Top Law Schools

Hey guys,

Got my final grades back, so it's time to actually do one of these...

3.63 GPA, 176 one-time LSAT score; average softs: a few leadership positions, wrote for electronic journal for 3 years, doing independent research this summer. Part time work throughout last year and a half at school, and full-time work every summer.

Planning to apply to CCN down, but wondering specifically if my lower GPA is going to ding me in the T6? General chances advice for rest of T14 would be very much appreciated

I'd bet you get at least 2 out of 3. Apply early and ED if you're absolutely set on one of them.

From what I've gathered, Columbia can be particularly LSAT-oriented. If you ED, you've got a great chance.

First, a quick background: I applied for law school 6 years after I finished my BA, and in the meantime I worked full-time and did an MA. That said, given the similarity of our numbers, I doubt that will make that much of a difference b/t our experiences.

I ED'd at NYU with a 3.5/177, because I was completely sure I wanted to be there and didn't want to take any chances given my GPA (not from a prestigious school). Judging from how the cycle played out for those who post on TLS, I probably would have been okay regular decision. But for me, I was 100% sure of NYU and didn't want to take the risk. In your position, if you're not sure where you'd like to end up and you would be happy anywhere in the T6, I'm not sure I'd ED.

One important consideration is scholarship money. I ended up getting some scholarship money from NYU even as an ED admit, but I was very surprised about that (pleasantly, needless to say!) But general wisdom does say that applying ED can reduce your chances for (or perhaps amount of) scholarship aid.

Best of luck!

camelcrema wrote:From what I've gathered, Columbia can be particularly LSAT-oriented. If you ED, you've got a great chance.

I've heard that more in reference to NYU than Columbia.

Based on playing around with numbers on LSP, they both are more friendly towards a disparity than Chicago, and I know I keep hearing on these boards that Chicago wants to increase its GPA median above the 3.72 or w/e it's at now.

My only concern with ED is the possibility of scholarships from MVP, but I feel like my GPA would prevent getting a significant amount, especially from Penn. Thoughts?

Cornellian12 wrote:Based on playing around with numbers on LSP, they both are more friendly towards a disparity than Chicago, and I know I keep hearing on these boards that Chicago wants to increase its GPA median above the 3.72 or w/e it's at now.

My only concern with ED is the possibility of scholarships from MVP, but I feel like my GPA would prevent getting a significant amount, especially from Penn. Thoughts?

Where and what do you want to practice? This is important; but then again, it is CCN, which is mobile. Where do you want to live for 3 years?

No need to apply ED. In fact, I think it would be a poor choice, because you have a chance at some money otherwise.

3.57, 177 here and applied at the very end of the cycle (for class of '13). Currently enjoying NYU.

This year, its less competitive (~10% reduction in LSATs means ~10% fewer 176-177s, etc. to go around). NYU and Columbia have big classes and need to get a huge portion of the high LSAT scorers available in order to keep their ranges so high. They aren't going to think twice about that GPA. It might be slighly below the range but it doesn't matter; high LSATs are fixed in quantity. As anecdotal evidence, my friend this year got in with the same score (177) and a lower GPA than me with less work experience, and got $25k as well.

Cornellian12 wrote:Based on playing around with numbers on LSP, they both are more friendly towards a disparity than Chicago, and I know I keep hearing on these boards that Chicago wants to increase its GPA median above the 3.72 or w/e it's at now.

My only concern with ED is the possibility of scholarships from MVP, but I feel like my GPA would prevent getting a significant amount, especially from Penn. Thoughts?

A 177/3.5 got a Darrow at Michigan this year. Just one that I can think of off the top of my head, but basically I think you will get into some of CCN RD (potentially with scholarships) and I feel good about your chances of scholarships in MVP. Maybe I'm too optimistic, but I think you'd be crazy to ED anywhere.

Cornellian12 wrote:Based on playing around with numbers on LSP, they both are more friendly towards a disparity than Chicago, and I know I keep hearing on these boards that Chicago wants to increase its GPA median above the 3.72 or w/e it's at now.

My only concern with ED is the possibility of scholarships from MVP, but I feel like my GPA would prevent getting a significant amount, especially from Penn. Thoughts?

Check out http://www.lawschoolnumbers.com/. It will give you an excellent idea of what to expect based on your numbers.

As far as MVP, Virginia is incredibly unlikely unless you ED (which I would not recommend) or you are a URM. Michigan should be a a go with some scholarship money (they like high LSATs), and Penn will likely not be a possibility because of the affinity with high GPA candidates. That said, I think you have a good shot at CCN and certainly have a change to receive money from at least one of them.

Best of luck.

Cornellian12 wrote:Based on playing around with numbers on LSP, they both are more friendly towards a disparity than Chicago, and I know I keep hearing on these boards that Chicago wants to increase its GPA median above the 3.72 or w/e it's at now.

My only concern with ED is the possibility of scholarships from MVP, but I feel like my GPA would prevent getting a significant amount, especially from Penn. Thoughts?

Check out http://www.lawschoolnumbers.com/. It will give you an excellent idea of what to expect based on your numbers.

As far as MVP, Virginia is incredibly unlikely unless you ED (which I would not recommend) or you are a URM. Michigan should be a a go with some scholarship money (they like high LSATs), and Penn will likely not be a possibility because of the affinity with high GPA candidates. That said, I think you have a good shot at CCN and certainly have a change to receive money from at least one of them.

Best of luck.

nycgaga wrote:No need to apply ED. In fact, I think it would be a poor choice, because you have a chance at some money otherwise.

3.57, 177 here and applied at the very end of the cycle (for class of '13). Currently enjoying NYU.

This year, its less competitive (~10% reduction in LSATs means ~10% fewer 176-177s, etc. to go around). NYU and Columbia have big classes and need to get a huge portion of the high LSAT scorers available in order to keep their ranges so high. They aren't going to think twice about that GPA. It might be slighly below the range but it doesn't matter; high LSATs are fixed in quantity. As anecdotal evidence, my friend this year got in with the same score (177) and a lower GPA than me with less work experience, and got $25k as well.

On seeing more anecdotal evidence for scores/grades like mine, I think this is good advice. In the end, even with ED I got the same scholarship money, but with 20/20 hindsight, I wouldn't have risked scholarship money by ED-ing.

I think you're going to get NYU even without the ED. http://nyu.lawschoolnumbers.com/stats/1011/. I think you have good shots at Columbia and Chicago too, but those seem harder to predict (especially Chicago).

I'm a 3.63 173 applicant and have been advised not to ED to NYU or Chicago because I have a shot there without ED. If I have a shot, so do you

Apply regular decision to all three. I had the same GPA and a lower LSAT and I managed to get into all three of them.

(Non-URM, but some softs might've given me a slight boost... hard to tell.)

I appreciate the feedback everybody. This forum in general has been extremely helpful in my pre-law process. Thanks!

I don't see much of a boost from applying ED at CCN schools.

I think you have a very very good shot at getting all three of CCN with those #s. I had friends with lower GPAs and around the same LSATs who got into CLS and NYU

Desert Fox wrote:I don't see much of a boost from applying ED at CCN schools.

Its pretty big at Columbia. 4.5 index vs 4.3

Curry wrote:

Desert Fox wrote:I don't see much of a boost from applying ED at CCN schools.

Its pretty big at Columbia. 4.5 index vs 4.3

How do you know this? Not doubting, just curious.

Desert Fox wrote:

Curry wrote:

Desert Fox wrote:I don't see much of a boost from applying ED at CCN schools.

Its pretty big at Columbia. 4.5 index vs 4.3

How do you know this? Not doubting, just curious.

LSN. The acceptances from ED tend to be 4.3+ while through RD are 4.5+. Someone in the columbia thread this year did a lengthy analysis of it but I don't know where it went.

Curry wrote:

Desert Fox wrote:

Curry wrote:

Desert Fox wrote:I don't see much of a boost from applying ED at CCN schools.

Its pretty big at Columbia. 4.5 index vs 4.3

How do you know this? Not doubting, just curious.

LSN. The acceptances from ED tend to be 4.3+ while through RD are 4.5+. Someone in the columbia thread this year did a lengthy analysis of it but I don't know where it went.

Is that an average, or a lower cut off. Because average wouldn't be a good way to view them. Because the same of ED is going to have lower indexes, just because 4.0/180 isn't EDing to CLS because they are competitive at HYS.

Desert Fox wrote: Is that an average, or a lower cut off. Because average wouldn't be a good way to view them. Because the same of ED is going to have lower indexes, just because 4.0/180 isn't EDing to CLS because they are competitive at HYS.

Lower cut off.

Cornellian12 wrote:Hey guys,

Got my final grades back, so it's time to actually do one of these...

3.63 GPA, 176 one-time LSAT score; average softs: a few leadership positions, wrote for electronic journal for 3 years, doing independent research this summer. Part time work throughout last year and a half at school, and full-time work every summer.

Planning to apply to CCN down, but wondering specifically if my lower GPA is going to ding me in the T6? General chances advice for rest of T14 would be very much appreciated

As a 3.64, ~177 LSAT, I can say with confidence that you will do well at CCN if you apply early.

Thought I would post here since we have very similar numbers - same LSAT but my GPA is a bit lower. I didn't ED anywhere and got in at Columbia and NYU, but no $ from either. I also think that you shouldn't worry much about conventional wisdom on schools that prefer high GPAs. For example, I was accepted to Berkeley with a great scholarship yet waitlisted at Chicago + MVPD. Not what I was expecting based on the prediction sites and trends on LSN, but I couldn't be happier. Good luck!