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Hi all,

Before I get a barrage of retake advice, hear me out :p

I'm planning on applying this cycle, even though I scored 10 points lower on my Oct LSAT than my practice tests. I'd like to see where I can get in, without retaking the test. My parents are footing the bill, so I can't complain much. If this cycle turns out poorly, I'll most definitely retake the test next June and apply at the beginning of next cycle.

Concerning ED, which school do I have the best chance at? I'm thinking, even though slim, UVA would be a good choice, because they state it can increase the chances of applicants with numbers under their median, or Duke. Possibly Michigan?

Any advice will be appreciated. I have 3 strong LORs, and a fantastic personal statement (IMHO, along with a few other respected sources) and decent/average softs (Judicial externship in sophomore year of undergrad, RA for 2 years in undergrad). Along with those schools, I'll be applying RD to Cal (LSP has me at 'consider') USC, UCLA and Cornell, Georgetown.

Thanks for your help!

Maybe Boalt??? I would prolly try UVA first though

WhatToDo21 wrote:Maybe Boalt??? I would prolly try UVA first though

Yeah, I'll be applying no doubt, but no ED for Boalt.

Thanks for your input.

UVA, hands down. Otherwise, try Michigan.

dresden doll wrote:UVA, hands down. Otherwise, try Michigan.

Excellent! Would it be feasible to ED Michigan first, then ED UVA if Michigan falls through? It says on Michigan's website that they submit their notification on or before December 15, and that's the deadline for UVA's ED (or so it says on Appreqs) . How likely is it that I'd be informed at least a few days in advance, enough time to ED UVA?

Also, is there an actual deadline for ED for UVA? On their website, it doesn't any date explicitly.

UVA has eliminated its ED deadline - you can apply ED at any time before the RD deadline. So yes, you could ED Michigan and then ED UVA.

broker02 wrote:UVA has eliminated its ED deadline - you can apply ED at any time before the RD deadline. So yes, you could ED Michigan and then ED UVA.

This is probably your best bet. By and by, I hear Michigan really does believe in (at least somewhat) holistic admissions.

dresden doll wrote:

broker02 wrote:UVA has eliminated its ED deadline - you can apply ED at any time before the RD deadline. So yes, you could ED Michigan and then ED UVA.

This is probably your best bet. By and by, I hear Michigan really does believe in (at least somewhat) holistic admissions.

That's wonderful, because I really feel my softs, LORs and personal statement do speak to qualities that could offset my unfortunate LSAT score.

Thanks for your help! It's greatly appreciated.

So I'm in a VERY similar predicament (different numbers though: 3.6x/168), and my parents are footing the bill for this cycle too. I considered ED but my concern with ED is that I would then possibly be committed to attending a school that is still not as good as one I could get into if (WHEN) I pull my LSAT score up with a February retake.

ED only if you would've gone to that school (Without $s) even with a 173 LSAT that put you in CCN/possibly H range. Those are just my $0.02.

Edit: I'm also barely 21 and still in undergrad and am rather excited about exploring the real world next year so your situation might be different and you might really want to start in 2011, I don't know.

applepiecrust wrote:So I'm in a VERY similar predicament (different numbers though: 3.6x/168), and my parents are footing the bill for this cycle too. I considered ED but my concern with ED is that I would then possibly be committed to attending a school that is still not as good as one I could get into if (WHEN) I pull my LSAT score up with a February retake.

ED only if you would've gone to that school (Without $s) even with a 173 LSAT that put you in CCN/possibly H range. Those are just my $0.02.

Edit: I'm also barely 21 and still in undergrad and am rather excited about exploring the real world next year so your situation might be different and you might really want to start in 2011, I don't know.

I understand what you're saying. I'm 21, and graduating this December of my senior year. I understand that a higher score could possibly put me in a T6 school, but the October test was my second time taking the test (cancelled in June) and even though I was PT averaging 173 and felt really good about the test, I had no clue I was going to do that bad. So... I'm slightly deterred at this point from retaking the test for fear of doing possibly worse, or the same.

Additionally, going to a school ranked 9th or 10th compared with 5th doesn't bother me too much. Fingers crossed the economy bounces back after 4 more years when we graduate. The salary difference between graduating from those schools isn't great enough to deter me if I ED.

treeborn wrote:

applepiecrust wrote:So I'm in a VERY similar predicament (different numbers though: 3.6x/168), and my parents are footing the bill for this cycle too. I considered ED but my concern with ED is that I would then possibly be committed to attending a school that is still not as good as one I could get into if (WHEN) I pull my LSAT score up with a February retake.

ED only if you would've gone to that school (Without $s) even with a 173 LSAT that put you in CCN/possibly H range. Those are just my $0.02.

Edit: I'm also barely 21 and still in undergrad and am rather excited about exploring the real world next year so your situation might be different and you might really want to start in 2011, I don't know.

I understand what you're saying. I'm 21, and graduating this December of my senior year. I understand that a higher score could possibly put me in a T6 school, but the October test was my second time taking the test (cancelled in June) and even though I was PT averaging 173 and felt really good about the test, I had no clue I was going to do that bad. So... I'm slightly deterred at this point from retaking the test for fear of doing possibly worse, or the same.

Additionally, going to a school ranked 9th or 10th compared with 5th doesn't bother me too much. Fingers crossed the economy bounces back after 4 more years when we graduate. The salary difference between graduating from those schools isn't great enough to deter me if I ED.

If you were averaging 173, you should def. retake. I doubt you will do worse than a ten point drop the second time around.

broker02 wrote:UVA has eliminated its ED deadline - you can apply ED at any time before the RD deadline. So yes, you could ED Michigan and then ED UVA.

don't mean to hijack this thread, but you can ED to UVA whenever you want?

i can wait to hear back from other schools.....?

Mike12188 wrote:

treeborn wrote:

applepiecrust wrote:So I'm in a VERY similar predicament (different numbers though: 3.6x/168), and my parents are footing the bill for this cycle too. I considered ED but my concern with ED is that I would then possibly be committed to attending a school that is still not as good as one I could get into if (WHEN) I pull my LSAT score up with a February retake.

ED only if you would've gone to that school (Without $s) even with a 173 LSAT that put you in CCN/possibly H range. Those are just my $0.02.

Edit: I'm also barely 21 and still in undergrad and am rather excited about exploring the real world next year so your situation might be different and you might really want to start in 2011, I don't know.

I understand what you're saying. I'm 21, and graduating this December of my senior year. I understand that a higher score could possibly put me in a T6 school, but the October test was my second time taking the test (cancelled in June) and even though I was PT averaging 173 and felt really good about the test, I had no clue I was going to do that bad. So... I'm slightly deterred at this point from retaking the test for fear of doing possibly worse, or the same.

Additionally, going to a school ranked 9th or 10th compared with 5th doesn't bother me too much. Fingers crossed the economy bounces back after 4 more years when we graduate. The salary difference between graduating from those schools isn't great enough to deter me if I ED.

If you were averaging 173, you should def. retake. I doubt you will do worse than a ten point drop the second time around.

I suppose the chances are low, but what were the chances I'd score 10 points lower than my PT average, the second time taking the test (already knowledgeable of test conditions, timing etc)? That's my realistic/pessimistic attitude at this point.

dresden doll wrote:

broker02 wrote:UVA has eliminated its ED deadline - you can apply ED at any time before the RD deadline. So yes, you could ED Michigan and then ED UVA.

This is probably your best bet. By and by, I hear Michigan really does believe in (at least somewhat) holistic admissions.

Related question. If this is indeed possible (ED-ing UVA after ED-ing somewhere else), does ED-ing UVA in December give me better chance than RD-ing in mid-November??? I'm sure ED has a merit over RD, but is it gonna offset the one-month delay???

goodcharles wrote:

dresden doll wrote:

broker02 wrote:UVA has eliminated its ED deadline - you can apply ED at any time before the RD deadline. So yes, you could ED Michigan and then ED UVA.

This is probably your best bet. By and by, I hear Michigan really does believe in (at least somewhat) holistic admissions.

Related question. If this is indeed possible (ED-ing UVA after ED-ing somewhere else), does ED-ing UVA in December give me better chance than RD-ing in mid-November??? I'm sure ED has a merit over RD, but is it gonna offset the one-month delay???

It seems it does increase your chances.

This is a quote from the UVA profile from TLS

Early Decision:

Students who fall below Virginia Law’s medians can increase their chances of admission by applying Early Decision. Trujillo says:

If we are going to “reach” for someone, it will often be through the early decision process. Virginia is, for some applicants, truly their dream school and they apply early decision. If I can make that person’s dream a reality, I will strive to do so.

You can also RD in November, then ED in December by sending in the ED form through the mail.

treeborn wrote:

Mike12188 wrote:

treeborn wrote:

applepiecrust wrote:So I'm in a VERY similar predicament (different numbers though: 3.6x/168), and my parents are footing the bill for this cycle too. I considered ED but my concern with ED is that I would then possibly be committed to attending a school that is still not as good as one I could get into if (WHEN) I pull my LSAT score up with a February retake.

ED only if you would've gone to that school (Without $s) even with a 173 LSAT that put you in CCN/possibly H range. Those are just my $0.02.

Edit: I'm also barely 21 and still in undergrad and am rather excited about exploring the real world next year so your situation might be different and you might really want to start in 2011, I don't know.

I understand what you're saying. I'm 21, and graduating this December of my senior year. I understand that a higher score could possibly put me in a T6 school, but the October test was my second time taking the test (cancelled in June) and even though I was PT averaging 173 and felt really good about the test, I had no clue I was going to do that bad. So... I'm slightly deterred at this point from retaking the test for fear of doing possibly worse, or the same.

Additionally, going to a school ranked 9th or 10th compared with 5th doesn't bother me too much. Fingers crossed the economy bounces back after 4 more years when we graduate. The salary difference between graduating from those schools isn't great enough to deter me if I ED.

If you were averaging 173, you should def. retake. I doubt you will do worse than a ten point drop the second time around.

I suppose the chances are low, but what were the chances I'd score 10 points lower than my PT average, the second time taking the test (already knowledgeable of test conditions, timing etc)? That's my realistic/pessimistic attitude at this point.

fair, but the goodness of going up supersedes the negative impact going down will have on your cycle--that's why i retook. if we take the top 5 out of the equation and a few others here and there, a 180 and a 150 is better than a 170.

treeborn wrote:
You can also RD in November, then ED in December by sending in the ED form through the mail.

Sweet! Thanks for the info!

Do you know which schools give most weight to softs? My numbers are a little weak for T-14, so I'm counting on my strong softs like you. I'd wanna ED where they actually care about something other than numbers

goodcharles wrote:

treeborn wrote:
You can also RD in November, then ED in December by sending in the ED form through the mail.

Sweet! Thanks for the info!

Do you know which schools give most weight to softs? My numbers are a little weak for T-14, so I'm counting on my strong softs like you. I'd wanna ED where they actually care about something other than numbers

From what I hear, Berkeley and Michigan both use a more holistic method than most.