Top Law Schools

GPA: 3.97
LSAT: 158 (cold), 161 (post testprep course)
URM: Female, dual citizen of US and Ireland, out of state applicant for University of Chicago

Soft factors: Summa Cum Laude; Graduated early; Research Fellow multiple years; Student representative on University Research Council; President of Student Organization; Secretary at school's chapter of nationally recognized honors society; Sorority; Working for a year in Chicago (admin./temp-to-hire) before applying to schools for 2011/12.

I moved to Chicago after graduating, but before I got my latest LSAT score back. Lawschoolnumbers.com posted 3 different applicants that got in to UofC with a 161 and a weaker GPA than mine. However, they were all URM. I'm from out of state, dual citizen, all helpful, but I know it's not the same.

Turning in my application as soon as they open for submissions in 2011. REALLY hesitant to take the test again. 3 LSATs is going to hurt my app, right? Plus, what if I only go up a couple points? What kind of things can I do now that I'm in Chicago (intern/work reception at a law firm) that would help my application?

3 LSATs probably hurts, but so does having a 161. I really don't think your chances are good at UChi. LSN shows zero acceptances for non-URM candidates below 167. Sorry to be a downer, but it's better to hear honest feedback on the internet now than in a year from a thin envelope.

Do you think you would be capable of raising your score significantly? It looks like taking a course didn't help much. If both of your official scores were well below your PTs, a third test may help and is probably your only shot at Chicago. If you are consistently in the 161 range, you should look at other schools in the area.

.

You're not getting into Chicago.
I wouldn't send an application unless you get a 164 or higher.
Even then, your chances aren't good unless you get a 169.

Seeing as how you are Irish, you should be trying to get as much money as possible out of Notre Dame. Great school, loyal alumni, and they place well in Chicago.

please retake... 3 LSATs doesn't hurt that much, your 161 does big time. You have a 3.97 GPA and worked hard during undergrad. Please don't waste it by half-assing your preparation for the LSAT. I'm sorry but if you got a 158 cold and only hit 161 after studying, you weren't really even trying to do well. Sorry if that seems harsh but you have to realize you have the potential do a lot better. Good luck!

clintonius wrote:LSN shows zero acceptances for non-URM candidates below 167.

irltxchi wrote:URM: Female

xyzzzzzzzz wrote:doesn't look like chicago is going to happen unless you can drastically bump your lsat score. sorry.

Dr. Strangelove wrote:You're not getting into Chicago.
I wouldn't send an application unless you get a 164 or higher.
Even then, your chances aren't good unless you get a 169.

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/Conqueror08/jd
http://lawschoolnumbers.com/leachristine/jd

Still, you should retake.

I have to disagree with the above posters, and I think you should apply. I had a similar LSAT to yours (160,162), and a lower GPA. While also being a URM, I was fortunate to be admitted to UofC. This goes to show that nobody knows what the admissions staff will think of your application- they may really like your personal statement, softs, etc. and it really isn't just about the numbers. Also, if you do apply I think it's a great idea to apply as early as possible (i.e. when the application first becomes available, as this goes a long way in showing your interest).

holydonkey wrote:

clintonius wrote:LSN shows zero acceptances for non-URM candidates below 167.

irltxchi wrote:URM: Female

xyzzzzzzzz wrote:doesn't look like chicago is going to happen unless you can drastically bump your lsat score. sorry.

Dr. Strangelove wrote:You're not getting into Chicago.
I wouldn't send an application unless you get a 164 or higher.
Even then, your chances aren't good unless you get a 169.

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/Conqueror08/jd
http://lawschoolnumbers.com/leachristine/jd

Still, you should retake.

Illinifan05 wrote:I have to disagree with the above posters, and I think you should apply. I had a similar LSAT to yours (160,162), and a lower GPA. While also being a URM, I was fortunate to be admitted to UofC. This goes to show that nobody knows what the admissions staff will think of your application- they may really like your personal statement, softs, etc. and it really isn't just about the numbers. Also, if you do apply I think it's a great idea to apply as early as possible (i.e. when the application first becomes available, as this goes a long way in showing your interest).

Illinifan05 and the two LSN profiles are all URMs, you are not. OP, as much as it sucks, you owe it to yourself to retake.

nycsoul87 wrote:

holydonkey wrote:

clintonius wrote:LSN shows zero acceptances for non-URM candidates below 167.

irltxchi wrote:URM: Female

xyzzzzzzzz wrote:doesn't look like chicago is going to happen unless you can drastically bump your lsat score. sorry.

Dr. Strangelove wrote:You're not getting into Chicago.
I wouldn't send an application unless you get a 164 or higher.
Even then, your chances aren't good unless you get a 169.

http://lawschoolnumbers.com/Conqueror08/jd
http://lawschoolnumbers.com/leachristine/jd

Still, you should retake.

they were both URM, OP is not.

Wait, 0P are you claiming you're URM because you're a woman and a dual citizen? Or are you saying you're a woman and dual citizen in addition to having URM?

Wait, 0P are you claiming you're URM because you're a woman and a dual citizen? Or are you saying you're a woman and dual citizen in addition to having URM?

No, I am not a URM. Am female and dual citizen, not URM.

irltxchi wrote:

Wait, 0P are you claiming you're URM because you're a woman and a dual citizen? Or are you saying you're a woman and dual citizen in addition to having URM?

No, I am not a URM. Am female and dual citizen, not URM.

Ah. Ok, then no question retake. RC fail on my part.

nycsoul87 wrote: Illinifan05 and the two LSN profiles are all URMs, you are not. OP, as much as it sucks, you owe it to yourself to retake.

Thanks for your honesty. I'm no dummy, and I appreciate hearing that even if the test kicked my ass. I took the Sept 2009 LSAT cold, then followed with LSAT Prep while trying to graduate strong for the LSAT Feb 2010. I'm afraid if I take the June LSAT I'll be rushing again. Should I buckle down on studying and take the Sept LSAT? But then my apps won't be the first one in, but they could still be early enough, right?

RickyRoe wrote:Seeing as how you are Irish, you should be trying to get as much money as possible out of Notre Dame. Great school, loyal alumni, and they place well in Chicago.

Really? They'd do that? Hmmm...

The September test will give you plenty of time to get your apps in -- you don't need to be the first to hit the admissions office's inbox to have a great shot. This third LSAT is your last shot without a school sponsoring you, so take the time you need to blow it out of the water.

If you only jumped three points from cold on the LSAT, you haven't come close to peaking. Work harder.

clintonius wrote:The September test will give you plenty of time to get your apps in -- you don't need to be the first to hit the admissions office's inbox to have a great shot. This third LSAT is your last shot without a school sponsoring you, so take the time you need to blow it out of the water.

I was going to recommend the same thing (though it's in October this year).

Look, with your GPA and softs, why do you want to blow a guaranteed t5 admission w/ money because of your LSAT score?? Take the October exams and take a regular prep course (not the BS 2-4 week ones) throughout the summer and into October. During the summer, read, read, and read!! Read whatever you can to improve your RC. Your LR and the games will be supported by the prep course, as well as study on your own. When it comes to law school and the potential of getting upwards of $100K to go to a t10 possibly, why not take your time and concentrate on your study regiment? If you have to, get a tutor. Expensive as hell, but with the potential big schollys, you'll make it all back and then some.

Uniquely rejected.

if you got a 158 cold... you should be able to get upper 160s... the vast majority of people should be able to improve by 10pts off their diagnostic.

Buy the LSAT logic games bible and logical reasoning bible.. both are good books

buy 10 of the real LSAT exams and take all of them

+1 to the self-study. Read through the Powerscore books and take many, many PTs.

irltxchi wrote: URM: Female, dual citizen of US and Ireland, out of state applicant for University of Chicago

University of Chicago is private, so in-state/out-of-state shouldn't matter outside of maybe "geographic diversity" reasons.

If you are set on U of C then you must retake. You dont have a chance with a 161 (with three scores, Im saying you need at least a 170 to get in since they will likely take the other scores into account). That being said, if you retake and get the same score (161) you might actually hurt your chances at more realistic schools.

But lets say you end up with a 170. You are still not going to have a great shot at U of C. Chicago tends to place more emphasis on UG major/difficulty of course work, compared to schools like NYU (based on anecdotes from LSN applicants). What was your major? Did you go dual degree (not double major, which is less impressive)? Research fellowship will help your chances, but it wont make up for raw numbers.

You would likely get a nice scholarship from Loyola and have access to the Chicago market. You might focus on U of Illinois too, youre numbers are more reasonable in the mid T1 range (but dont think you are sure to get in, your LSAT is just above their 25th).

If you take the test a third time, most schools start to average (or 'consider' all scores). I would stop focusing on t14 schools, there are a lot of other great schools out there that can get you access to the Chicago market (which you have a better shot at). I dont want to pop your balloon, just being honest.