stinks studying for the LSAT again, but think of it this way--with your high GPA, a high LSAT will lead to major scholarship money, which means you should treat studying for the LSAT as a job! Good luck.

with your 163 when in the cycle did you apply to pitt? my concern is that if i apply after the december lsat and score over 160 most of the spots will be filled.

Kage3212 wrote:Thanks to everyone who has replied thus far. It seems evident that despite my desire not to retake, I will once again be sharpening my skills to sit for the test again. Any insight as to how much a January application will hurt my cycle?

A little but not a lot...I pretty much was at par for my numbers (got my app in early, then put a hold until my December retake came in)...I THINK maybe one school rejected me because I was late (it was a bit of a reach anyone) another school waitlisted me but they were reducing class size, got off of another waitlist that was about a target, and got into another target.

Probably a slight underperform, but really only at the margins. PM for specifics.

firemed wrote:

Kage3212 wrote:Balancing full time employment, a full week of vacation in September, 4 day trip later this month, it seems that October would be completely rushing things. If I am sitting again I want to ensure that I do marginally better and have no doubts of a drastic improvement.

Um... I worked full time and studied full time for the LSAT. I still had time for fun stuff with family and such as well. You need to be able to succeed with a lot of time pressure and a HUGE workload when you get to law school. Might as well start practicing now is my advice.

But whatever, if you take the December one you better score 165+ or your application will land you on the WL... all the other people who did better on retakes/first-takes in October will already have their app in.

I really really doubt this commentary...a 3.88 and 165+ gives the OP a shot at UVA ED, and pretty much guarantees them money at BC and Emory

bigkahuna2020 wrote:

firemed wrote:

Kage3212 wrote:Balancing full time employment, a full week of vacation in September, 4 day trip later this month, it seems that October would be completely rushing things. If I am sitting again I want to ensure that I do marginally better and have no doubts of a drastic improvement.

Um... I worked full time and studied full time for the LSAT. I still had time for fun stuff with family and such as well. You need to be able to succeed with a lot of time pressure and a HUGE workload when you get to law school. Might as well start practicing now is my advice.

But whatever, if you take the December one you better score 165+ or your application will land you on the WL... all the other people who did better on retakes/first-takes in October will already have their app in.

I really really doubt this commentary...a 3.88 and 165+ gives the OP a shot at UVA ED, and pretty much guarantees them money at BC and Emory

Can't ED if you apply in January... see what I mean? I was trying to tell OP he needs to take in October if he is going this year or his shot will go way down. 3.88 and 167 is good, but the amount of acceptances at good schools OP will get will go way down, many with WL, which means zero money.

psm11 wrote:

GatorStudent wrote:I had similar numbers when I applied a few years ago and took the LSAT for the first time (I applied in two cycles; I had a 3.98/154 my first cycle, and a 163 LSAT the second time; also, I was a PA resident). I got WL'ed at both Pitt and Temple. After retaking, I got accepted into Pitt, Temple, and PSU with significant scholarships (also, I got into 'Nova, but without money). It stinks studying for the LSAT again, but think of it this way--with your high GPA, a high LSAT will lead to major scholarship money, which means you should treat studying for the LSAT as a job! Good luck.

with your 163 when in the cycle did you apply to pitt? my concern is that if i apply after the december lsat and score over 160 most of the spots will be filled.

Well, I was not satisfied with my law school options with my first LSAT score, so I worked for two years and then retook the LSAT that June, and then applied in Sept./Oct. of that cycle. Pitt gave me 14k/yr., contingent on remaining in the top half of the class, IIRC. PSU gave me 20k/yr., same contingency.

firemed wrote:

bigkahuna2020 wrote:

firemed wrote:

Kage3212 wrote:Balancing full time employment, a full week of vacation in September, 4 day trip later this month, it seems that October would be completely rushing things. If I am sitting again I want to ensure that I do marginally better and have no doubts of a drastic improvement.

Um... I worked full time and studied full time for the LSAT. I still had time for fun stuff with family and such as well. You need to be able to succeed with a lot of time pressure and a HUGE workload when you get to law school. Might as well start practicing now is my advice.

But whatever, if you take the December one you better score 165+ or your application will land you on the WL... all the other people who did better on retakes/first-takes in October will already have their app in.

I really really doubt this commentary...a 3.88 and 165+ gives the OP a shot at UVA ED, and pretty much guarantees them money at BC and Emory

Can't ED if you apply in January... see what I mean? I was trying to tell OP he needs to take in October if he is going this year or his shot will go way down. 3.88 and 167 is good, but the amount of acceptances at good schools OP will get will go way down, many with WL, which means zero money.

This just isn't true. And coming off the waitlist can come with money. January isn't that late ESPECIALLY if he gets his apps in before his retake comes in.

This alarmism is a little crazy, especially when it comes at the expense of waiting an entire year to go to law school for some slight slight slight edge (that may or may not exist)

A 161 will guarantee you 10k at Pitt if you get your app in before January. Even after that youll likely get it, and definitely get it.

I applied to Pitt late with a 3.2 and a 166 and got accepted. They tried not giving me money, which I considered bullshit and told them Id go to a better school for less money than, and they gave me 14k, which will renew if you stay in the top half of your class. That with Pitt connections and in state tuition makes Pitt a really could deal.

You should retake and get your 14k at Pitt, IMO.

Pitt tuition= 34k per year
-14k scholly
-10k instate tuition
=10k a year X 3 = 30k tuition in your city.

Cant beat that shit dude. Your choice is obvious.

bport hopeful wrote:A 161 will guarantee you 10k at Pitt if you get your app in before January. Even after that youll likely get it, and definitely get it.

I applied to Pitt late with a 3.2 and a 166 and got accepted. They tried not giving me money, which I considered bullshit and told them Id go to a better school for less money than, and they gave me 14k, which will renew if you stay in the top half of your class. That with Pitt connections and in state tuition makes Pitt a really could deal.

You should retake and get your 14k at Pitt, IMO.

Pitt tuition= 34k per year
-14k scholly
-10k instate tuition
=10k a year X 3 = 30k tuition in your city.

Cant beat that shit dude. Your choice is obvious.

really good advice. I'm going to shoot for the 161 and get my app in asap and tell them i am taking in december.

bigkahuna2020 wrote:

firemed wrote:

Can't ED if you apply in January... see what I mean? I was trying to tell OP he needs to take in October if he is going this year or his shot will go way down. 3.88 and 167 is good, but the amount of acceptances at good schools OP will get will go way down, many with WL, which means zero money.

This just isn't true. And coming off the waitlist can come with money. January isn't that late ESPECIALLY if he gets his apps in before his retake comes in.

This alarmism is a little crazy, especially when it comes at the expense of waiting an entire year to go to law school for some slight slight slight edge (that may or may not exist)

First off, I ain't telling OP to wait a year.

As for the "alarmism"... I don't know... I watched the entire cycle and noticed that people with lower numbers got in with $$ if they applied in Sept-Nov... and then people with equal numbers to them get placed on WL or get in without money if they applied in January. For instance a dude with a LSAT one point below mine and a GPA .07 below mine got WL at my school for applying in January instead of in Nov when I applied. And that was at a T2 with low application numbers.... I saw people get into T1s later in the cycle but without money who retook in December... and even a few who got put on WL.

Maybe it wouldn't happen to OP- I just don't know enough about admissions in PA- but why take the risk? Why not just take in October (that is what I was encouraging OP to do) and get them to consider your app in November? The early bird gets the worm. And if OP can't handle studying for the LSAT and working full time then law school is going to be tough for OP from everything I have heard.

Yea, the OP should take it in October. That is clear. But a January application isn't gonna change THAT much