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lollawlawl wrote:LOL. Whoa. Didn't mean to get on your nerves, sorry for wasting your time! WOW! I must be confused isn't this forum is to discuss the bar application? To ask questions? To seek others' opinions? You might think all my classmates are dumb and that's great. I sure hope the majority of future lawyers don't have an attitude like yours. Many bar applicants struggle with what to disclose/what not to disclose. Especially when failure to disclose is considered lack of candor. And especially when lack of candor can result in denial of admission. I'm glad you're so far above everyone else to have figured it out and you don't have to seek legal advice, post on a forum or consult the Lawyer Assistance Program! So happy for you!
You're not seeking the opinions of others in this forum. You're seeking comfirmation that you're correct.
Actually - My original stance was not to disclose. There was a shadow of doubt casted and I was seeking others' opinions. I was asking follow up questions. I might have played a little devil's advocate, but I don't think I ever said I believe applicants should disclose incidents with police. I said other classmates did, the LAP, and the dean. In fact, several times I said I didn't believe it was necessary to disclose.
I apologize for wasting so much of your time. I was just asking for opinions on a subject that causes tremendous stress for some bar applicants. I'm so pleased that the majority of this forum is not worried about it. What does trouble me is the how the majority of the forum treats a concerned law student/bar applicant. I hope you don't treat your clients or colleagues that way.
I don't think you have to disclose 4 interactions with the police that didn't result in any charges. I think if your use of alcohol is something that leads you to contacts with the police you maybe want to think about whether there are any issues with it that could cause you problems (I don't know you; I have no idea).
But if your Dean and the Director of Legal Assistance both say disclose, presumably they've seen a seen a lot of bar applications in your state and have a better idea of what the state bar wants to see than people here do (whether those things actually are a cause for concern or not).
rinkrat19 wrote:How on earth do you interpret the second question as trying to get you to disclose interactions with the police in which you weren't arrested or charged?
Running an underground gambling parlor but never being arrested would fall under the second question. Being a passenger in a car pulled over for speeding would not.
Obviously. What about being questioned for indecent exposure? Your example is pretty 'black or white'. I'm just saying - everyone at my school is interpreting this question as including times you've been questioned by police - even if no charge has resulted.
There are some saying that there's no way the bar examiners are going that deep, others are sure they are. For some of us - having to include police incidents is a large task. Seriously, how do you remember that one time 5 years ago you were at a party and cops came and said turn the music down? Events like this are said to be included in the question.
You shouldn't have to report being questioned for indecent exposure, either. It doesn't matter if it's murder. If you weren't charged, it's a non-issue. Even if you were charged, as long as you aren't convicted or admit guilt as part of a deferred adjudication, it should be reported only so they can look at the evidence themselves; but even then, it shouldn't stand in the way of your being barred. This is my opinion, not meant to be a statement of policy.
I would advise to always lean towards full disclosure.
My admission was held up for two years because I didn't include on my application the fact that when I was 16 years old -- 15 years earlier -- that I had been stopped for speeding and then escorted back to school for being truant. My mother was then called and she picked me up.
I honestly had completely forgot about it, and even if I hadn't it seemed in no way relevant. I had no idea that the local police department had made a report about the stop.
The attorney assigned to conduct my character committee interview considered it an "arrest" which I did not report on my application and didn't believe me that I had forgotten the event. He denied my admission and I spent two years of hell going through the appeals process until the state Supreme Court unanimously voted to admit me.
Needless to say I've been scarred for life from the experience. I just took the CA Bar and am dreading going through the character application process again. The chances of ever encountering a bigger asshole than the guy mentioned above are slim, but certainly possible.