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Hey guys,

It has been a while since I logged in here. My life had gotten a bit side tracked since the last time I was trying to study for the lsat/ apply to law school. Luckily, three years later, my wife and I are back on our feet where we wanted to live and I am ready to pursue what I wanted . Anyway, I took a cold diagnostic about two weeks ago and got a 150 (did the same in 2011 when I originally started this journey). As of last night, I have gained around 10 points on my practice tests so I am seeing some improvement. We live in Texas and my preferred school is UT or Baylor. I have a goal of 170 to 175 (170 to get in to UT with a 3.2 undergraduate and a 3.4 graduate gpa in finance/mba/ history and 175 to get a scholarship) and have a very strict schedule (15 hours weekly, reading of economist during off time when available). Anyway, what I don't want is to get cozy. I would assume that there is a certain drop on test day from practice day. So, if I want a 175, should I be practice testing at 179? Or is it normal to his a certain equivalency in practice and day of testing?

Thank you for your help.

I'm not trying to be a buzzkill but you are talking about 175-179 like it's not so difficult. Only .1% of test takers score that high and very few of those have an initial diagnostic in the 150s. 15 hours a week is about average for LSAT studying but time isn't the major factor necessarily. Also you don't need a 175 to get scholarship money at Texas.
Just do your best. Everyone on this forum wants over a 170 but only 3% of test takers can get it. Use this as motivation.

notsolawful wrote:I'm not trying to be a buzzkill but you are talking about 175-179 like it's not so difficult. Only .1% of test takers score that high and very few of those have an initial diagnostic in the 150s. 15 hours a week is about average for LSAT studying but time isn't the major factor necessarily. Also you don't need a 175 to get scholarship money at Texas.
Just do your best. Everyone on this forum wants over a 170 but only 3% of test takers can get it. Use this as motivation.

Definitely . I am shooting big, but will be happy with whatever I get as long as I put the work in. I figured with my UG GPA and Grad GPA I might need something on the higher end of the LSAT to both get in and get a scholarship. Is this not the right frame of mind?

muscleboundlaw wrote:

notsolawful wrote:I'm not trying to be a buzzkill but you are talking about 175-179 like it's not so difficult. Only .1% of test takers score that high and very few of those have an initial diagnostic in the 150s. 15 hours a week is about average for LSAT studying but time isn't the major factor necessarily. Also you don't need a 175 to get scholarship money at Texas.
Just do your best. Everyone on this forum wants over a 170 but only 3% of test takers can get it. Use this as motivation.

Definitely . I am shooting big, but will be happy with whatever I get as long as I put the work in. I figured with my UG GPA and Grad GPA I might need something on the higher end of the LSAT to both get in and get a scholarship. Is this not the right frame of mind?

It's definitely the right mindset to get the highest score possible. But if you're not getting a 175+ on practice tests don't think it's the end of the world. You could get scholarship money with 171-174. It also helps a ton that you're a Texas resident. I should've mentioned that in the last comment. I don't know for Texas but for Michigan they have to have a certain amount of Texas residents since it's a public institution.

notsolawful wrote:

muscleboundlaw wrote:

notsolawful wrote:I'm not trying to be a buzzkill but you are talking about 175-179 like it's not so difficult. Only .1% of test takers score that high and very few of those have an initial diagnostic in the 150s. 15 hours a week is about average for LSAT studying but time isn't the major factor necessarily. Also you don't need a 175 to get scholarship money at Texas.
Just do your best. Everyone on this forum wants over a 170 but only 3% of test takers can get it. Use this as motivation.

Definitely . I am shooting big, but will be happy with whatever I get as long as I put the work in. I figured with my UG GPA and Grad GPA I might need something on the higher end of the LSAT to both get in and get a scholarship. Is this not the right frame of mind?

It's definitely the right mindset to get the highest score possible. But if you're not getting a 175+ on practice tests don't think it's the end of the world. You could get scholarship money with 171-174. It also helps a ton that you're a Texas resident. I should've mentioned that in the last comment. I don't know for Texas but for Michigan they have to have a certain amount of Texas residents since it's a public institution.

I will be by the time of application. We just moved back about two months ago. Luckily, I have been employed in Texas since February so I will be considered a legal resident by the time of my application. Ahh, okay, that's great. I know Baylor is also a bit easier on their acceptance and scholarship for Texas residents. I will definitely not be overly concerned if I am not testing the highest possible score.

Anyway, what do you think is the standard drop off between practice test scores and test day scores?

I don't think you can predict. Lots of people drop on test day. Plenty of people stay the same. Many go up. You have no way of knowing which group you will be in. If you're not PTing at your goal range, I don't think it makes any sense to go in expecting you'll score higher. I think the best you can do is get to a point where you're consistently testing where you want to be, as well as prepping in noisy places, taking tests under test conditions, dealing with anxiety, etc., which will help reduce the chances that you run into problems on test day.

A. Nony Mouse wrote:I don't think you can predict. Lots of people drop on test day. Plenty of people stay the same. Many go up. You have no way of knowing which group you will be in. If you're not PTing at your goal range, I don't think it makes any sense to go in expecting you'll score higher. I think the best you can do is get to a point where you're consistently testing where you want to be, as well as prepping in noisy places, taking tests under test conditions, dealing with anxiety, etc., which will help reduce the chances that you run into problems on test day.

Prepping in noisy conditions is a new one. I can see why that can be beneficial.

Alright, well, that answers that then. Does anyone sell preptests with experimental sections from prior exams? The only part that stinks is that I can't ever simulate true testing conditions if I only get the four part prep.

To be fair, there may well be statistics somewhere about how much people drop, on average. But having read the waiter threads here for a few years, I do believe there's no way to predict whether you'll be part of the average or not. An average drop of (say) 3 points includes people who drop 3, people who don't drop at all, people who drop 6, etc.

muscleboundlaw wrote: Prepping in noisy conditions is a new one. I can see why that can be beneficial.

Alright, well, that answers that then. Does anyone sell preptests with experimental sections from prior exams? The only part that stinks is that I can't ever simulate true testing conditions if I only get the four part prep.

Use older PTs as the extra sections. Or, better yet, do six-section tests to build endurance.
I've also considered doing two four-section ones back-to-back. Only time will tell if I'll still go that route.

.

Study for a year dude. 15 hours a week for a year will get you to a very good score range. My diagnostic was a 146 and I scored a 169 on my first take doing light(ish) studying for a year.

RamTitan wrote:Study for a year dude. 15 hours a week for a year will get you to a very good score range. My diagnostic was a 146 and I scored a 169 on my first take doing light(ish) studying for a year.

I wish. At most I have around 5 months to do this. I really want to get going next year. I have been waiting to start law school for 4 years now and am growing tired of waiting haha.

Congratulations on the incredible jump! I hope to emulate that kind of result!

Deardevil wrote:

muscleboundlaw wrote: Prepping in noisy conditions is a new one. I can see why that can be beneficial.

Alright, well, that answers that then. Does anyone sell preptests with experimental sections from prior exams? The only part that stinks is that I can't ever simulate true testing conditions if I only get the four part prep.

Use older PTs as the extra sections. Or, better yet, do six-section tests to build endurance.
I've also considered doing two four-section ones back-to-back. Only time will tell if I'll still go that route.

This is probably highly variable for people, but if you have good focus, this is not necessary. The LSAT is often compared to training for a marathon, but I strongly disagree with that analogy. What will sap your energy on test day is stress and anxiety; if you can't focus for 5 sections before test day, then you're already SOL.

muscleboundlaw wrote:

RamTitan wrote:Study for a year dude. 15 hours a week for a year will get you to a very good score range. My diagnostic was a 146 and I scored a 169 on my first take doing light(ish) studying for a year.

I wish. At most I have around 5 months to do this. I really want to get going next year. I have been waiting to start law school for 4 years now and am growing tired of waiting haha.

Congratulations on the incredible jump! I hope to emulate that kind of result!

Do you man, but just know that law school will always be there.