Top Law Schools

Hello everyone, I've been following the forums for a long time now but today I finally pop my TLS cherry with a post of my own

I have a 3.5 from UCLA, got a 169 this Oct. URM: Muslim Afghan-American. First-generation American, son of war refugees.

I'm applying to 20 schools, most of which I believe are reach schools, so I'm hoping at least one of them accepts me.

I'm realistic in thinking I have nary a chance at any of the T15 schools, but I'm still hopeful and trying. I think the last 5 are the only ones I have even close to a good shot at. But I really don't want to attend any of those unless one of the T15 don't work out :/ I'm okay with any of the top 1-15 schools though. Beggars can't be choosers. The schools I'm applying to are:

Yale
Harvard
Stanford
Columbia
NYU
Chicago
Cal
Penn
Mich
Duke
Northwestern
UVA
Cornell
UCLA
Georgetown
USC
Boston Univ.
UC Davis
UC Hastings
Loyola
My LORs are solid or even great, I'd say. I'm going to get Evals done also by some people. Working on my PS right now but I'll definitely be putting in the time to make that stellar as well.
But my strongest soft asset is my resume. I was heavily involved on-campus (thus the lower GPA unfortunately). I have most of the main points listed below in case it would make any difference, but only if you want to read it of course.

Won the Chancellor's Service Award for being one of the most active members of the UCLA community, VP of the most active Muslim Student Assoc. in America, was the Campaign Manager then Chief of Staff of the UCLA President, founded the event BruINTENT (where students sleep outside in tents for a night and raise money for homelessness), Managing Editor of the first and largest Muslim student-run Newsmagazine in the US, interned at the Embassy of Afghanistan in DC directly under the Ambassador himself, CORO Fellowship Alternate Finalist, was an outreach coordinator for a project that tutored underprivileged high school youth in Watts,

and the extracurricular things I will be pushing on most:
I landed a teaching gig at the American University of Afghanistan in Kabul, where I will be teaching Afghan students English. It'll be for a semester from Jan-May I believe. It hasn't happened yet though, so how do I list that?
A PPIA Fellow (Public Policy and Int'l Affairs), from which only 60 students nationwide were selected to participate in.
Selected as one of 7 UCLA Bruins who will change the world, in Prime Magazine.
and I founded the United Afghan Club my sophomore year, my personal favorite, because we built 10 libraries in Afghanistan, raised $10000 in vitamins and money for Afghan orphans, held teach-ins on the War, raised $30000 to build wells in desolate Afghan villages, had one of the largest clothing & school supply drives for Afghanistan in the nation, when we sent 5 tons of clothing and school supplies to the country during its harsh winter, created the Afghan Mentorship Alliance where we tutor and peer advise underserved Afghan-American youth, and created the first annual Afghan College Day, where we invited Afghan students from across the state to come to UCLA for a daylong conference emphasizing the importance of education and assisting students in their personal quest to attend college.

Sorry if I wrote too much, I just know it's better to have a lot of info out there that can help rather than not enough.

Didn't read all of it but...

First thing - you aren't a URM. Middle Eastern is not URM sorry.

You can take off almost all of the t14 schools other than the bottom 5 maybe.

whymeohgodno wrote:Didn't read all of it but...

First thing - you aren't a URM. Middle Eastern is not URM sorry.

You can take off almost all of the t14 schools other than the bottom 5 maybe.

+1
He can probably keep Cornell on the list, but he’ll have to have an awesome PS.

Thank you for your reply, but I just wanted to clear up a common misunderstanding. Afghans are not middle easterners. If anything we're Central Asian. There may be a lot of Persians in law schools, and even Arabs, but there are hardly any Afghans. And Muslims in general are URM in law schools.

Tursion wrote:Thank you for your reply, but I just wanted to clear up a common misunderstanding. Afghans are not middle easterners. If anything we're Central Asian. There may be a lot of Persians in law schools, and even Arabs, but there are hardly any Afghans. And Muslims in general are URM in law schools.

URM = black, Native American, Mexican, and Puerto Rican. Sorry bro.

Tursion wrote:Thank you for your reply, but I just wanted to clear up a common misunderstanding. Afghans are not middle easterners. If anything we're Central Asian. There may be a lot of Persians in law schools, and even Arabs, but there are hardly any Afghans. And Muslims in general are URM in law schools.

I understand what you are saying, but as far as schools are concerned, we don't really see URM boosts for anything outside of African, Hispanic, or Native American. You are none of those so I don't expect you to get much of a boost. Also, being Muslim is practicing a religion, not being of a certain race. And schools definitely do not give religion based boosts. But, you seem like you may have an interesting story which may help you jump into some of the lower t14, but I would wager the VAST majority of schools on your list will out right deny you.

You probably still have a solid shot at Cornell though?

whymeohgodno wrote:You probably still have a solid shot at Cornell though?

I’ve already said that.

Ohh thanks for the insight, wow so really that's basically it for URM? I was totally mistaken then, because I assumed they look at URM as sexual orientation, ethnicity, religion, everything. Even if I'm a first-gen American and first-gen college student? That's fascinating (and heart-breaking) :/

Anyways, so you all think no shot except at maybe Cornell huh? Resume and other softs just won't cut it enough yeah?

Can I getta Michigan ED?

Tursion wrote:Ohh thanks for the insight, wow so really that's basically it for URM? I was totally mistaken then, because I assumed they look at URM as sexual orientation, ethnicity, religion, everything. Even if I'm a first-gen American and first-gen college student? That's fascinating (and heart-breaking) :/

Anyways, so you all think no shot except at maybe Cornell huh? Resume and other softs just won't cut it enough yeah?

Softs rarely cut it.

Tursion wrote:Ohh thanks for the insight, wow so really that's basically it for URM? I was totally mistaken then, because I assumed they look at URM as sexual orientation, ethnicity, religion, everything. Even if I'm a first-gen American and first-gen college student? That's fascinating (and heart-breaking) :/

Anyways, so you all think no shot except at maybe Cornell huh? Resume and other softs just won't cut it enough yeah?

You have a shot at Michigan and Gtown. Cornell is a pretty good shot. Everything else in the t14 is likely to be a reject.

Tursion wrote:Ohh thanks for the insight, wow so really that's basically it for URM? I was totally mistaken then, because I assumed they look at URM as sexual orientation, ethnicity, religion, everything. Even if I'm a first-gen American and first-gen college student? That's fascinating (and heart-breaking) :/

Anyways, so you all think no shot except at maybe Cornell huh? Resume and other softs just won't cut it enough yeah?

There is some indication that sexual orientation with a good diversity statement may help a VERY small amount. But cornell and ranked lower is where you are looking ok at. Now, you do seem like you have a good story so with a GREAT PS and a diversity statement about your parents be refugees and you being a first generation college student then you may be able to squeak out something in the 8-14 range, but I wouldn't count on it.

beachbum wrote:Can I getta Michigan ED?

this is the best chance with a great PS at anything higher than cornell.

Patriot1208 wrote:

beachbum wrote:Can I getta Michigan ED?

this is the best chance with a great PS at anything higher than cornell.

Yep!

I would bet a lot of (loan) money that you will be admitted at Michigan. I think Dean Z really does stick to a holistic admissions process if your numbers are in the ball park. If you apply ED, you'll be a sure thing. But I think other T-10 schools will accept you too because of your story, so if you don't REALLY want to go to Michigan (and you should, its a great school), don't ED. Also, go Bruins.

Ok thanks a lot I appreciate your honesty everyone. Truth hurts eh?

Does this help at all: my friend at Boalt is close with the Dean and put in a good word for me, and he asked her to email my name so he can be on the lookout for my application. She did, and he replied telling her he will keep that in mind and definitely look out for my app.

Also, I keep hearing conflicting things, that Boalt is either really big on GPA (from TLS forums), or that it really takes into account leadership experience and service to the community, even if it's a bit at the expense of GPA (from a BUNCH of people currently at Boalt).

Tursion wrote:Ok thanks a lot I appreciate your honesty everyone. Truth hurts eh?

Does this help at all: my friend at Boalt is close with the Dean and put in a good word for me, and he asked her to email my name so he can be on the lookout for my application. She did, and he replied telling her he will keep that in mind and definitely look out for my app.

Also, I keep hearing conflicting things, that Boalt is either really big on GPA (from TLS forums), or that it really takes into account leadership experience and service to the community, even if it's a bit at the expense of GPA (from a BUNCH of people currently at Boalt).

You have no shot at Boalt.

Oh and one more thing (I'm really sorry I keep reposting), I just didn't think this would make a difference in admissions but I see others posting it too, so I guess I should throw it out there.

I'm applying to joint JD/Masters programs (Masters in Public Policy or Int'l Relations) as well to almost all of the schools I've listed. They are two entirely separate app processes, and I believe they don't affect admit decisions...or do they?

whymeohgodno wrote:

Tursion wrote:Ok thanks a lot I appreciate your honesty everyone. Truth hurts eh?

Does this help at all: my friend at Boalt is close with the Dean and put in a good word for me, and he asked her to email my name so he can be on the lookout for my application. She did, and he replied telling her he will keep that in mind and definitely look out for my app.

Also, I keep hearing conflicting things, that Boalt is either really big on GPA (from TLS forums), or that it really takes into account leadership experience and service to the community, even if it's a bit at the expense of GPA (from a BUNCH of people currently at Boalt).

You have no shot at Boalt.

I didn't want to be the “Negative Nancy.” Thanks!

(You were soooo freaking blunt) lol

Tursion wrote:Oh and one more thing (I'm really sorry I keep reposting), I just didn't think this would make a difference in admissions but I see others posting it too, so I guess I should throw it out there.

I'm applying to joint JD/Masters programs (Masters in Public Policy or Int'l Relations) as well to almost all of the schools I've listed. They are two entirely separate app processes, and I believe they don't affect admit decisions...or do they?

Why do you want this JD?

whymeohgodno wrote:

Tursion wrote:Ok thanks a lot I appreciate your honesty everyone. Truth hurts eh?

Does this help at all: my friend at Boalt is close with the Dean and put in a good word for me, and he asked her to email my name so he can be on the lookout for my application. She did, and he replied telling her he will keep that in mind and definitely look out for my app.

Also, I keep hearing conflicting things, that Boalt is either really big on GPA (from TLS forums), or that it really takes into account leadership experience and service to the community, even if it's a bit at the expense of GPA (from a BUNCH of people currently at Boalt).

You have no shot at Boalt.

I'm not sure- Boalt is a sucker for a good story. Write a compelling PS/DS and I think it's worth the app.

rad law wrote:

Tursion wrote:Oh and one more thing (I'm really sorry I keep reposting), I just didn't think this would make a difference in admissions but I see others posting it too, so I guess I should throw it out there.

I'm applying to joint JD/Masters programs (Masters in Public Policy or Int'l Relations) as well to almost all of the schools I've listed. They are two entirely separate app processes, and I believe they don't affect admit decisions...or do they?

Why do you want this JD?

I don't know if this is TMI but I think both degrees are integral to the work I want to do. I want to ideally work at some place like the UN in the hopes of reform and with the ultimate goal of assisting developing nations. So the JD can give me a crucial understanding of the legal system of functioning democracies like the United States, while the Masters hones in on the field I want to actually work in. If anything I only want to practice law for the first part of my career, but it's definitely not what I'd like to do my entire life.

Tursion wrote:

rad law wrote:

Tursion wrote:Oh and one more thing (I'm really sorry I keep reposting), I just didn't think this would make a difference in admissions but I see others posting it too, so I guess I should throw it out there.

I'm applying to joint JD/Masters programs (Masters in Public Policy or Int'l Relations) as well to almost all of the schools I've listed. They are two entirely separate app processes, and I believe they don't affect admit decisions...or do they?

Why do you want this JD?

I don't know if this is TMI but I think both degrees are integral to the work I want to do. I want to ideally work at some place like the UN in the hopes of reform and with the ultimate goal of assisting developing nations. So the JD can give me a crucial understanding of the legal system of functioning democracies like the United States, while the Masters hones in on the field I want to actually work in. If anything I only want to practice law for the first part of my career, but it's definitely not what I'd like to do my entire life.

Dude, apply to Cornell ASAP!

Tursion wrote:

rad law wrote:

Tursion wrote:Oh and one more thing (I'm really sorry I keep reposting), I just didn't think this would make a difference in admissions but I see others posting it too, so I guess I should throw it out there.

I'm applying to joint JD/Masters programs (Masters in Public Policy or Int'l Relations) as well to almost all of the schools I've listed. They are two entirely separate app processes, and I believe they don't affect admit decisions...or do they?

Why do you want this JD?

I don't know if this is TMI but I think both degrees are integral to the work I want to do. I want to ideally work at some place like the UN in the hopes of reform and with the ultimate goal of assisting developing nations. So the JD can give me a crucial understanding of the legal system of functioning democracies like the United States, while the Masters hones in on the field I want to actually work in. If anything I only want to practice law for the first part of my career, but it's definitely not what I'd like to do my entire life.

You will be better off getting into the best MPP possible and working your way up the career ladder.