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Jones Day has so many partners—does that mean it’s easy to make partner if you stick out for 10 years and bill reasonable hours?

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 19, 2022 3:10 pm

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Mon Jul 18, 2022 6:06 pm

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Thu Jul 14, 2022 2:24 pm

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Thu Jul 14, 2022 2:14 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Thu Jul 14, 2022 1:43 pm

There is a lot of talk about how after the first year, salaries at Jones Day are below and sometimes significantly below market. Is there any wisdom as to whether JD compresses salaries more in smaller cities like Pittsburgh but in large markets like NY, DC, LA, and HOU, attorney salaries are closer to market?

Broadly, yes. There's also less compression in top practice groups.

There used to be much more compression in the smaller markets but they moved away from that last year and now we’re supposed to be paid as much as major markets. It’s tough to compare specifically since we don’t have many updated numbers. But for context I’m a fifth year and just over 400.

5th year as in C/O 2017?

Correct. I haven’t heard much about where others landed this year so don’t have much to compare to.

So you’re barely below market (including bonus).

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Thu Jul 21, 2022 9:46 pm

Jones Day has so many partners—does that mean it’s easy to make partner if you stick out for 10 years and bill reasonable hours?

Yes, for the most part, especially if you start your career there.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 23, 2022 10:12 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Thu Jul 21, 2022 9:46 pm

Jones Day has so many partners—does that mean it’s easy to make partner if you stick out for 10 years and bill reasonable hours?

Yes, for the most part, especially if you start your career there.

Also, who cares if you're an equity partner if you're making $600k? That's no better than being an nonequity partner elsewhere. The reality of partner distributions is that if you have something like a $1.2M PPP, then most of your partners are making significantly less than that. You're more likely to be like most than you are to be a rainmaker.

Sackboy wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 24, 2022 3:09 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 23, 2022 10:12 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Thu Jul 21, 2022 9:46 pm

Jones Day has so many partners—does that mean it’s easy to make partner if you stick out for 10 years and bill reasonable hours?

Yes, for the most part, especially if you start your career there.

Also, who cares if you're an equity partner if you're making $600k? That's no better than being an nonequity partner elsewhere. The reality of partner distributions is that if you have something like a $1.2M PPP, then most of your partners are making significantly less than that. You're more likely to be like most than you are to be a rainmaker.

I think equity partnership at JD is better than non-equity partnership somewhere like K&E. Your pay is anonymous, and you don’t have to deal with the social stratification / stigma of not making shares. There’s also maybe more room for salary growth and more career stability. Obviously partnership at JD is nowhere near as valuable as shares at K&E, but that’s an unfair comparison. Plenty of people would view a steady 600k-800k+ as a desirable outcome.

Sackboy wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 24, 2022 3:09 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 23, 2022 10:12 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Thu Jul 21, 2022 9:46 pm

Jones Day has so many partners—does that mean it’s easy to make partner if you stick out for 10 years and bill reasonable hours?

Yes, for the most part, especially if you start your career there.

Also, who cares if you're an equity partner if you're making $600k? That's no better than being an nonequity partner elsewhere. The reality of partner distributions is that if you have something like a $1.2M PPP, then most of your partners are making significantly less than that. You're more likely to be like most than you are to be a rainmaker.

Partner distributions are anonymous and not reported, so Am just approximates what they think JD partners make. Brogan is the only one who actually knows.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 24, 2022 4:28 pm

Sackboy wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 24, 2022 3:09 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 23, 2022 10:12 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Thu Jul 21, 2022 9:46 pm

Jones Day has so many partners—does that mean it’s easy to make partner if you stick out for 10 years and bill reasonable hours?

Yes, for the most part, especially if you start your career there.

Also, who cares if you're an equity partner if you're making $600k? That's no better than being an nonequity partner elsewhere. The reality of partner distributions is that if you have something like a $1.2M PPP, then most of your partners are making significantly less than that. You're more likely to be like most than you are to be a rainmaker.

Partner distributions are anonymous and not reported, so Am just approximates what they think JD partners make. Brogan is the only one who actually knows.

Never knew that this was an estimate. Interesting. If you're curious, their method appears to be ([total revenue]/[#partners])*.5 (i.e., assuming 50% profit margin, which isn't necessarily representative as the average in Amlaw100 is something like 43%).

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 24, 2022 4:28 pm

Partner distributions are anonymous and not reported, so Am just approximates what they think JD partners make. Brogan is the only one who actually knows.

This doesn't make much sense. I'm pretty sure JD reports its revenue and PPP, which is just profits/number of equity partners, every year. That's not remotely the same as de-anonymizing individual partner draws. Based on JD's reported numbers, the PPP is $1.2M, which means there are a lot of folks making $500-$800k.

Sackboy wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 25, 2022 9:02 am

...which means there are a lot of folks making $500-$800k.

The horror!

Baron7 wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 25, 2022 9:24 am

Sackboy wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 25, 2022 9:02 am

...which means there are a lot of folks making $500-$800k.

The horror!

Not remotely a horror, but you might as well go make the same as a nonequity partner elsewhere with the actual potential for seven figure equity.

Sackboy wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 25, 2022 9:52 am

Baron7 wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 25, 2022 9:24 am

Sackboy wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 25, 2022 9:02 am

...which means there are a lot of folks making $500-$800k.

The horror!

Not remotely a horror, but you might as well go make the same as a nonequity partner elsewhere with the actual potential for seven figure equity.

I mean, there are seniors in my secondary JD office that make above 500k. I say this as non-JD apologist. But no clue what junior partners make.

Sackboy wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 25, 2022 9:52 am

Baron7 wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 25, 2022 9:24 am

The horror!

Not remotely a horror, but you might as well go make the same as a nonequity partner elsewhere with the actual potential for seven figure equity.

I get where you’re coming from, but the “potential” for shares is just that—potential. I would much rather be a mid-career equity partner making $600k than an NEP making slightly more, fighting for shares.

Sackboy wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 25, 2022 9:02 am

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 24, 2022 4:28 pm

Partner distributions are anonymous and not reported, so Am just approximates what they think JD partners make. Brogan is the only one who actually knows.

This doesn't make much sense. I'm pretty sure JD reports its revenue and PPP, which is just profits/number of equity partners, every year. That's not remotely the same as de-anonymizing individual partner draws. Based on JD's reported numbers, the PPP is $1.2M, which means there are a lot of folks making $500-$800k.

Based on the 2022 numbers, JD's PPP is currently around $1.5M. That's slightly misleading, though, because JD has offices in many less-than-profitable cities and countries. One article making the rounds a few years back estimated JD's partner pay in major US metro areas at about $2M. Financially, that would put it about the level of an Arnold & Porter / Jenner & Block / Perkins Coie. You're still right that this leaves some folks making $600-$800k, at least early on. Personally, I view that as preferable to being non-equity somewhere with no realistic path to equity, but that's just me.

Robert Huie, the new SDCA Judge, made 650k as Of Counsel in San Diego in 2021. He probably was making more than some partners, but I doubt he was making more than the median.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Fri Jul 29, 2022 3:02 pm

Robert Huie, the new SDCA Judge, made 650k as Of Counsel in San Diego in 2021. He probably was making more than some partners, but I doubt he was making more than the median.

For those interested, a few other data points from people who left to join the Biden administration: Ben Mizer reported total compensation of $5.4 million, and Andrew Luger reported total compensation of $4.2 million. Both veteran lawyers with significant prior government experience.

What are third and fourth years (classes of 2019 and 2018) making in California or similar markets? $300K?

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 02, 2022 9:24 pm

What are third and fourth years (classes of 2019 and 2018) making in California or similar markets? $300K?

$300k for C/O 2019 sounds about right in California.

Even though WFH is discouraged at Jones Day, how often are people, on average, WFH at your office?

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 3:32 pm

Even though WFH is discouraged at Jones Day, how often are people, on average, WFH at your office?

Where did you hear that it’s discouraged? Never heard that. I WFH 2 days a week fwiw

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 12, 2022 1:09 am

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 3:32 pm

Even though WFH is discouraged at Jones Day, how often are people, on average, WFH at your office?

Where did you hear that it’s discouraged? Never heard that. I WFH 2 days a week fwiw

It is very much a 5+ days a week in office, at your desk, letting people know when plan to leave early or eat lunch, in Atlanta policy.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 12, 2022 11:21 am

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 12, 2022 1:09 am

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 3:32 pm

Even though WFH is discouraged at Jones Day, how often are people, on average, WFH at your office?

Where did you hear that it’s discouraged? Never heard that. I WFH 2 days a week fwiw

It is very much a 5+ days a week in office, at your desk, letting people know when plan to leave early or eat lunch, in Atlanta policy.

I think it depends on the practice group. I'm in the Atlanta office and only come in 1-2 days a week at most.

Has anyone met/interacted with Brogan? What's he like? People talk about him like he's some sort of mythical figure

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 12, 2022 11:21 am

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 12, 2022 1:09 am

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 3:32 pm

Even though WFH is discouraged at Jones Day, how often are people, on average, WFH at your office?

Where did you hear that it’s discouraged? Never heard that. I WFH 2 days a week fwiw

It is very much a 5+ days a week in office, at your desk, letting people know when plan to leave early or eat lunch, in Atlanta policy.

If you don't mind, could you please share which practice group you are in? Doesn't even have to be a specific group--transactional vs lit could be helpful too

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 24, 2022 6:35 pm

Has anyone met/interacted with Brogan? What's he like? People talk about him like he's some sort of mythical figure

he's like former nypd commissioner ray kelly, idk how else to put it

Is the clerkship bonus at JD for COA below market in major markets?