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Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Mon Jun 07, 2010 3:04 pm
by taxguy
I just visited University of Miami with my son,who has an interest in it. I really wanted to like it since my son has relatives here and because it has a good ranking. In addition, it is supposedly strong in estate planning and tax, which interested my son the most.
At first glance, UM seems quite good. It has very decent rankings. It has a lot of offerings. In fact, it even has a course in "online gaming." and I am not kidding about that. It also has a great college environment. Moreover, most faculty graduated from top schools.However, everyone on our tour was a bit discouraged from what we saw and from what the tour guide said. Why?
First, UM is fairly expensive at $37,000 in tuition alone. Moreover, they are a bit cheap in scholarships giving out 22 merit scholarships out of 400 students.
Secondly,I really didn't get the feeling that the school was very student centered. For example, we went into several classrooms that had over 125 seats. The tour guide frankly admitted that UM tries to get as many students into a class as the room holds! In fact, each seat was numbered! Miami definitely had that "diploma mill" feeling.
Third, our tour guide noted that career services was fairly awful at the school. She was a JD and still was giving tours,which should tell you something. In addition, their passing rate on the bar was just above average for the state.
Fourth: UM seems like a resort with huge pools, great facilities, lots of parties etc. This may sound great ,but it can be a BIG distraction to law students. Keep that in mind.
Finally, although UM is known for its graduate tax and estate planning graduate programs, most of these courses are not available to undergrads without professional permission. Oddly, the undergrad concentrations that UM boasts about have nothing to do with either estate planning or tax. They emphasize programs like international law, business and financial law,and immigration law . whoever does their marketing and concentration planning should be fired.
Personally, we also did check out Florida and Stetson. Frlorida really impressed us with much lower tuition and very high quality offerings. They even seem to have smaller class sizes.
Stetson seemed like the jewel of them all with a top notch advocacy program and
Elder Law program and being very student- centric. Sadly, Stetson is almost as expensive as Miami, although it is cheaper by about $7000 per year,and doesn't have the overall ranking that either Miami and Florida have.
Bottom line: Miami does have a good rankings and nice environment. However, I would personally recommend Stetson or Florida over Miami.
Your take may be different than mine.
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Mon Jun 07, 2010 3:08 pm
by LoyolaLaw2012
You should just be an English teacher instead.
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Mon Jun 07, 2010 3:08 pm
by Mr. Matlock
taxguy wrote:I just visited University of Miami with my son,who has an interest in it. I really wanted to like it since my son has relatives here and because it has a good ranking. In addition, it is supposedly strong in estate planning and tax, which interested my son the most.
At first glance, UM seems quite good. It has very decent rankings. It has a lot of offerings and a great college environmnet. However, everyone on our tour was a bit discouraged from what we saw and from what the tour guide said.
First, UM is fairly expensive at $37,000 in tuition alone. Moreover, they are a bit cheap in scholarships giving out 22 merit scholarships out of 400 students.
Secondly,I really didn't get the feeling that the school was very student centered. For example, we went into several classrooms that had over 125 seats. The tour guide frankly admitted that UM tries to get as many students into a class as the room holds! In fact, each seat was numbered!
Third, our tour guide noted that career services was fairly awful at the school. She was a JD and still was giving tours,which should tell you something. In addition, their passing rate on the bar was just above average for the state.
Fourth: UM seems like a resort with huge pools, great facilities, lots of parties etc. This may sound great ,but it can be a BIG distraction to law students. Keep that in mind.
Finally, although UM is known for its graduate tax and estate planning graduate programs, most of these courses are not available to undergrads without professorial permission. Oddly, the undergrad concentrations that UM boasts about have nothing to do with either estate planning or tax. They emphasize programs like international law, maratime law and other subjects that you may or may not like.
Personally, we also did check out Florida and Stetson. Frlorida really impressed us with much lower tuition and very high quality offerings. They even seem to have smaller class sizes.
Stetson seemed like the jewel of them all with a top notch advocacy program and elder law program and being very student centric. Sadly, Stetson is almost as expensive as Miami, although it is cheaper by about %7000 per year,and doesn't have the overall ranking that either Miami and Florida have.
Bottom line: Miami does have a good rankings and nice environment. However, I would personally recommend Stetson or Florida over Miami.
Your take may be different than mine.
Dude, you didn't say anything in your post that EVERYONE here at TLS didn't already know.
Your son should go to Florida.
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Mon Jun 07, 2010 3:16 pm
by chicoalto0649
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Mon Jun 07, 2010 3:23 pm
by eldizknee
Flame?
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 9:16 am
by Grizz
taxguy wrote:
Stetson seemed like the jewel of them all with a top notch advocacy program and elder law program and being very student- centric.
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 9:32 am
by kommatas
I am in-state. The best school in Florida is UF, then FSU, then UM.
UM is in a nice little pocket of S. Florida. But the gables are really expensive, if you have time you can visit the grove, which is where all the UM kids hang out.
A lot of people in my area consider UM a school you pay for your degree. Stetson is know for its masters programs and not really for its law program.
Also, you stated undergrad programs, why? Anyway, UF's business programs are much stronger than UMs'.
Finally, UF's tax law program is head and shoulders above UMs'.
BTW I am not a UF student and am not interested in going to a Florida law school. But from a florida perspective UF > FSU > UM > Stetson.
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 9:39 am
by holydonkey
taxguy wrote:Bottom line: Miami does have a good rankings
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 9:40 am
by Grizz
holydonkey wrote:taxguy wrote:Bottom line: Miami does have a good rankings
Depends how you define "good."
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 9:42 am
by holydonkey
rad law wrote:holydonkey wrote:taxguy wrote:Bottom line: Miami does have a good rankings
Depends how you define "good."
Not only does they have a good rankings, most faculty also graduates from top schools!
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 9:42 am
by imisscollege
You're not going to get any sympathy or whatever you're looking for on these boards when talking about a TTT like Miami. What's the only thing worse than a diploma mill? A crapbox diploma mill. I do, however, plan on trying as hard as I possibly can to "study" for a semester there during my 2L or 3L year. I haven't quite decided how I'm going to swing this.
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 9:43 am
by imisscollege
Yeah this has got to be a flame.
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 9:45 am
by holydonkey
imisscollege wrote:Yeah this has got to be a flame.
But, but, they
personally did also check out Frlorida and Stetson.
Frlorida really impressed us
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:41 pm
by taxguy
Being a first time poster here, I am surprised at the response that I got on this thread. I was simply trying to be helpful. All I was doing was to post my impressions gleaned from various law school visits IN THE LAW SCHOOL VISIT FORUM. I tried to be objective and fair. I even noted that your take might be different than mine in order to make sure that my opinions were simply that: opinions. Yet I get all kinds of flames such as "tell us what we didn't already know," as if I were to know what people already know.
As for Stetson being more student centric, I heard this from a law school professor.
Did I say or post something improper?
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:48 pm
by Grizz
taxguy wrote:Being a first time poster here, I am surprised at the response that I got on this thread. I was simply trying to be helpful. All I was doing was to post my impressions gleaned from various law school visits IN THE LAW SCHOOL VISIT FORUM. I tried to be objective and fair. I even noted that your take might be different than mine in order to make sure that my opinions were simply that: opinions. Yet I get all kinds of flames such as "tell us what we didn't already know," as if I were to know what people already know.
As for Stetson being more student centric, I heard this from a law school professor.
Did I say or post something improper?
The Miami stuff made sense, but the stuff you were saying about Stetson, the "jewel of them all," ignores the fact that specialty programs and rankings rarely translate into increased job opportunities. Stetson grads are suffering as the third best school (after UF and FSU) in their market (Tampa/St. Pete).
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:51 pm
by Wooderson
I feel ya tax guy... most of the people on this site are douchebags
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:53 pm
by trialjunky
I wouldnt be surprised if the OP was on UM's WL. It's about that time when people are getting drastic.
Looks for thread about extreme WL measures.
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:57 pm
by taxguy
trialjunky wrote:I wouldnt be surprised if the OP was on UM's WL. It's about that time when people are getting drastic.
Looks for thread about extreme WL measures.
er.. no, I am a tax lawyer and CPA and tax writer: hence my name, Taxguy. Moreover, I honestly wanted to like Miami since we had relatives there, and my son would find a lot of support with relatives. I was NOT, nor was it my intention, to simply flame Miami. I just wanted to give my take on all the schools noted.
As to Stetson being lower ranked than Miami and less well known, I noted that in my post. However, regardless of rankings, I simply was impressed by what I saw at Stetson regarding their trial advocacy program and
Elder Law program. I honestly don't think that overall rankings are or should be the only conclusion as to what makes a good law school. Each school has specialities that should be considered. Frankly, I find that scorning opinions that try to be helpful is demeaning to the incendiary posters and will resort in less helpful information given on this site.
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:57 pm
by miamiman
Reasons why i think you're a flame:
Fourth: UM seems like a resort with huge pools, great facilities, lots of parties etc. This may sound great ,but it can be a BIG distraction to law students. Keep that in mind.
Stetson seemed like the jewel of them all with a top notch advocacy program and elder law program and being very student- centric. Sadly, Stetson is almost as expensive as Miami, although it is cheaper by about $7000 per year,and doesn't have the overall ranking that either Miami and Florida have.
Bottom line: Miami does have a good rankings and nice environment. However, I would personally recommend Stetson or Florida over Miami.
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 1:13 pm
by Grizz
taxguy wrote:Frankly, I find that scorning opinions that try to be helpful is demeaning to the incendiary posters and will resort in less helpful information given on this site.
The problem is, the stuff you said about Stetson obfuscates the true situation and is not helpful.
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 1:20 pm
by taxguy
rad law wrote:taxguy wrote:Frankly, I find that scorning opinions that try to be helpful is demeaning to the incendiary posters and will resort in less helpful information given on this site.
The problem is, the stuff you said about Stetson obfuscates the true situation and is not helpful.
Oh?: What did I say that you found so confusing to the general public? Did I not say that Stetson was lower ranked than both Miami and Florida? Did you ever personally check out Stetson's programs and/or specialities? Did you ever visit the school? Thus, what is it that you feel caused this "obfuscation?"
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 1:28 pm
by miamiman
Its laughable that you call yourself a practicing attorney but yet focus so much attention upon the criminally bullshit unique programs and specialties at these schools. As if hiring attorneys give a rats ass if you concentrated in trusts and estates law or international comparative business.
A practicing attorney worth his salt would would know that all that matters at days end are what a.) school a candidate attends and his/her b.) rank. The only people that actually pay attention to those rankings are suckers/prospective students that GENUINELY believe attending St. Louis Law for its #1 position in Health Law make them more qualified for employment than a median kid at WUSTL.
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 1:31 pm
by Grizz
taxguy wrote:Thus, what is it that you feel caused this "obfuscation?"
"the jewel of them all"
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 1:32 pm
by Grizz
Nightrunner wrote:ITT: 0Ls talk shit.
Dude this is the internet what did you expect
Re: Visit to Univ. of Miami and didn't like what I saw
Posted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 1:38 pm
by taxguy
rad law wrote:Nightrunner wrote:ITT: 0Ls talk shit.
Dude this is the internet what did you expect
Well, from law students I expect honor, decency, respect, competent advocacy rather than ranking citations and jive. Oh yes, clear writing and not "TTT, etc." I guess I expect too much from anyone on the internet.
