Business Student with LSAT Questions Forum

[SteelPenguin]

Yes, a 180 is very easy with no timing.

I doubt even a top scorer getting 170+ timed will score 180 consistently untimed, since there's always ~2 questions in the newer RC with correct ACs that are ridiculously subtle, and sometimes there's an odd question in LR. I can see them going -0 in LG and usually LR though.

As you become more familiar with the test timing becomes much less of an obstacle. I believe that top scorers who get questions wrong timed would to a large degree have gotten those same questions wrong untimed. The gap between untimed and timed scores dramatically narrows as you practice.

Maybe you're right (and I'm actually really glad to hear timing becomes less of an issue), but then again, you can usually miss 1-3 questions and still make a 180.

With enough time, I'd be surprised if consistent 170+ test takers would get more than 2 questions wrong. LG would be an auto -0, and RC would be much easier as well, because you could continue to go back to the text for answers. I could still see a minus 1 or 2 because of a tricky question or two. Then, maybe 1 LR questions that you get stuck on. That makes for a score of between -0 and -3.

[SmokeyG]

"without time" pretty much means nothing. Each LSAT question is designed to be answered by the average joe, the key is doing them quickly. I dunno, maybe it should be comforting to get a 167 without time, but in my opinion that means nothing. You should be getting a 180 every time if your not timing it.

A 180? That's a pretty lofty claim but I guess I get your point. If you keep reading, I ended up doing timed tests and actually improved on them (170 was the latest - my third attempt). I think I much better understand the LSAT after searching some other posts on here, and I am extremely happy with that score so early in the game and without studying at all yet.

Hopefully practice tests lateral nicely into the real thing.

Yes, a 180 is very easy with no timing. It's unusual that you can pull off a 170 timed and are surprised by this claim.

Of course you shouldn't worry, you're golden man (I hate you). Btw, why do you want to change careers? What's your ultimate goal?

Well, long story short, high finance is a great career track if you want to make a ton of money that you'll have no time to spend. It also has a terrible culture where everybody is trying to keep up with the Jones, and it is quite frankly exhausting to hear about this guy's yacht or that guy's five story brownstone in the Upper East Side of Manhattan.

The main reason, however, is that I don't feel like its very intellectually rewarding. It also doesn't contribute or add much to society, and many times I feel like I'm just helping the rich get more rich. Which isn't immoral or wrong because they're all extremely smart/hardworking and we live in a meritocratic society. It's just doesn't always leave you with a sense of accomplishment outside the cushion of your bank account.

Also, as I've mentioned, I'd like to go into politics in the long run. It just seems to make sense that if I want to represent the people in this country, I should know more about the inner workings of law and government, not the stock market.

And I'd hesitate to say that I am "golden" for a HYS LSAT score, but I appreciate the confidence!

[t-14orbust]

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[heythatslife]

Well, long story short, high finance is a great career track if you want to make a ton of money that you'll have no time to spend. It also has a terrible culture where everybody is trying to keep up with the Jones, and it is quite frankly exhausting to hear about this guy's yacht or that guy's five story brownstone in the Upper East Side of Manhattan.

The main reason, however, is that I don't feel like its very intellectually rewarding. It also doesn't contribute or add much to society, and many times I feel like I'm just helping the rich get more rich. Which isn't immoral or wrong because they're all extremely smart/hardworking and we live in a meritocratic society. It's just doesn't always leave you with a sense of accomplishment outside the cushion of your bank account.

The finance world you described sounds an awful lot like law.

By the way, what's your undergrad GPA? It's curious to me that nobody's thought to ask this yet, but if below 3.7 your chances at Y & S would be pretty slim.

[crestor]

i don't understand why someone would want to go to law school if they are pretty locked on the road to a future i-banking gig...

3 more years of school at 50k a year with living expenses for a chance to work versus i-banking.

does not compute

[crestor]

did not read op's beautiful soliloquy on helping the little guy.

[SmokeyG]

Well, long story short, high finance is a great career track if you want to make a ton of money that you'll have no time to spend. It also has a terrible culture where everybody is trying to keep up with the Jones, and it is quite frankly exhausting to hear about this guy's yacht or that guy's five story brownstone in the Upper East Side of Manhattan.

The main reason, however, is that I don't feel like its very intellectually rewarding. It also doesn't contribute or add much to society, and many times I feel like I'm just helping the rich get more rich. Which isn't immoral or wrong because they're all extremely smart/hardworking and we live in a meritocratic society. It's just doesn't always leave you with a sense of accomplishment outside the cushion of your bank account.

The finance world you described sounds an awful lot like law.

By the way, what's your undergrad GPA? It's curious to me that nobody's thought to ask this yet, but if below 3.7 your chances at Y & S would be pretty slim.

3.99 at the moment.

[SteelPenguin]

Well, long story short, high finance is a great career track if you want to make a ton of money that you'll have no time to spend. It also has a terrible culture where everybody is trying to keep up with the Jones, and it is quite frankly exhausting to hear about this guy's yacht or that guy's five story brownstone in the Upper East Side of Manhattan.

The main reason, however, is that I don't feel like its very intellectually rewarding. It also doesn't contribute or add much to society, and many times I feel like I'm just helping the rich get more rich. Which isn't immoral or wrong because they're all extremely smart/hardworking and we live in a meritocratic society. It's just doesn't always leave you with a sense of accomplishment outside the cushion of your bank account.

Also, as I've mentioned, I'd like to go into politics in the long run. It just seems to make sense that if I want to represent the people in this country, I should know more about the inner workings of law and government, not the stock market.

And I'd hesitate to say that I am "golden" for a HYS LSAT score, but I appreciate the confidence!

I think everything you just described (except for the politics) that you dislike about finance is pretty much the same in biglaw, except with more risk.

[SmokeyG]

Well, long story short, high finance is a great career track if you want to make a ton of money that you'll have no time to spend. It also has a terrible culture where everybody is trying to keep up with the Jones, and it is quite frankly exhausting to hear about this guy's yacht or that guy's five story brownstone in the Upper East Side of Manhattan.

The main reason, however, is that I don't feel like its very intellectually rewarding. It also doesn't contribute or add much to society, and many times I feel like I'm just helping the rich get more rich. Which isn't immoral or wrong because they're all extremely smart/hardworking and we live in a meritocratic society. It's just doesn't always leave you with a sense of accomplishment outside the cushion of your bank account.

Also, as I've mentioned, I'd like to go into politics in the long run. It just seems to make sense that if I want to represent the people in this country, I should know more about the inner workings of law and government, not the stock market.

And I'd hesitate to say that I am "golden" for a HYS LSAT score, but I appreciate the confidence!

I think everything you just described (except for the politics) that you dislike about finance is pretty much the same in biglaw, except with more risk.

After reading around here, it seems like 95% of the people dream about Big Law. I don't think that's what I want. I'd probably aim for a prestigious clerkship, or a local government position to start my ascent.

[Otunga]

Yes, a 180 is very easy with no timing.

I doubt even a top scorer getting 170+ timed will score 180 consistently untimed, since there's always ~2 questions in the newer RC with correct ACs that are ridiculously subtle, and sometimes there's an odd question in LR. I can see them going -0 in LG and usually LR though.

As you become more familiar with the test timing becomes much less of an obstacle. I believe that top scorers who get questions wrong timed would to a large degree have gotten those same questions wrong untimed. The gap between untimed and timed scores dramatically narrows as you practice.

If I do untimed RC and LG, I'm good for 0/-1. But for LR, I'm good for -1- -3 per section timed or untimed. There are just some LR questions that make me crazy in each section.

[TheMostDangerousLG]

After reading around here, it seems like 95% of the people dream about Big Law. I don't think that's what I want. I'd probably aim for a prestigious clerkship, or a local government position to start my ascent.

There's a reason most people around here aim for big law, and it's not because we're interested in the culture or hours. Law school costs $200K+ (before interest): without (or let's face it, even with) substantial merit aid, most students face an absurd amount of debt after graduation. Big law salaries are on average much higher than the rest of the market- big law offers the surest way of taking care of what could otherwise be potentially paralyzing debt.

[Balthy]

After reading around here, it seems like 95% of the people dream about Big Law. I don't think that's what I want. I'd probably aim for a prestigious clerkship, or a local government position to start my ascent.

There's a reason most people around here aim for big law, and it's not because we're interested in the culture or hours. Law school costs $200K+ (before interest): without (or let's face it, even with) substantial merit aid, most students face an absurd amount of debt after graduation. Big law salaries are on average are much higher than the rest of the market- big law offers the surest way of taking care of what could otherwise be potentially paralyzing debt.

OP, this is true, and unfortunately, if you want a decent shot at a prestigious clerkship, the schools you want (HYS) happen to also be the schools which, from my understanding, give no merit aid. Being an i-banker, I doubt you'll get much in terms of need-based aid. WIth a 3.99, no interest in biglaw, and, let's assume, a 175+, I might consider shooting for a full ride at Duke/Mich/NYU and hope to pull off being top 10-15% of the class. Even at HYS, it's tough predicting that you'll be in the top 20, 35, or 25% of the class, respectively, so personally I would rather have an (admittedly, much lower) 10% chance of a fed clerkship without the enormous debt and ibanking to fall back to. Then again, I understand that the value, in terms of a future political career, of the H network and H on your resume aren't really expressed in these numbers, so tough decision. Good luck.

[SteelPenguin]

Well, long story short, high finance is a great career track if you want to make a ton of money that you'll have no time to spend. It also has a terrible culture where everybody is trying to keep up with the Jones, and it is quite frankly exhausting to hear about this guy's yacht or that guy's five story brownstone in the Upper East Side of Manhattan.

The main reason, however, is that I don't feel like its very intellectually rewarding. It also doesn't contribute or add much to society, and many times I feel like I'm just helping the rich get more rich. Which isn't immoral or wrong because they're all extremely smart/hardworking and we live in a meritocratic society. It's just doesn't always leave you with a sense of accomplishment outside the cushion of your bank account.

Also, as I've mentioned, I'd like to go into politics in the long run. It just seems to make sense that if I want to represent the people in this country, I should know more about the inner workings of law and government, not the stock market.

And I'd hesitate to say that I am "golden" for a HYS LSAT score, but I appreciate the confidence!

I think everything you just described (except for the politics) that you dislike about finance is pretty much the same in biglaw, except with more risk.

After reading around here, it seems like 95% of the people dream about Big Law. I don't think that's what I want. I'd probably aim for a prestigious clerkship, or a local government position to start my ascent.

Starting an ascent from local government sounds very unrealistic for what appears to be very lofty goals.

[SmokeyG]

Well, long story short, high finance is a great career track if you want to make a ton of money that you'll have no time to spend. It also has a terrible culture where everybody is trying to keep up with the Jones, and it is quite frankly exhausting to hear about this guy's yacht or that guy's five story brownstone in the Upper East Side of Manhattan.

The main reason, however, is that I don't feel like its very intellectually rewarding. It also doesn't contribute or add much to society, and many times I feel like I'm just helping the rich get more rich. Which isn't immoral or wrong because they're all extremely smart/hardworking and we live in a meritocratic society. It's just doesn't always leave you with a sense of accomplishment outside the cushion of your bank account.

Also, as I've mentioned, I'd like to go into politics in the long run. It just seems to make sense that if I want to represent the people in this country, I should know more about the inner workings of law and government, not the stock market.

And I'd hesitate to say that I am "golden" for a HYS LSAT score, but I appreciate the confidence!

But a prestigious clerkship does, so let's hope it is the former. Otherwise I'm going to have to Knope it.
I think everything you just described (except for the politics) that you dislike about finance is pretty much the same in biglaw, except with more risk.

After reading around here, it seems like 95% of the people dream about Big Law. I don't think that's what I want. I'd probably aim for a prestigious clerkship, or a local government position to start my ascent.

Starting an ascent from local government sounds very unrealistic for what appears to be very lofty goals.

[Daily_Double]

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