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Hi guys,

Im a 0L, i am interested as to which route to take if my goal was to eventually practice U.S. Law in Europe (London, Munich, Zurich, Milan, Madrid, etc), is there any particular field in which that is more likely than others? If so which route would you take? Big Law in NYC?

I speak fluent Italian and Spanish, if that helps.

Also, i know those jobs won't likely come straight out of Law School.

My understanding is that the easiest jobs for an American lawyer to get overseas are in Capital Markets (transactional) and International Arbitration (litigation adjacent). CM might be more of a UK thing rather than on the continent, not sure. For both, starting in one of those groups in an NYC firm that is strong in that work would probably be the simplest, though it’s also definitely feasible for a well credentialed American law student to get a Biglaw job in London straight out of school too.

Curious as to why you did not list Frankfurt, Germany among your targeted destinations. Suggests that you may be at the beginning of your career plans.

Maxcol95 wrote: ↑

Thu Feb 25, 2021 1:25 pm

Hi guys,

Im a 0L, i am interested as to which route to take if my goal was to eventually practice U.S. Law in Europe (London, Munich, Zurich, Milan, Madrid, etc), is there any particular field in which that is more likely than others? If so which route would you take? Big Law in NYC?

I speak fluent Italian and Spanish, if that helps.

Also, i know those jobs won't likely come straight out of Law School.

Do you have any particular reason to list these cities? Munich, Zurich, Milan and Madrid are quite local markets. For Munich and Zurich, most jobs will require German language skills. Milan and Madrid are oversaturated with lawyers and generally offer less attractive career paths. London will certainly be easier (see also the advice given above).

CanadianWolf wrote: ↑

Thu Feb 25, 2021 7:15 pm

Curious as to why you did not list Frankfurt, Germany among your targeted destinations. Suggests that you may be at the beginning of your career plans.

Frankfurt would be a great option too, the cities i listed were mainly just example but any other city in Europe would be great too.

Casper123 wrote: ↑

Fri Feb 26, 2021 1:32 pm

Maxcol95 wrote: ↑

Thu Feb 25, 2021 1:25 pm

Hi guys,

Im a 0L, i am interested as to which route to take if my goal was to eventually practice U.S. Law in Europe (London, Munich, Zurich, Milan, Madrid, etc), is there any particular field in which that is more likely than others? If so which route would you take? Big Law in NYC?

I speak fluent Italian and Spanish, if that helps.

Also, i know those jobs won't likely come straight out of Law School.

Do you have any particular reason to list these cities? Munich, Zurich, Milan and Madrid are quite local markets. For Munich and Zurich, most jobs will require German language skills. Milan and Madrid are oversaturated with lawyers and generally offer less attractive career paths. London will certainly be easier (see also the advice given above).

Which cities would you say are the easiest or best to break into for American lawyers?

Maxcol95 wrote: ↑

Fri Feb 26, 2021 3:20 pm

Casper123 wrote: ↑

Fri Feb 26, 2021 1:32 pm

Maxcol95 wrote: ↑

Thu Feb 25, 2021 1:25 pm

Hi guys,

Im a 0L, i am interested as to which route to take if my goal was to eventually practice U.S. Law in Europe (London, Munich, Zurich, Milan, Madrid, etc), is there any particular field in which that is more likely than others? If so which route would you take? Big Law in NYC?

I speak fluent Italian and Spanish, if that helps.

Also, i know those jobs won't likely come straight out of Law School.

Do you have any particular reason to list these cities? Munich, Zurich, Milan and Madrid are quite local markets. For Munich and Zurich, most jobs will require German language skills. Milan and Madrid are oversaturated with lawyers and generally offer less attractive career paths. London will certainly be easier (see also the advice given above).

Which cities would you say are the easiest or best to break into for American lawyers?

Definitely London. Maybe Paris for international arbitration but that‘s already way trickier. Someone mentioned Frankfurt, which will be easier than Munich to break into but still very difficult if you don‘t speak German. Also, I don‘t see why anyone would want to end up in Frankfurt.

There are other options here and there but they seem difficult to plan and my impression is that you need a combination of luck, specific work experience or connections. It might be easier to give advice if you could tell us why you want to go to Europe and which type of law you‘re interested in. As I said before, your list of city seemed a bit random.

The above poster asked why one would want to end up in Frankfurt, Germany.

The answer is because it a major financial center of the EU. Lots of professional services jobs in banking, finance, accounting, equities trading, and law--especially those related to the industries of banking, finance, securities, & taxes.

Just read a reference to Frankfurt as "the financial and economic center of Germany"; for example, the Frankfurt Stock Exchange is the largest in Germany.

There are legal & tax accounting positions in Frankfurt which hire US practitioners.

Look into Dublin as well as London. The legal market is hot and growing right now because of Brexit. Lots of American companies are choosing to set up shop there as an alternative to London, and therefore the demand for lawyers is growing, both at Irish firms and the companies themselves. There is also a fairly quick mechanism by which a lawyer licensed in NY can transfer qualifications to Ireland after getting a year of PQE in NY.

You can land a big law job in London without too much trouble if you come from a good law school. Just make sure you really love high-yield debt.

CanadianWolf wrote: ↑

Fri Feb 26, 2021 8:29 pm

The above poster asked why one would want to end up in Frankfurt, Germany.

The answer is because it a major financial center of the EU. Lots of professional services jobs in banking, finance, accounting, equities trading, and law--especially those related to the industries of banking, finance, securities, & taxes.

Just read a reference to Frankfurt as "the financial and economic center of Germany"; for example, the Frankfurt Stock Exchange is the largest in Germany.

There are legal & tax accounting positions in Frankfurt which hire US practitioners.

Yeah, what I meant to say was the Frankfurt is...not a nice city (same for Dublin). I don't see why you would want to spend three years and a lot of money to get a US law degree to end up working in a legal & tax accounting position in Frankfurt.

OP's random selection of pretty European cities suggests that they spent a summer traveling around the continent and happened to like some of the places. It is difficult to give good advice based on that. Like, what's their priority, practicing law or ending up in Europe? If the latter, a career outside of law would probably make more sense.

Regarding Frankfurt, Germany: I just checked out several V10 law firms. Four or five have Frankfurt offices.

Some highly ranked Vault firms have offices in both Frankfurt & Munich, while some just have an office in one city or the other.

If I recall correctly, law offices in Germany & in other parts of the EU can hire & house & charge for CPA/tax advising personnel who are not attorneys.

OP: My point is that you should not ignore this German city if you want to work in Europe. Capital Markets, Finance, Tax, etc.

Just read an article from 2015 that may be of interest to the original poster in this thread. Titled:

"Top 10 Cities Outside of the US and the UK Where LLMs are Currently Working in Big Law Firms"

1) Paris--345
2) Frankfurt--192
3) Brussels--187
4) Hamburg--94
5) Amsterdam--94
6) Honk Kong--93
7) Munich--86
8 Warsaw--80
9) Stockholm--74
10) Tokyo--74

About 20% of the 13,000 Big Law lawyers outside the US and UK are listed as having an LLM.

The 11 international biglaw firms examined were: Norton Rose, Linklaters, Freshfields, Allen Overy, Latham Watkins, Jones Day, White & Case, DLA Piper, Hogan Lovells, Baker & McKenzie, & Skadden.

Again, this was a study done in 2015. It may help OP identify target cities for ex-pats in law.

CanadianWolf wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 28, 2021 10:52 am

Just read an article from 2015 that may be of interest to the original poster in this thread. Titled:

"Top 10 Cities Outside of the US and the UK Where LLMs are Currently Working in Big Law Firms"

1) Paris--345
2) Frankfurt--192
3) Brussels--187
4) Hamburg--94
5) Amsterdam--94
6) Honk Kong--93
7) Munich--86
8 Warsaw--80
9) Stockholm--74
10) Tokyo--74

About 20% of the 13,000 Big Law lawyers outside the US and UK are listed as having an LLM.

The 11 international biglaw firms examined were: Norton Rose, Linklaters, Freshfields, Allen Overy, Latham Watkins, Jones Day, White & Case, DLA Piper, Hogan Lovells, Baker & McKenzie, & Skadden.

Again, this was a study done in 2015. It may help OP identify target cities for ex-pats in law.

I think you‘re misinterpreting something: 99% of these lawyers have a first law degree from a university in the jurisdiction they are practising. They then get an LLM in the UK or the US to get a fancy brand on their CV. This has nothing to do with someone who only has US degree.

Also, the fact that US law firms are present in various European cities does not really make it easier to break into these markets. Look at the list of lawyers that are based at the European offices of these US law firms and you will see that only a very very few of them (none at most offices) are US lawyers.

I‘m not saying that it is impossible for a US lawyer to find a job in Europe other than in London (and to a limited extent in Paris; no idea about Dublin) but it is hard and difficult to plan. If OP is really set on moving to Europe, persuing a career outside of law or getting a European law degree would certainly be the easier and much cheaper route.

No misinterpretation. Just adding information for OP to consider.

I do understand that comparative law LLM degrees are for those with foreign law degrees.

Seeing as OP is a 0L, my advice is don't go to law school in the US.

Except for London, trying to go to Europe as a lawyer is like aiming for federal appellate court - it's damn near impossible. There's very few practice areas that require a U.S. law degree, and you'll be competing against locals with LLMs. Unlike the U.S., if you want to practice locally, you'll need not just a local law degree, but also an apprenticeship.

If you know you want to be a lawyer in, say, Madrid, go to law school in Spain. It'll be a lot easier than trying to get a job there as a US-barred attorney. If you just want to go to Europe generally, or for a few years, go to business school

How difficult would it be for a NYC international arbitration associate to lateral or transfer to London? I imagine Paris would be more difficult, especially without French fluency.