Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring Forum

(Seek and share information about clerkship applications, clerkship hiring timelines, and post-clerkship employment opportunities)
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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Fri Feb 26, 2021 5:02 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Feb 26, 2021 4:05 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Feb 25, 2021 11:08 pm
Susman, MoloLamken, Wilkinson are comparable to Kellogg in selectivity and more selective than W&C
I'd say, for post-clerkship hiring, the selectivity is roughly Susman/Kellogg > W&C > Molo. Wilkinson is a wild card right now because it's undergoing change and it may not be hiring as much. A lot of W&C summers also return after their clerkships so there aren't as many spots for clerks who didn't summer there. By contrast, Molo relies on clerk hiring, and doesn't require as tip top credentials as Susman/Kellogg.
It's hard to slice and dice at this level--these are basically the hardest firms to get a job at, period. The fact that Molo doesn't have a summer program at all, and its size, makes it hard to compare to Susman, W&C, and Kellogg, but I have seen several top tier candidates with incredible credentials strike out at both Molo and Susman, while I'm occasionally surprised to see folks get jobs at W&C and Kellogg. But fit plays a pretty large role, too, since as one poster pointed out above, these firms hand out a tiny number of offers.

In the end, no one should expect to walk in to a job at any of these firms.

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Fri Feb 26, 2021 9:03 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Feb 26, 2021 4:05 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Feb 25, 2021 11:08 pm
Susman, MoloLamken, Wilkinson are comparable to Kellogg in selectivity and more selective than W&C
I'd say, for post-clerkship hiring, the selectivity is roughly Susman/Kellogg > W&C > Molo. Wilkinson is a wild card right now because it's undergoing change and it may not be hiring as much. A lot of W&C summers also return after their clerkships so there aren't as many spots for clerks who didn't summer there. By contrast, Molo relies on clerk hiring, and doesn't require as tip top credentials as Susman/Kellogg.
What do you mean Wilkinson is undergoing change? I was under the impression that they’re hiring the same as they always do, ie. 4-6 per year

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Fri Feb 26, 2021 9:09 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Feb 26, 2021 9:03 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Feb 26, 2021 4:05 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Feb 25, 2021 11:08 pm
Susman, MoloLamken, Wilkinson are comparable to Kellogg in selectivity and more selective than W&C
I'd say, for post-clerkship hiring, the selectivity is roughly Susman/Kellogg > W&C > Molo. Wilkinson is a wild card right now because it's undergoing change and it may not be hiring as much. A lot of W&C summers also return after their clerkships so there aren't as many spots for clerks who didn't summer there. By contrast, Molo relies on clerk hiring, and doesn't require as tip top credentials as Susman/Kellogg.
What do you mean Wilkinson is undergoing change? I was under the impression that they’re hiring the same as they always do, ie. 4-6 per year
Wilkinson has had a bunch of partners leave this year, nothing I've read really explains what's going on though

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Fri Feb 26, 2021 10:20 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Feb 26, 2021 9:09 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Feb 26, 2021 9:03 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Feb 26, 2021 4:05 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Feb 25, 2021 11:08 pm
Susman, MoloLamken, Wilkinson are comparable to Kellogg in selectivity and more selective than W&C
I'd say, for post-clerkship hiring, the selectivity is roughly Susman/Kellogg > W&C > Molo. Wilkinson is a wild card right now because it's undergoing change and it may not be hiring as much. A lot of W&C summers also return after their clerkships so there aren't as many spots for clerks who didn't summer there. By contrast, Molo relies on clerk hiring, and doesn't require as tip top credentials as Susman/Kellogg.
What do you mean Wilkinson is undergoing change? I was under the impression that they’re hiring the same as they always do, ie. 4-6 per year
Wilkinson has had a bunch of partners leave this year, nothing I've read really explains what's going on though
My understanding is those partners didn't leave to go to other firms, which suggests something personal rather than something bad about the firm. Pretty sure Beth Wilkinson has always been the biggest hitter in terms of bringing in clients anyway.

Anonymous User
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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Sat Feb 27, 2021 12:09 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Feb 26, 2021 10:20 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Feb 26, 2021 9:09 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Feb 26, 2021 9:03 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Feb 26, 2021 4:05 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Feb 25, 2021 11:08 pm
Susman, MoloLamken, Wilkinson are comparable to Kellogg in selectivity and more selective than W&C
I'd say, for post-clerkship hiring, the selectivity is roughly Susman/Kellogg > W&C > Molo. Wilkinson is a wild card right now because it's undergoing change and it may not be hiring as much. A lot of W&C summers also return after their clerkships so there aren't as many spots for clerks who didn't summer there. By contrast, Molo relies on clerk hiring, and doesn't require as tip top credentials as Susman/Kellogg.
What do you mean Wilkinson is undergoing change? I was under the impression that they’re hiring the same as they always do, ie. 4-6 per year
Wilkinson has had a bunch of partners leave this year, nothing I've read really explains what's going on though
My understanding is those partners didn't leave to go to other firms, which suggests something personal rather than something bad about the firm. Pretty sure Beth Wilkinson has always been the biggest hitter in terms of bringing in clients anyway.
Yeah that’s consistent with my understanding too. From talking to people, it seems like the firm is doing great/there’s nothing to worry about

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Anonymous User
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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Mon Mar 01, 2021 9:54 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Feb 26, 2021 5:02 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Feb 26, 2021 4:05 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Feb 25, 2021 11:08 pm
Susman, MoloLamken, Wilkinson are comparable to Kellogg in selectivity and more selective than W&C
I'd say, for post-clerkship hiring, the selectivity is roughly Susman/Kellogg > W&C > Molo. Wilkinson is a wild card right now because it's undergoing change and it may not be hiring as much. A lot of W&C summers also return after their clerkships so there aren't as many spots for clerks who didn't summer there. By contrast, Molo relies on clerk hiring, and doesn't require as tip top credentials as Susman/Kellogg.
It's hard to slice and dice at this level--these are basically the hardest firms to get a job at, period. The fact that Molo doesn't have a summer program at all, and its size, makes it hard to compare to Susman, W&C, and Kellogg, but I have seen several top tier candidates with incredible credentials strike out at both Molo and Susman, while I'm occasionally surprised to see folks get jobs at W&C and Kellogg. But fit plays a pretty large role, too, since as one poster pointed out above, these firms hand out a tiny number of offers.

In the end, no one should expect to walk in to a job at any of these firms.
Agreed that these are all extremely competitive and great firms. The original poster was asking how relatively competitive they were, though, for assessing their application chances.

So with the disclaimer that much comes down to luck, number of spots, and fit at these smaller firms, my understanding is that Molo and Wilkinson are a tad bit less competitive than Susman/Kellogg. Not sure how great a gauge this is, but the latter were more "desirable" at my HYS. Credentials of recent associate hires from your law school at these firms might give you some sense of competitiveness, too.

Anonymous User
Posts: 428102
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Mon Mar 01, 2021 10:10 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Mar 01, 2021 9:54 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Feb 26, 2021 5:02 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Feb 26, 2021 4:05 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Feb 25, 2021 11:08 pm
Susman, MoloLamken, Wilkinson are comparable to Kellogg in selectivity and more selective than W&C
I'd say, for post-clerkship hiring, the selectivity is roughly Susman/Kellogg > W&C > Molo. Wilkinson is a wild card right now because it's undergoing change and it may not be hiring as much. A lot of W&C summers also return after their clerkships so there aren't as many spots for clerks who didn't summer there. By contrast, Molo relies on clerk hiring, and doesn't require as tip top credentials as Susman/Kellogg.
It's hard to slice and dice at this level--these are basically the hardest firms to get a job at, period. The fact that Molo doesn't have a summer program at all, and its size, makes it hard to compare to Susman, W&C, and Kellogg, but I have seen several top tier candidates with incredible credentials strike out at both Molo and Susman, while I'm occasionally surprised to see folks get jobs at W&C and Kellogg. But fit plays a pretty large role, too, since as one poster pointed out above, these firms hand out a tiny number of offers.

In the end, no one should expect to walk in to a job at any of these firms.
Agreed that these are all extremely competitive and great firms. The original poster was asking how relatively competitive they were, though, for assessing their application chances.

So with the disclaimer that much comes down to luck, number of spots, and fit at these smaller firms, my understanding is that Molo and Wilkinson are a tad bit less competitive than Susman/Kellogg. Not sure how great a gauge this is, but the latter were more "desirable" at my HYS. Credentials of recent associate hires from your law school at these firms might give you some sense of competitiveness, too.
Probably true on the whole. My anecdotal evidence is that I got offers from Susman and Kellogg and not Molo, so I think just goes to show that credentials are necessary but not sufficient and comes down to luck a lot of the time.

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Mon Mar 01, 2021 11:48 pm

As a poster above rightly observed, I don't want to hear any more circlejerking about a handful of firms that hire a handful of people.

I'm losing my damn mind right now at the prospect of being unemployed following my clerkship.

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Tue Mar 02, 2021 12:25 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Mar 01, 2021 11:48 pm
As a poster above rightly observed, I don't want to hear any more circlejerking about a handful of firms that hire a handful of people.

I'm losing my damn mind right now at the prospect of being unemployed following my clerkship.
Worried as well. What's your situation? Can't tell if it's a stats/school issue, interviewing issue, or market issue.

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Anonymous User
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Tue Mar 02, 2021 12:32 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Tue Mar 02, 2021 12:25 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Mar 01, 2021 11:48 pm
As a poster above rightly observed, I don't want to hear any more circlejerking about a handful of firms that hire a handful of people.

I'm losing my damn mind right now at the prospect of being unemployed following my clerkship.
Worried as well. What's your situation? Can't tell if it's a stats/school issue, interviewing issue, or market issue.
different anon. Top third of my class, t-20, district court clerkship, and EIC of secondary journal. Applying to NY and a secondary market. Mostly silence and a few rejections.

Anonymous User
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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Tue Mar 02, 2021 11:48 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Tue Mar 02, 2021 12:32 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Tue Mar 02, 2021 12:25 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Mar 01, 2021 11:48 pm
As a poster above rightly observed, I don't want to hear any more circlejerking about a handful of firms that hire a handful of people.

I'm losing my damn mind right now at the prospect of being unemployed following my clerkship.
Worried as well. What's your situation? Can't tell if it's a stats/school issue, interviewing issue, or market issue.
different anon. Top third of my class, t-20, district court clerkship, and EIC of secondary journal. Applying to NY and a secondary market. Mostly silence and a few rejections.
I have no idea if this is true, and it may be a little bleak, but in the interest of transparency, it may be a school issue, or a double-clerk thing; anecdotally I'm also top third-ish of my class and was not on law review, but am t-6, with two clerkships. I've gotten some rejections on the papers, mostly from biglaw in a secondary market I'm interested in, but have had relative success with NY/DC boutiques (a fair number of interviews and a handful of offers). Folks I know with similar credentials (2 clerkships, decent but not incredible grades from t-10 ish schools, etc.) have also gotten at least a few bites. I have, however, also not heard from probably around 5-10 places I've applied to, which I know is also the case for my similarly-situated friends.

Of course, this could just be my experience and may vary wildly for others.

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Tue Mar 02, 2021 2:13 pm

My guess is also school/grades; top third at a T20 isn't a lock for BL and a non-brand-name district court won't do much to fix that. Post-clerkship hiring is most safely used to trade up (hence the boutique discussions), not to break into BL when you didn't 2L summer.

For more helpful advice, remember to also apply to regional or even small firms in secondary markets if you haven't, even in the more BL-heavy ones like Miami and Charlotte most of the high-end market is not in BL firms.

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by clerk2020 » Tue Mar 02, 2021 5:20 pm

Has anyone heard of offers going out for Kaplan Hecker? Feel free to PM.

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by legalnovice » Tue Mar 02, 2021 6:32 pm

Asking for a friend -- has there been any movement with WTO?

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Mar 03, 2021 5:41 pm

Has anyone applied to and/or heard Orrick's Supreme Court and Litigation Practice. It seems super competitive, but it appears that they're hiring across most offices for positions in the practice group.

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Mar 03, 2021 8:35 pm

Has anyone made any progress with Chicago biglaw? I am hearing absolutely nothing. I would have expected at least a few bites (T6, good grades, unremarkable d.ct. clerkship), but... nothing.

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:36 am

Has anyone made any progress with Chicago biglaw? I am hearing absolutely nothing. I would have expected at least a few bites (T6, good grades, unremarkable d.ct. clerkship), but... nothing.
Nothing here either. Sidley says they're hiring clerks, but silence from them so far. I heard from someone ITK that Mayer Brown has stalled lateral associate hiring because of anticipated pandemic hangover. (They also reneged on offers extended to incoming clerks last year, so didn't expect much love there.) Got early rejections from some boutiques (i.e., Eimer Stahl) and dissembling from others.

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:08 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:36 am
Has anyone made any progress with Chicago biglaw? I am hearing absolutely nothing. I would have expected at least a few bites (T6, good grades, unremarkable d.ct. clerkship), but... nothing.
Nothing here either. Sidley says they're hiring clerks, but silence from them so far. I heard from someone ITK that Mayer Brown has stalled lateral associate hiring because of anticipated pandemic hangover. (They also reneged on offers extended to incoming clerks last year, so didn't expect much love there.) Got early rejections from some boutiques (i.e., Eimer Stahl) and dissembling from others.
Sidley only started answering inquiries/finished OCI about three weeks ago. Kirkland was not hiring clerks last year; they have advertised for a lateral litigation position this year, but who knows what that means. As noted earlier in the thread, I wouldn't bank on Mayer hiring at all given what they did last year. Jenner Chicago did not hire clerks last year; I heard it was because they had an unusually high return rate post-summer (as in, fewer folks *left* for clerkships so fewer slots to fill), but again, I wouldn't bet on them. I have no specific post-clerk information about Jones Day, though I know they too had OCI extend well into February and were backed up as a result.

Maybe it's just a hangover from last year, maybe post-clerkship hiring is never as rosy as schools make it out to be, but I agree that at least in Chicago, it's bleak right now. Fingers crossed for more action in a month or so.

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:46 pm

Does anyone know if "elite" boutiques in NY/DC typically pay for things like relocation after a clerkship?

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Fri Mar 05, 2021 3:19 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:46 pm
Does anyone know if "elite" boutiques in NY/DC typically pay for things like relocation after a clerkship?
I would be shocked if they didn't pay reasonable moving costs.

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Tue Mar 09, 2021 1:29 pm

Can confirm big law offer in NYC for fall 2021.

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Tue Mar 09, 2021 3:18 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Tue Mar 09, 2021 1:29 pm
Can confirm big law offer in NYC for fall 2021.
Fried Frank? lol.

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Tue Mar 09, 2021 7:08 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Tue Mar 09, 2021 3:18 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Tue Mar 09, 2021 1:29 pm
Can confirm big law offer in NYC for fall 2021.
Fried Frank? lol.
Not Fried Frank but it is within V15

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Mar 10, 2021 12:58 am

How's the LA market looking? I graduated from HYS and will be coming off of a SDNY and a 2nd Circuit clerkship, and I'm just wondering if I'll need to start networking early or if my application cycle (fall 2022) should be relatively smooth.

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Re: Fall 2021 Post-Clerkship Hiring

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:49 pm

Losing my mind as a COA clerk who can't find anything....feel like I am going to miss out and when the fall comes and I don't have anything, I will just be an umemployed applicant rather than an active COA clerk. Does the marketability of the COA clerkship lose its luster if you're not currently in it?

Seriously? What are you waiting for?

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