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Here is my situation -

I plan on taking the October LSAT, but by then I will have only had 2 and 1/2 months of studying. I want to be consistently scoring around 170 on timed practice tests by the time I take it. If I have not reached my target practice scores by then, should I take the LSAT anyway in October? I want to score a minimum of 167 to get into my target schools, and If I am practicing at around 165-167 I may still give the October LSAT a shot. I can always retake in December if I am not happy with my score.

My other option would be to wait until December and get more studying in. However, if near the end of September I feel like I am peaking in the 165ish area and can't improve, I think that I should just take the October LSAT.

I guess my question phrased another way would be, how can you tell what your ceiling is on the LSAT?

There is no ceiling if you study intelligently. Anything over about a 173 requires at least some luck, but with proper study I'd imagine that the 170 goal you have isn't out of reach.

If you aren't hitting your number by that point and are still improving, obviously you should wait.

incompetentia wrote:There is no ceiling if you study intelligently.Anything over about a 173 requires at least some luck , but with proper study I'd imagine that the 170 goal you have isn't out of reach.

If you aren't hitting your number by that point and are still improving, obviously you should wait.

Bolded is false

incompetentia wrote:There is no ceiling if you study intelligently. Anything over about a 173 requires at least some luck, but with proper study I'd imagine that the 170 goal you have isn't out of reach.

If you aren't hitting your number by that point and are still improving, obviously you should wait.

I think there are some people that just cannot get a 170 no matter what they do. If you are smart enough to get in the mid 160's after some studying then I would say that you should be able to get in the 170+ range with some more studying. If you only have 2.5 months make sure you are hitting it hard and being smart about it. You also want to make sure you don't hit it too hard are are burned out by test time. Maybe it would be better to wait until December... Which cycle are you applying?

Best case scenario would be score a 170 and apply around November to GWU or another school ED, and try to get some $ out of it if I can. But thats my dream scenario, I'm prepared for disappointment, lol.

incompetentia wrote:There is no ceiling if you study intelligently. Anything over about a 173 requires at least some luck, but with proper study I'd imagine that the 170 goal you have isn't out of reach.

If you aren't hitting your number by that point and are still improving, obviously you should wait.

There was a student at my UG who scored a 179 and retook. 180 on the next crack at it. He may be an exception, but this is definitely not true.

TheZoid wrote:

incompetentia wrote:There is no ceiling if you study intelligently. Anything over about a 173 requires at least some luck, but with proper study I'd imagine that the 170 goal you have isn't out of reach.

If you aren't hitting your number by that point and are still improving, obviously you should wait.

There was a student at my UG who scored a 179 and retook. 180 on the next crack at it. He may be an exception, but this is definitely not true.

Wow how do you talk yourself into retaking a 179? That's some confidence I guess. I wonder what schools thought when they saw a 179/180. He probably stayed away from schools that average multiple LSAT scores.

It's not necessarily true, but it's better to assume that that's the case, especially in this context. If you're one of those people, you'd know by now and have no need to ask this type of question.

msuz wrote:I guess my question phrased another way would be, how can you tell what your ceiling is on the LSAT?

You'll never score over 180. Sorry to break it to you.

incompetentia wrote:It's not necessarily true, but it's better to assume that that's the case, especially in this context. If you're one of those people, you'd know by now and have no need to ask this type of question.

I agree. Some people are just crazy smart and know they can nail a 175+ but for a lot of people getting 173+ required some luck. They guessed right two or three questions they were 50/50 or something.

EarlCat wrote:

msuz wrote:I guess my question phrased another way would be, how can you tell what your ceiling is on the LSAT?

You'll never score over 180. Sorry to break it to you.

I think if you score a 180, then retake and get another 180, you should be able to trade them both in for a 181.

incompetentia wrote:There is no ceiling if you study intelligently. Anything over about a 173 requires at least some luck, but with proper study I'd imagine that the 170 goal you have isn't out of reach.

If you aren't hitting your number by that point and are still improving, obviously you should wait.

I'd say the number is more like 175. Many 180ers note in their TLS guides to 180s that certain things have to come together. Luck, a curve with a little space at the top, and a really good day are among these things. Even the best testers - except Mike from Suits - need some of the perfect conditions to come together for a 180 to happen.

JamMasterJ wrote:

incompetentia wrote:There is no ceiling if you study intelligently. Anything over about a 173 requires at least some luck, but with proper study I'd imagine that the 170 goal you have isn't out of reach.

If you aren't hitting your number by that point and are still improving, obviously you should wait.

I'd say the number is more like 175. Many 180ers note in their TLS guides to 180s that certain things have to come together. Luck, a curve with a little space at the top, and a really good day are among these things. Even the best testers - except Mike from Suits - need some of the perfect conditions to come together for a 180 to happen.

Yeah, this is probably more accurate. 173 was probably a bit low on the original post, but to say that you can assure yourself of a 180 is still slightly delusional.

incompetentia wrote:It's not necessarily true, but it's better to assume that that's the case, especially in this context. If you're one of those people, you'd know by now and have no need to ask this type of question.

Thats a good point.

emciosn wrote:

TheZoid wrote:

incompetentia wrote:There is no ceiling if you study intelligently. Anything over about a 173 requires at least some luck, but with proper study I'd imagine that the 170 goal you have isn't out of reach.

If you aren't hitting your number by that point and are still improving, obviously you should wait.

There was a student at my UG who scored a 179 and retook. 180 on the next crack at it. He may be an exception, but this is definitely not true.

Wow how do you talk yourself into retaking a 179? That's some confidence I guess. I wonder what schools thought when they saw a 179/180. He probably stayed away from schools that average multiple LSAT scores.

Hahaha the last line made me laugh.

Ps. Confession: I had a very fleeting urge to retake my 178. I'm still ashamed of those seconds.

I was reluctant to enter this thread because I imagine I'll come off as arrogant irrespective of my phrasing, but the idea that anything over 173 or 175 requires luck is just false. My last 10 PTs were: 178, 179, 180, 178, 180, 179, 179, 180, 180, 180 and I scored 180 on the actual thing. It required an absurd amount of studying and I think my innate skill set happens to predispose me to scoring well on this sort of test , but it's certainly possible to be in that range without needing to win the coin flips.

Keeper1125 wrote:I was reluctant to enter this thread because I imagine I'll come off as arrogant irrespective of my phrasing, but the idea that anything over 173 or 175 requires luck is just false. My last 10 PTs were: 178, 179, 180, 178, 180, 179, 179, 180, 180, 180 and I scored 180 on the actual thing. It required an absurd amount of studying and I think my innate skill set happens to predispose me to scoring well on this sort of test , but it's certainly possible to be in that range without needing to win the coin flips.

In your case I think you are absolutely right. Some people have the innate ability to get 175+ on this test every time. I think that for a large number of people that get 175+ the planets were kind of aligned for them. Whether its having a good day or getting their coin flip questions right whatever. You're right, though, a large number of people with those scores just have the god given ability to nail the LSAT (and the drive to study their ass off, not to take anything away from that).

I don't think it's "God given ability". If you have a natural disposition to be interested in analytic argumentation, that might be a characteristic, but not an ability.

180. Once you've hit that ceiling, you know you're done.