UIUC 2015 Forum

[STLMizzou]

I heard music and dancing is banned there, and was actually the inspiration behind the original footloose

[Gail]

don't go into the cornfield

[Ludo!]

Sure. 2L here.

Sure. I'm a 2l here

How competitive are the classes? Where and in what type of law are y'all looking to work after graduation? Any good music in Champaign?

I didn't find our classes to be competitive at all. Most people are friendly and help each other out. One or two weirdos are cut throat strivers, but they're the exception I would say.

I have a BigLaw SA in Chicago this summer, so hopefully that's where I will be after graduation. Probably doing corporate but could change after the summer.

Good music in Champaign as in local bands? Not really. There are one or two that aren't terrible but not anybody I'd go out of my way to see regularly. If you mean in terms of touring bands then yes definitely and that's one of the things that makes living in Champaign cool. There are a couple cool venues in town and bands come through all the time. Every Fall there is a thing called the Pygmalion Festival that lasts for three days and is held in venues all over Champaign-Urbana and gets some great bands. And of course if there is somebody on tour who you really want to see but they're not coming to Champaign you can get up to Chicago in a couple hours.

[hoosierball]

This may have been answered but I didn't see it in the previous few pages, does anyone know if Illinois negotiates scholarships? Thank you guys and good luck to everyone still waiting for a decision.

Hard to know for sure since its a different admissions person now, but they used to and I don't see why they wouldn't continue to do so

Why wouldn't they continue? Oh I don't know ..... so they could boost their numbers to compensate for what has occurred in the admissions office, just an idea....

[givemea170]

This may have been answered but I didn't see it in the previous few pages, does anyone know if Illinois negotiates scholarships? Thank you guys and good luck to everyone still waiting for a decision.

Hard to know for sure since its a different admissions person now, but they used to and I don't see why they wouldn't continue to do so

Why wouldn't they continue? Oh I don't know ..... so they could boost their numbers to compensate for what has occurred in the admissions office, just an idea....

umm... how could not negotiating scholarships possibly help them boost their GPA/LSAT numbers? Not negotiating scholarships would cause those numbers to go down most likely as students who got better offers to better schools would choose to go there and then Illinois would have to settle for lesser candidates.

[Ludo!]

This may have been answered but I didn't see it in the previous few pages, does anyone know if Illinois negotiates scholarships? Thank you guys and good luck to everyone still waiting for a decision.

Hard to know for sure since its a different admissions person now, but they used to and I don't see why they wouldn't continue to do so

Why wouldn't they continue? Oh I don't know ..... so they could boost their numbers to compensate for what has occurred in the admissions office, just an idea....

Pretty sure offering generous scholarships is Illinois' only hope to boost their numbers

[blurbz]

This may have been answered but I didn't see it in the previous few pages, does anyone know if Illinois negotiates scholarships? Thank you guys and good luck to everyone still waiting for a decision.

Hard to know for sure since its a different admissions person now, but they used to and I don't see why they wouldn't continue to do so

Why wouldn't they continue? Oh I don't know ..... so they could boost their numbers to compensate for what has occurred in the admissions office, just an idea....

Pretty sure offering generous scholarships is Illinois' only hope to boost their numbers

+1, there can be no other argument made.

Sure. 2L here.

Sure. I'm a 2l here

How competitive are the classes? Where and in what type of law are y'all looking to work after graduation? Any good music in Champaign?

Like Ludo said above, people care and work hard, but we're not all that competitive. There are some people who go all out and aren't much fun to be around but they are certainly the exception rather than the rule.

I also have a biglaw SA, but not in Chicago. We'll see how it goes--I'm definitely looking forward to it!

Music? Eh...we get the major campus tours but otherwise you have to go up to Chicago or over to Indy or St. Louis. Champaign is sort of in the middle of a triangle formed by those three cities so they're all fairly convenient (St. Louis is farthest away at 2.5 hours driving). There are a few festivals that can be fun to go to, but more for townie watching and fair food than for the music.


Edit: One of the best parts about Champaign is Ebertfest. I only got to one or two movies last year because I was a neurotic 1L (and it's right around second semester finals), but now that we're deep into 2LOL I definitely plan on going to a ton more. Check it out: http://www.ebertfest.com

[tooswolle]

Hard to know for sure since its a different admissions person now, but they used to and I don't see why they wouldn't continue to do so[/quote]


Why wouldn't they continue? Oh I don't know ..... so they could boost their numbers to compensate for what has occurred in the admissions office, just an idea....[/quote]

Pretty sure offering generous scholarships is Illinois' only hope to boost their numbers[/quote]

+1, there can be no other argument made.

Sure. 2L here.

Sure. I'm a 2l here

How competitive are the classes? Where and in what type of law are y'all looking to work after graduation? Any good music in Champaign?

Like Ludo said above, people care and work hard, but we're not all that competitive. There are some people who go all out and aren't much fun to be around but they are certainly the exception rather than the rule.

I also have a biglaw SA, but not in Chicago. We'll see how it goes--I'm definitely looking forward to it!

Music? Eh...we get the major campus tours but otherwise you have to go up to Chicago or over to Indy or St. Louis. Champaign is sort of in the middle of a triangle formed by those three cities so they're all fairly convenient (St. Louis is farthest away at 2.5 hours driving). There are a few festivals that can be fun to go to, but more for townie watching and fair food than for the music.


Edit: One of the best parts about Champaign is Ebertfest. I only got to one or two movies last year because I was a neurotic 1L (and it's right around second semester finals), but now that we're deep into 2LOL I definitely plan on going to a ton more. Check it out: http://www.ebertfest.com[/quote]


What would you say it takes to get big law or a least "mid law" from UIUC? How do you think the scandal has affected the school? How is OCI? And final question what other markets can UIUC place in? Thanks in advance for the help.

[Ludo!]

What would you say it takes to get big law or a least "mid law" from UIUC? How do you think the scandal has affected the school? How is OCI? And final question what other markets can UIUC place in? Thanks in advance for the help.

I think you have to be in the top 10% to feel good about getting BigLaw. Even then it's not guaranteed, but if you're in the top 10% and don't get BigLaw something else was holding you back. (There's a person in the top 1-2% who struck out everywhere because he has the worst personality in the world). Outside top 10% is possible but something else will have to stand out about you - great interviewer, work experience, etc. And if you're IP secure firms will go even lower in the class. I have no idea what it takes to get mid law. I only applied to big firms and I got my job through OCI so BigLaw is what my experience is with.

So far I don't think the scandal has affected the school much. See DreamsInDigital's answer to this in the Illinois 1l thread. Apparently employers don't seem too worried about it. I think the real damage from the fallout won't be felt for another couple years if/when our ranking plummets and we can no longer attract the same level of students.

OCI last year was decent. It pales in comparison to a T14 obviously but I think ours was better than peer schools like ND. I can't think of a single big Chicago firm that wasn't there. People from our class placed at Kirkland & Ellis, Sidley Austin, Jenner & Block, Mayer Brown, etc.

U of I places really well in Chicago. That is our target market and always has been. Over the last few years the school has been trying to become more of a "national school". It is not. Be very very skeptical of anyone trying to tell you how well Illinois places outside of the state. Especially on the coasts. There was someone earlier in the thread trying to say they knew tons of people with jobs in CA and NYC, but then they backed down quickly when they were questioned on details, like what kind of jobs those people were getting. Illinois places decently in Indy and St Louis, and there will be a handful of firms from those cities at OCI. But there were absolutely ZERO NY firms and 1 LA firm at OCI. They had "interview programs" in both cities. I know some people who got offers from the NY one, but the LA one was a complete joke. They also did a resume collect that was supposed to be for LA firms, but after we submitted resumes they never did anything with it. CSO never even mentioned it again. If you want a job outside Illinois it is possible, but just know you will have to do all the work yourself to get it. And nothing is guaranteed. A friend of mine is from LA, born and raised, and targeted that market. Couldn't get shit. Finally, because he had an offer at a Chicago firm that was expiring, he had to accept Chicago and forget about LA. He probably could have gotten some kind of job in LA eventually, but at the cost of turning down a market paying offer in Chicago. So if anyone tries to tell you that people, even top 5%, can go anywhere they want, they are full of shit.

[Opie]

The consensus I've heard from friends who work in Chicago is that employers basically see that the quality of lawyers coming OUT of the school hasn't changed just because the quality of applicants coming IN weren't what they were stated to be. Firms have experience with Illinois grads and they know what to expect.

I agree that the real danger comes from good applicants opting to not come to UIUC which will eventually degrade the quality of those lawyers coming out. Also, if class sizes decline, it could hurt the school financially and have the same effect.

[blurbz]

What would you say it takes to get big law or a least "mid law" from UIUC? How do you think the scandal has affected the school? How is OCI? And final question what other markets can UIUC place in? Thanks in advance for the help.

Ludo beat me to it. Her answer is essentially what I would say for biglaw.

I think midlaw is hard to quantify: Do you mean smaller firms in small midwestern city markets? Or do you mean medium sized firms in major markets? The firms in major markets are able to be more picky with their grade requirements because everyone is hiring less right now so the pool of available top students is larger for them. The firms in tiny midwestern markets (Stay in Champaign, anyone?) are largely based on personality, ties and connections.

The scandal came up in a bunch of my callbacks last fall but I don't think it impacted my job prospects at all. Illinois grads seemed concerned about it, definitely, but I didn't get the impression that they anticipated any directives from hiring partners to stop looking at Illinois students. What Ludo said, though, is correct: We are NOT a national school and if you want to work outside of the Midwest, you'll have to have excellent grades (or IP etc), hit the pavement hard, have connections and get lucky.

A note: Everyone I know with IP backgrounds, regardless of where they are ranked, have SA jobs for the summer. Don't discount the value of your hard science degree if you have one.

[tooswolle]

What would you say it takes to get big law or a least "mid law" from UIUC? How do you think the scandal has affected the school? How is OCI? And final question what other markets can UIUC place in? Thanks in advance for the help.

Ludo beat me to it. Her answer is essentially what I would say for biglaw.

I think midlaw is hard to quantify: Do you mean smaller firms in small midwestern city markets? Or do you mean medium sized firms in major markets? The firms in major markets are able to be more picky with their grade requirements because everyone is hiring less right now so the pool of available top students is larger for them. The firms in tiny midwestern markets (Stay in Champaign, anyone?) are largely based on personality, ties and connections.

The scandal came up in a bunch of my callbacks last fall but I don't think it impacted my job prospects at all. Illinois grads seemed concerned about it, definitely, but I didn't get the impression that they anticipated any directives from hiring partners to stop looking at Illinois students. What Ludo said, though, is correct: We are NOT a national school and if you want to work outside of the Midwest, you'll have to have excellent grades (or IP etc), hit the pavement hard, have connections and get lucky.

A note: Everyone I know with IP backgrounds, regardless of where they are ranked, have SA jobs for the summer. Don't discount the value of your hard science degree if you have one.

Thank you very much for helping out. I'm considering the school right now but the prospect of 6 figure debt is sobering to say the least. How harsh is the grading curve? What would you say prospects are for median and below median students. (of course no one goes in assuming, but its better to look at it through a pragmatic point of view and asses the cost benefit...)

[Gail]

So any idea when this "second review" is going to happen?

[btw384]

In review, 1/13. Went complete 1/5.

[blurbz]

What would you say it takes to get big law or a least "mid law" from UIUC? How do you think the scandal has affected the school? How is OCI? And final question what other markets can UIUC place in? Thanks in advance for the help.

Ludo beat me to it. Her answer is essentially what I would say for biglaw.

I think midlaw is hard to quantify: Do you mean smaller firms in small midwestern city markets? Or do you mean medium sized firms in major markets? The firms in major markets are able to be more picky with their grade requirements because everyone is hiring less right now so the pool of available top students is larger for them. The firms in tiny midwestern markets (Stay in Champaign, anyone?) are largely based on personality, ties and connections.

The scandal came up in a bunch of my callbacks last fall but I don't think it impacted my job prospects at all. Illinois grads seemed concerned about it, definitely, but I didn't get the impression that they anticipated any directives from hiring partners to stop looking at Illinois students. What Ludo said, though, is correct: We are NOT a national school and if you want to work outside of the Midwest, you'll have to have excellent grades (or IP etc), hit the pavement hard, have connections and get lucky.

A note: Everyone I know with IP backgrounds, regardless of where they are ranked, have SA jobs for the summer. Don't discount the value of your hard science degree if you have one.

Thank you very much for helping out. I'm considering the school right now but the prospect of 6 figure debt is sobering to say the least. How harsh is the grading curve? What would you say prospects are for median and below median students. (of course no one goes in assuming, but its better to look at it through a pragmatic point of view and asses the cost benefit...)

No problem. What other schools are you considering? What kind of scholarships do you have/are expecting?

The curve for 1Ls is a 3.2 (So just below a B+) and is pretty strictly adhered to. It goes up to ~3.3/3.4 for 2L and 3L classes.

Median/below median is going to be tough. There are jobs available, of course, but you'd have to really hustle and be open to a variety of jobs in a variety of locations. I have friends all over our rankings and all of them did something legal 1L summer, but those who were lower generally had to look harder and wait longer for their opportunity to materialize.

[tooswolle]

No problem. What other schools are you considering? What kind of scholarships do you have/are expecting?

The curve for 1Ls is a 3.2 (So just below a B+) and is pretty strictly adhered to. It goes up to ~3.3/3.4 for 2L and 3L classes.

Median/below median is going to be tough. There are jobs available, of course, but you'd have to really hustle and be open to a variety of jobs in a variety of locations. I have friends all over our rankings and all of them did something legal 1L summer, but those who were lower generally had to look harder and wait longer for their opportunity to materialize.[/quote]

In response to your question I'm currently in under a 25% scholarship. I'm currently waiting to hear from other schools but I have a few admissions. MSU 75% scholly, Santa Clara 13K/year and temple but I haven't gotten any info on scholarships. As of right now my option is waying job prospects to cost of attendance. Hopefully I can find middle ground.

[Opie]

No problem. What other schools are you considering? What kind of scholarships do you have/are expecting?

The curve for 1Ls is a 3.2 (So just below a B+) and is pretty strictly adhered to. It goes up to ~3.3/3.4 for 2L and 3L classes.

Median/below median is going to be tough. There are jobs available, of course, but you'd have to really hustle and be open to a variety of jobs in a variety of locations. I have friends all over our rankings and all of them did something legal 1L summer, but those who were lower generally had to look harder and wait longer for their opportunity to materialize.

In response to your question I'm currently in under a 25% scholarship. I'm currently waiting to hear from other schools but I have a few admissions. MSU 75% scholly, Santa Clara 13K/year and temple but I haven't gotten any info on scholarships. As of right now my option is waying job prospects to cost of attendance. Hopefully I can find middle ground.[/quote]

That's a tough call, but I'm tempted to say MSU at 75% is about the same as UIUC at 25%. You'd be in different markets, but I think that may be close to equal leaning a little toward UIUC.

[blurbz]

I disagree that MSU at 75% is anywhere near equal to Illinois at 25%: MSU has no market, Illinois at least has pretty good inroads in Chicago and other Midwestern cities. Your scholarship at Illinois is guaranteed...Is it at MSU or do you have to stay at a certain level with a harsher curve? Look at all of that stuff...

Median is hard here, but I'd rather be median at Illinois than at MSU: In my mind, it's a no-brainer if those are your choices.

[northside]

No problem. What other schools are you considering? What kind of scholarships do you have/are expecting?


That's a tough call, but I'm tempted to say MSU at 75% is about the same as UIUC at 25%. You'd be in different markets, but I think that may be close to equal leaning a little toward UIUC.

Are you serious? I grew up in Michigan and when I got a mailer from MSU I said to myself: Wait -- MSU has a Law School?

You're looking at 8th worst economy in America. Outside of Lansing you've got corn fields and apple orchards. Grand Rapids is the only thing keeping that state going, and that is only because of the medical industry.

[Gail]

I disagree that MSU at 75% is anywhere near equal to Illinois at 25%: MSU has no market, Illinois at least has pretty good inroads in Chicago and other Midwestern cities. Your scholarship at Illinois is guaranteed...Is it at MSU or do you have to stay at a certain level with a harsher curve? Look at all of that stuff...

Median is hard here, but I'd rather be median at Illinois than at MSU: In my mind, it's a no-brainer if those are your choices.

Scandal + the death of Chicago might make someone reconsider UIUC. I don't know if Michigan State is the better option, but if it were a full ride scholarship, which I don't think would be hard to negotiate for, if you don't have any pre-existing ties in other Illinois cities, it might be a toss-up.

EDIT: Eh... Nevermind.

[blurbz]

I disagree that MSU at 75% is anywhere near equal to Illinois at 25%: MSU has no market, Illinois at least has pretty good inroads in Chicago and other Midwestern cities. Your scholarship at Illinois is guaranteed...Is it at MSU or do you have to stay at a certain level with a harsher curve? Look at all of that stuff...

Median is hard here, but I'd rather be median at Illinois than at MSU: In my mind, it's a no-brainer if those are your choices.

Scandal + the death of Chicago might make someone reconsider UIUC. I don't know if Michigan State is the better option, but if it were a full ride scholarship, which I don't think would be hard to negotiate for, if you don't have any pre-existing ties in other Illinois cities, it might be a toss-up.

EDIT: Eh... Nevermind.

Yeah, I mean I get where you're coming from but Chicago isn't totally dead: Everyone I know in the top 10ish percent had multiple CBs in the city. Sure, hiring isn't where it was pre-ITE but it's unarguably better coming from Illinois than coming from MSU. MSU doesn't really have a market and, if Chicago is dead then Detroit/MI as a whole is dead, buried and forgotten about. If you have connections that don't care where you went to school then, sure, go to whichever is cheaper. If not....Even though Illinois will fall in the rankings and even though we're embarrassed by this most recent scandal, I don't think Illinois belongs in the same sentence as MSU.

[Ludo!]

Chicago was dead at 2010 OCI... compared to NYC. Not compared to Detroit. I think Chicago hiring was up this year.

And I would easily pay 50% more to not be sentenced to a life of working in Michigan (if I could get a job from MSU)

[Gail]

Villanova had a similar scandal recently. I heard that it didn't have any effect on hiring. Then again, only Villa and Temple really compete for Phillie law (plus the usual brigade of local TTTs that I don't know why anyone would go to).

[blurbz]

Villanova had a similar scandal recently. I heard that it didn't have any effect on hiring. Then again, only Villa and Temple really compete for Phillie law (plus the usual brigade of local TTTs that I don't know why anyone would go to).

Yeah, Villanova's was similar but it was a bit worse and more wide-spread. I don't have any idea what happened with their hiring so I'll take your word that it didn't have a much of an effect. What I can say is that this scandal came up a few times during my OCI/CBs etc. and people were concerned but it certainly didn't sound like it was going to have an impact on hiring. As I've said before, I don't think firms that are loaded with Illinois grads are going to suddenly start going to Indiana or MSU or whatever because of this scandal...

Edit: A better argument against me, I suppose, would be that firms will just go deeper into the Chi/Northwestern/Michigan classes instead of hiring Illinois grads, but I don't see that happening, either. Like I said, my interviewers thought it was a shame that it was happening but didn't seem overly concerned.

[freaknroll]

Does anybody know if UIUC subsidizes or reimburses travel expenses for ASW's? I didnt see anything mentioned in the email I just received.