Page 1 of 2
Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 9:43 pm
by redbullvodka
This might actually be better placed in the employment thread, so mods feel free to dump it in there if you prefer.
I'm from about 45 min. outside the Philadelphia area, and would very much want to come back to Philly to practice. I think I have the stats for Penn, but probably little or no money (173, 3.63), and would assume I could get close to a full boat from Temple, since I'm in state and am far above both medians. This might seem like a silly question, but if given the choice between debt free Temple, and close to full debt Penn, does anyone think it would be crazy to take Temple? Assuming I truly wanted to work in Philly after graduation? I know this is a hypothetical, but it seems like a realistic one. Thanks!
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 9:47 pm
by CanadianWolf
It's better to wait until you have the acceptances & a scholarship in hand before seeking an answer. Nevertheless, it would depend upon what type of placement you're seeking (e.g., biglaw or PI or prosecutorial or PD) & how each law school places in those areas.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 9:57 pm
by Wholigan
Depends what you want to do. If you want to be a Philly prosecutor, you will probably have a better chance from Temple, not to mention being able to afford to take the lower salary position due to a lower loan balance. If you want Philly biglaw, you will probably only have a chance to interview if you are top 20% or so at Temple, while you'll have a shot with almost any grades from Penn, assuming you can sell your Philly ties well.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 9:58 pm
by beach_terror
Go to Penn.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 10:07 pm
by tennisking88
beach_terror wrote:Go to Penn.
Go to Penn. If you're smart enough to get a 173/3.83 you are smart enough to do very well at Penn. You can also get a great scholly from even a lower T14 like Georgetown, which also place in Philly.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 10:14 pm
by Veyron
Wholigan wrote:Depends what you want to do. If you want to be a Philly prosecutor, you will probably have a better chance from Temple, not to mention being able to afford to take the lower salary position due to a lower loan balance. If you want Philly biglaw, you will probably only have a chance to interview if you are top 20% or so at Temple, while you'll have a shot with almost any grades from Penn, assuming you can sell your Philly ties well.
Completely ignores Penn's awesome LRAP.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 10:17 pm
by JamMasterJ
beach_terror wrote:Go to Penn.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 10:24 pm
by crossarmant
tennisking88 wrote:beach_terror wrote:Go to Penn.
Go to Penn.
If you're smart enough to get a 173/3.83 you are smart enough to do very well at Penn. You can also get a great scholly from even a lower T14 like Georgetown, which also place in Philly.
Yeah... you and every other person at Penn with those qualifications; not to mention those who passed up on the Holy Trinity to stay in Philly.... puh-lease.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 10:25 pm
by tennisking88
crossarmant wrote:tennisking88 wrote:beach_terror wrote:Go to Penn.
Go to Penn.
If you're smart enough to get a 173/3.83 you are smart enough to do very well at Penn. You can also get a great scholly from even a lower T14 like Georgetown, which also place in Philly.
Yeah... you and every other person at Penn with those qualifications; not to mention those who passed up on the Holy Trinity to stay in Philly.... puh-lease.
Didn't say he WILL do well, just saying I bet he's smart enough. RC for the win.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 10:26 pm
by BruceWayne
Wholigan wrote:Depends what you want to do. If you want to be a Philly prosecutor, you will probably have a better chance from Temple, not to mention being able to afford to take the lower salary position due to a lower loan balance. If you want Philly biglaw, you will probably only have a chance to interview if you are top 20% or so at Temple,
while you'll have a shot with almost any grades from Penn, assuming you can sell your Philly ties well.[/quote]
tennisking88 wrote:beach_terror wrote:Go to Penn.
Go to Penn.
If you're smart enough to get a 173/3.83 you are smart enough to do very well at Penn. You can also get a great scholly from even a lower T14 like Georgetown, which also place in Philly.
Go to Penn, but because of the former, not the latter. Everyone at Penn is smart; besides being smart is only part of the equation in terms of getting good grades. Hell, it might not even be the number one part of getting good grades.
LRAP at Penn will cover you if you want PI Philly work and PI employers in Philly won't care about your grades if you can show dedicated pi interest. Philly firms will care, but if you can interview well and sell yourself you should be able to pull down a job at some Philly firm. Penn hands down.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 10:29 pm
by beach_terror
tennisking88 wrote:crossarmant wrote:tennisking88 wrote:beach_terror wrote:Go to Penn.
Go to Penn.
If you're smart enough to get a 173/3.83 you are smart enough to do very well at Penn. You can also get a great scholly from even a lower T14 like Georgetown, which also place in Philly.
Yeah... you and every other person at Penn with those qualifications; not to mention those who passed up on the Holy Trinity to stay in Philly.... puh-lease.
Didn't say he WILL do well, just saying I bet he's smart enough. RC for the win.
You're clearly a 0L or 1L without grades yet. Intelligence has very little to do with law school grades. If it did, I'd be super fucked.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 10:31 pm
by tennisking88
Well I believe that
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 10:31 pm
by patrickd139
As you can probably already guess, the vast majority of posters on this board (myself included), given little personal information about yourself, are going to tell you to go to Penn. There are 100s of reasons why they're right, and probably fewer, but no less legitimate, reasons why that might not be the answer for you.
The first response got it right though, apply to both, see what scholarship packages you get from Temple (and I'm guessing it will be significant), and then come back.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 10:33 pm
by patrickd139
beach_terror wrote: Intelligence has very little to do with law school grades. If it did, I'd be super fucked.
Also, this.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 10:34 pm
by BruceWayne
beach_terror wrote:You're clearly a 0L or 1L without grades yet. Intelligence has very little to do with law school grades. If it did, I'd be super fucked.
Post Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 9:29 pm
LOL so true. No one who has actually gone through a year of law school says anything like that.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:58 pm
by Veyron
BruceWayne wrote:beach_terror wrote:You're clearly a 0L or 1L without grades yet. Intelligence has very little to do with law school grades. If it did, I'd be super fucked.
Post Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 9:29 pm
LOL so true. No one who has actually gone through a year of law school says anything like that.
True, although I will say that people with numbers WAY above the medians (e.g. 3.9, 174) do tend to uniformly end up at the top of the class.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2011 8:30 am
by Wholigan
Veyron wrote:Wholigan wrote:Depends what you want to do. If you want to be a Philly prosecutor, you will probably have a better chance from Temple, not to mention being able to afford to take the lower salary position due to a lower loan balance. If you want Philly biglaw, you will probably only have a chance to interview if you are top 20% or so at Temple, while you'll have a shot with almost any grades from Penn, assuming you can sell your Philly ties well.
Completely ignores Penn's awesome LRAP.
Didn’t mean that it wouldn’t be financially feasible from Penn. But even with the LRAP, you would still have more money in your pocket by taking a full ride from Temple, especially in years 5-10. But the real reason Temple is better for the DA is that the office is heavily staffed with Temple grads who believe that Temple’s trial ad program is the gold standard.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2011 9:16 am
by johnnyutah
If you want to work in Philly for anything other than BigLaw, take the money and go to Temple. If you think you might want to leave Philly or are dead set on nothing but BigLaw, go to Penn.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2011 9:29 am
by caminante
Are you married yet? If not, I would definitely go to Penn. You never know where your future S.O. will want/need to live. I have a friend who went to a regional school knowing that he would want to practice around the area... then he met his fiance who is completely committed to moving back to her home city. Now he has to decide between breaking up with his fiance and moving to a city where he has very slim chances at employment.
That might seem like a weird consideration, but I'm married and choosing a city that my husband and I both enjoy and can find jobs that we love has been very, very difficult! Better to have more options if this is something you value.
But you should definitely apply to both and make an informed decision. Who knows, maybe you will get more money than you think from Penn.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2011 9:35 am
by johnnyutah
caminante wrote:Are you married yet? If not, I would definitely go to Penn. You never know where your future S.O. will want/need to live. I have a friend who went to a regional school knowing that he would want to practice around the area... then he met his fiance who is completely committed to moving back to her home city. Now he has to decide between breaking up with his fiance and moving to a city where he has very slim chances at employment.
That might seem like a weird consideration, but I'm married and choosing a city that my husband and I both enjoy and can find jobs that we love has been very, very difficult! Better to have more options if this is something you value.
But you should definitely apply to both and make an informed decision. Who knows, maybe you will get more money than you think from Penn.
This is a decent point, but it's also worth remembering that debt can also prevent you from moving to a new city, in the sense that it can make it difficult for you to quit your job until you pay it back.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2011 10:34 am
by beach_terror
Wholigan wrote:Veyron wrote:Wholigan wrote:Depends what you want to do. If you want to be a Philly prosecutor, you will probably have a better chance from Temple, not to mention being able to afford to take the lower salary position due to a lower loan balance. If you want Philly biglaw, you will probably only have a chance to interview if you are top 20% or so at Temple, while you'll have a shot with almost any grades from Penn, assuming you can sell your Philly ties well.
Completely ignores Penn's awesome LRAP.
Didn’t mean that it wouldn’t be financially feasible from Penn. But even with the LRAP, you would still have more money in your pocket by taking a full ride from Temple, especially in years 5-10. But the real reason Temple is better for the DA is that the office is heavily staffed with Temple grads who believe that Temple’s trial ad program is the gold standard.
Actually, the DA's office openly told our 1L class that they wish they could fill their entire office with Penn grads.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2011 10:37 am
by johnnyutah
beach_terror wrote:Actually, the DA's office openly told our 1L class that they wish they could fill their entire office with Penn grads.
I find it hard to believe they're telling the truth.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2011 10:48 am
by beach_terror
johnnyutah wrote:beach_terror wrote:Actually, the DA's office openly told our 1L class that they wish they could fill their entire office with Penn grads.
I find it hard to believe they're telling the truth.
I mean, why would they lie to a Villanova 1L class? Law is like anything else, they'd prefer the most qualified candidates. This was for homicide, if it matters.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2011 10:51 am
by johnnyutah
beach_terror wrote:johnnyutah wrote:beach_terror wrote:Actually, the DA's office openly told our 1L class that they wish they could fill their entire office with Penn grads.
I find it hard to believe they're telling the truth.
I mean, why would they lie to a Villanova 1L class? Law is like anything else, they'd prefer the most qualified candidates. This was for homicide, if it matters.
Funny. My impression has always been that local Philadelphia government/PI employers are leery of Penn grads.
Re: Penn vs. Temple $$$$
Posted: Wed Nov 02, 2011 1:36 pm
by crossarmant
beach_terror wrote:Actually, the DA's office openly told our 1L class that they wish they could fill their entire office with Penn grads.
Bullshit. We went to the Philly DA's office and PD's office with our LRW class and the place was staffed with people from all over. UPenn, Penn State, Temple, Rutgers, Villanova, Widener, etc. And they weren't merely
old lawyers, a lot of these people were fresh faces.
I mean, they may WANT to fill their office with only UPenn grads, but to be fair, what place wouldn't want to fill their office with exclusively top of the top Ivy League grads and pay them the same as they would from *State* U?