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Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 12:20 am
by pink_law14
Hi Y'all...
Wanna weigh in on my chances? College Senior, 3.23 GPA and 154 LSAT, very strong recs, and major community involvement and other extracurriculars... let me know if you want more details?
I have applications at:
Ave Maria
Charleston
Catholic
George Mason
Widener
Villanova
Rutgers
Seton Hall
NY Law
St. John's
Pace
Brooklyn
Fordham
Any insight is appreciated
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 12:34 am
by jks289
pink_law14 wrote:Hi Y'all...
Wanna weigh in on my chances? College Senior, 3.23 GPA and 154 LSAT, very strong recs, and major community involvement and other extracurriculars... let me know if you want more details?
I have applications at:
Ave Maria (in)
Charleston (in)
Catholic (WL/out)
George Mason (out)
Widener (in)
Villanova (out)
Rutgers (out)
Seton Hall (Wl/in)
NY Law (in)
St. John's (out)
Pace (in)
Brooklyn (out)
Fordham (out)
Any insight is appreciated
This is all according to lawschoolpredictor.com. My insight is going to sound harsh but you need to hear it. Do not go to law school. Wait a year, add ten points to your LSAT and then think about it. Going to any of the schools of this list (especially the ones you might get into) would put you in serious debt, and offer no job prospects to get out of it. Bad news bears. Sorry,
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 12:40 am
by pink_law14
no job prospects from Pace or NY Law or Widener?
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 12:41 am
by Vincent Vega
jks289 wrote:pink_law14 wrote:Hi Y'all...
Wanna weigh in on my chances? College Senior, 3.23 GPA and 154 LSAT, very strong recs, and major community involvement and other extracurriculars... let me know if you want more details?
I have applications at:
Ave Maria (in)
Charleston (in)
Catholic (WL/out)
George Mason (out)
Widener (in)
Villanova (out)
Rutgers (out)
Seton Hall (Wl/in)
NY Law (in)
St. John's (out)
Pace (in)
Brooklyn (out)
Fordham (out)
Any insight is appreciated
This is all according to lawschoolpredictor.com. My insight is going to sound harsh but you need to hear it. Do not go to law school. Wait a year, add ten points to your LSAT and then think about it. Going to any of the schools of this list (especially the ones you might get into) would put you in serious debt, and offer no job prospects to get out of it. Bad news bears. Sorry,
Assuming that the above is indeed the outcome of your cycle, and you choose to disregard jks's advice, you should go to Charleston. That city is absolutely wonderful.
That said, I agree - going to LS with your numbers is unlikely to produce a happy outcome for you.
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 12:41 am
by Vincent Vega
pink_law14 wrote:no job prospects from Pace or NY Law or Widener?
Not really. For Pace and NYLS, you're looking at the worst law schools in the most crowded law market in the US. Widener is regarded as one of the worst law schools in the US.
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 12:47 am
by pink_law14
do all of you believe that predictor? I'm new to TLS, is it correct? my personal statement and experiences won't have an impact at all on my application with low numbers?
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 12:53 am
by am060459
pink_law14 wrote:do all of you believe that predictor? I'm new to TLS, is it correct? my personal statement and experiences won't have an impact at all on my application with low numbers?
they will but not enough to do you any good.
you should retake and study more to get a least into the high 150s and possbily cross 160. or you did study and thats your peak?
edit: MY 300th POST.
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 1:10 am
by pink_law14
yeah, I took a Kaplan course and went up 6 points on my diagnostic to the real thing. my highest PT was a 162, but unfortunately, that wasn't the outcome on test day.
anybody have any recommendations about transferring up? ie: attending NY Law, Pace, Charleston, etc and moving up the chain? I have a 3.7 GPA in my undergrad law courses (I know its not the same) but I feel I will do well once in law school.
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 1:12 am
by brose002
pink_law14 wrote:yeah, I took a Kaplan course and went up 6 points on my diagnostic to the real thing. my highest PT was a 162, but unfortunately, that wasn't the outcome on test day.
anybody have any recommendations about transferring up? ie: attending NY Law, Pace, Charleston, etc and moving up the chain? I have a 3.7 GPA in my undergrad law courses (I know its not the same) but I feel I will do well once in law school.
Don't count on transferring. You would have to do very well(i.e. top 2-3 students) in order to transfer to a solid tier 1. I would really recommend a retake, and that you take Testmasters/Powerscore if you were already at a 162. You could probably raise that to mid/high-160s.
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 1:14 am
by Vincent Vega
If you do exceptionally well in your 1L year, you will be able to transfer up. Don't bank on this happening, though. Every law student thinks he or she is good at learning the law, but not everyone can be in the top 5 percent.
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 1:18 am
by pink_law14
im not even aiming for tier 1, maybe im in the wrong place on this "top law school forum," thats totally out of reach for me, I'm realistic. I only applied to GMason, Fordham, Villanova, and Brooklyn because they were free. But you all really think I have no shot at St. John's, Catholic, or Seton Hall (I went to a Catholic H.S. and go to a Catholic College now). I am really against re-testing, by the way, I don't see a jump from 154/155 to 158/159 making that much of a difference with my GPA.
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 1:23 am
by blurbz
Breaking 160 is big and if you were up to 162, you should be able to get it consistently with good studying. If you get it up to the mid 160s, you'd be in a different world.
I understand not wanting to test again--I know I wouldn't want to do it! It may, though, be able to make a HUGE difference in your life and would absolutely be worth it.
That being said, if you're set against retaking, I'm sure you'll get into a few of the schools to which you've applied. If you are realistic about the job prospects and go in with the right mindset, you may well be able to have a good time and be successful.
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 1:24 am
by PoliticalJunkie
Any work experience or are you straight from ugrad? While I don't agree with the sentiment that you will have no job prospects from any of the schools on the list (following that logic no one would attend schools except for the top 14). You won't have 160K job opps knocking down your door but then again only the rare few get those opportunities.
That being said, you're not looking at the cream of the crop of opportunities unless you finish very high in your class. with a 3.2 and a 154 you're shut out of any and all schools ranked 1-100 and even some Tier 3 schools since your numbers would be below their 25%. Your best bet would be Schools in the 125-150 range.
While the PS and other factors may play a role, none would be able to compensate for the low numbers. at the end of the day, this is a numbers game and while softs matter, they only do so with an applicant who has great softs, Work experience, or for someone who is borderline. You're not borderline at any of the top 100 schools.
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 1:36 am
by pink_law14
Does a URM status play enough of a role?
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 1:36 am
by jlnoa0915
Ill throw my two cents in. I currently work for an attorney who went to Widener and he does very well (200k +) a year and it isnt big law. I also meet with and work with other attorneys from there, temple, villanova, rutgers, seton hall ect and they all do well also... That said going to most of those schools, some more then others, wont open as many doors for you and you will have to work your ass off. Also big law won't be in the cards IMHO(not everyone wants big law though). That said, you could go to those schools and do well there and be successful in life. There is a lot of doom and gloom on this site that if you do not attend a T20 school you'll drown in debt and never get a job and that is not true(though things will be more difficult). Also, I would recommend that if you did get accepted to any of those, do not go to NY, as others said its a saturated market and will make it that much harder to get a job. This is of course assuming you do not believe you cannot score any higher on the LSAT/ do not want to wait another year to start school. Good luck
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 1:37 am
by blurbz
pink_law14 wrote:Does a URM status play enough of a role?
What is your URM status?
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 1:38 am
by Vincent Vega
pink_law14 wrote:Does a URM status play enough of a role?
It plays a huge deal. You should have said that you were a URM at the beginning of this thread. Many more of those schools are possibilities.
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 1:49 am
by pink_law14
which ones are you speaking of, halibut?
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 1:50 am
by blurbz
It gives you a legitimate shot at George Mason on down. Fordham is still a stretch.
What is your URM status?
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 1:56 am
by pink_law14
Hispanic... if fordham is still a stretch, do you think brooklyn is as well?
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 1:59 am
by blurbz
pink_law14 wrote:Hispanic... if fordham is still a stretch, do you think brooklyn is as well?
Less so, but yes. I think you should hope for waitlists at those two and then get another LOR or write a good LOCI to try to get in from there.
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 2:13 am
by jks289
blurbz wrote:pink_law14 wrote:Hispanic... if fordham is still a stretch, do you think brooklyn is as well?
Less so, but yes. I think you should hope for waitlists at those two and then get another LOR or write a good LOCI to try to get in from there.
What kind of hispanic? People say Mexican is the only truly considered hispanic URM, but who knows. You should have said URM to begin with, it makes a HUGE difference. Check the URM button on lawschoolpredictor and see what happens. It may not be perfect but for my cycle I have been rejected at all the Reds and half the oranges, waitlisted at the other half of orange, and accepted to all the greens. So obviously it makes a close enough guess.
Edited to add: Now that you are URM , I double extra say you need to retake the LSAT. If you managed to break 160, and with enough work anyone can, you would be in a position to attend some really excellent schools. It would be really, really dumb not to retake.
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 2:16 am
by blurbz
jks289 wrote:Now that you are URM , I double extra say you need to retake the LSAT. If you managed to break 160, and with enough work anyone can, you would be in a position to attend some really excellent schools. It would be really, really dumb not to retake.
+1 This.
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 2:18 am
by Vincent Vega
I'm not a URM, but LSP has been somewhat poor in predicting my cycle. I was rejected by both of the schools that I was Strong Consider for (Cornell and Texas), and waitlisted or rejected by all Considers. I didn't even apply to any Weak Considers or Deny's (which were only HYSCCN).
Re: Insight Appreciated!!!!
Posted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 2:45 am
by justiceman
jks289 wrote:Check the URM button on lawschoolpredictor and see what happens. It may not be perfect but for my cycle I have been rejected at all the Reds and half the oranges, waitlisted at the other half of orange, and accepted to all the greens..
How have you been at the yellows?