Top Law Schools

Hi all,

I'm a 163/3.6 non-URM. I'm right out of undergrad with not-so-great extra curriculars. I worked three part-time jobs averaging about 40 hours per week though FWIW. I tried to chance myself on LSP, but for about half of my choices it just says "Consider" rather than "Strong Consider" or "Admit".

Reach:
W&L
W&M
BC - I would like to stay in VA after graduation, but I really loved Boston when I visited.

Target:
UNC
George Mason
American
Maryland

Safety:
Pitt
WVU - I'm from WV and they assured me I would most likely get a full ride there

If you have any other suggestions of where I should apply for VA placement please let me know!!

Thanks!

WL / out at reaches most likely, especially BC.

Out at UNC since not in-state.

Why no Wake Forest? Most likely in with some money.

Thanks for the input! I haven't even really considered Wake, but I'll definitely look into it.

Yeah I kind of figured I was out at W&M and W&L. I got a 163 on my first LSAT and retook in Oct. I was consistently scoring around 170 on practice tests, and was really surprised when I got a 157 on the actual test. I was really counting on those few extra points, but I still want to apply because I absolutely love W&M and W&L.

kroger03 wrote:Thanks for the input! I haven't even really considered Wake, but I'll definitely look into it.

Yeah I kind of figured I was out at W&M and W&L. I got a 163 on my first LSAT and retook in Oct. I was consistently scoring around 170 on practice tests, and was really surprised when I got a 157 on the actual test. I was really counting on those few extra points, but I still want to apply because I absolutely love W&M and W&L.

If you were scoring that high, I'd retake again in December if you can. A couple more points will help your cycle a great deal.

Probably in with some money at Richmond too...

I was considering retaking, but I decided against it. I took a few practice tests last week with scores right around 163. I just don't think I really have enough time to dedicate to hardcore studying. This is my final semester and my workload has been hectic and is likely to get worse leading up to finals. I think that scrambling to take the test with the chance of getting another low score will really hurt me.

I noticed that my stats matched up with the medians of Ohio State. I haven't seen many postings about it on the forums so I was wondering how the placement is around the DC/VA area. I'm guessing not that great, but I really have no idea.

Out at reaches, in at targets and safeties. I would add Wake Forest and Richmond.

Thanks, yeah I should definitely consider Richmond since I'm looking to stay in VA. About how much scholarship do you think I could get, if any?

You'd get something for sure at Richmond. They seem pretty generous, and your stats are right up there for them. I wouldn't go to Ohio State with plans on coming back to VA.

A rudimentary search on Martindale puts the number of active attorneys from Ohio State in Virgina at 45.

Thanks Aqualibrium, I'll keep that in mind.

Any other input?

kroger03 wrote:Hi all,

I'm a 163/3.6 non-URM. I'm right out of undergrad with not-so-great extra curriculars. I worked three part-time jobs averaging about 40 hours per week though FWIW. I tried to chance myself on LSP, but for about half of my choices it just says "Consider" rather than "Strong Consider" or "Admit".

Reach:
W&L- in
W&M- ?
BC - I would like to stay in VA after graduation, but I really loved Boston when I visited.-?

Target:
UNC- In/WL
George Mason- in
American- in
Maryland- in

Safety:
Pitt- in
WVU - I'm from WV and they assured me I would most likely get a full ride there

If you have any other suggestions of where I should apply for VA placement please let me know!!

Thanks!

W&L is pretty friendly to applicants with your score range, according to LSN. BC is a ? because they are SO unpredictable!

Thank you! That is such good news to hear because W&L is my top choice...I'm just hoping LSN is a good predictor...

I have the same numbers as yours, although an international applicant, but I got rejected by W&L a week after completion. I thought with those numbers I should at least be waitlisted...since on LSN most people with similar numbers last year were admit/waitlist and there were no rejections.

But i think it's still worth a shot, good luck!

Yeah I'll definitely need some luck. I'm expecting the waitlist and I'm surprised that they didn't do that for you. Did you apply to any of the other schools I'm looking at?

kroger03 wrote:Yeah I'll definitely need some luck. I'm expecting the waitlist and I'm surprised that they didn't do that for you. Did you apply to any of the other schools I'm looking at?

Xq might have been rejected because s/he is overseas. W&L is such a small law school, it's a rare student that comes from overseas. So I think they're a little more cautious with overseas applicants, unfortunately.

I thought that probably played a role in getting a rejection rather than being waitlisted, but I wasn't positive about it.

kroger03 wrote:I thought that probably played a role in getting a rejection rather than being waitlisted, but I wasn't positive about it.

Kroger, I just want to chime in again:

Your numbers put you on the higher end of Richmond and Pitt's scales. So, of the schools you've listed, those are the two you stand to get the most scholarship money from (and of course WVU).

For you, pulling off a few acceptances at some of your reaches may not be the best thing unless you can get some cash to offset the debt. Especially since you want to ultimately practice in Virginia. BC is a great school, but at sticker, for someone who wants to practice in VA, it's probably not the best idea. W&M and W&L are also very good schools, but without any cash to offset the cost, the relative job struggles of all law students ITE, and the probability that you'll get a pretty sizable scholarship from Richmond, they probably aren't your best bet either.

Just something to chew on. I know a lot of people consider it a dream to get into a reach school, and they look at those rankings thinking it justifies the cost. That is not a good idea. Give yourself the best chance to succeed, but a good cushion if things don't go quite as planned.

Aqua, thanks for the advice. I definitely need to consider the scholarship money that comes my way when I decide where to go. It will just be hard to decline an offer from a school I've had on my mind for about a year now (if I even get in at all). But I see where turning it down to go to a less expensive school is valuable after I get out.

What do you think of Wake? I've been looking into it a good bit and they seem very generous with scholarship money and they appear to place well in Virginia for being located in a different state.

kroger03 wrote:Aqua, thanks for the advice. I definitely need to consider the scholarship money that comes my way when I decide where to go. It will just be hard to decline an offer from a school I've had on my mind for about a year now (if I even get in at all). But I see where turning it down to go to a less expensive school is valuable after I get out.

What do you think of Wake? I've been looking into it a good bit and they seem very generous with scholarship money and they appear to place well in Virginia for being located in a different state.

As I was writing my earlier comment, I was actually thinking to myself "Wake with money wouldn't be such a bad idea either." The fact is, you're going to have to do very well at Wake, Richmond, W&L or W&M to get the type of job that really justifies going into significant educational debt. From Wake or Richmond, your debt load will significantly be reduced. Life isn't easier by any means for students at W&M or W&L, so why pay the significant mark up?

If the difference was sticker or close to it at UVA vs. a lot of money at W&L/M, you're in a different situation. In that instance, you're looking at the ability to have solid job placement in a wider range of places, all the way down to median (and perhaps a bit lower for students with stellar interviewing skills and or great resumes) at UVA vs. needing to be in the top 25% at minimum from W&L/M for a comparatively limited range of opportunities.

Richmond or Wake with a lot of money vs. W&M/L at close to sticker isn't the same argument. ITE, you need to be in the top 25% at a minimum regardless of which one of these schools you go to, and they are all geographically limited to some extent. So why pay significantly more for the name?

I'm also a big advocate of straying a bit beyond your state lines if you can attend a strong regional school nearby with a big scholarship (because again, you need great grades from either school). I'll use myself as an example: I am a resident of one Southern state, but ended up going to a strong school in another Southern state with a full ride. That gave me the ability to rely on my home state as a fall back, tap into the state my law school was in as sort of an oci target, tap into nearby regions like Georgia and Florida, and then try my hand in places like DC and Virginia because I had pretty good grades. It was a situation I kinda lucked into, because I wasn't thinking that way when I enrolled. I'm happy now that it went that way though, and I now encourage people whose best hopes are largely regional schools to look at little things like that. It worked out really well for me, I got offers back home, in my school's market, in Georgia, in Florida, and in DC/VA. The best part is, I did it for free, so if I hadn't done as well in school as I would have liked, there would be no significant debt burden hanging over my head.

Like I said earlier, that doesn't mean you should go to OSU with dreams of returning to VA, but Wake to VA makes sense because it's close, and you've got strong ties.

Yeah I see where attending W&M/L would really be pointless without any money, especially if I can get into Wake or Richmond with some. After reading your last post, I'm really hoping on getting into Wake with some money so I can go to a school in the Virginia area, but still have the option of employment in NC. Your insight has been really helpful Aqua and I really appreciate it!