Let's Talk 10th Circuit! Forum
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Anonymous Posting
Anonymous posting is only appropriate when you are sharing sensitive information about clerkship applications and clerkship hiring. You may anonymously respond on topic to these threads. Unacceptable uses include: harassing another user, joking around, testing the feature, or other things that are more appropriate in the lounge.
Failure to follow these rules will get you outed, warned, or banned."
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
I saw Carson just posted on OSCAR. An earlier commenter on a different thread mentioned he refuses to hire from T14 law schools. Is this true?
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
Not categorically.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Sep 12, 2022 4:33 pmI saw Carson just posted on OSCAR. An earlier commenter on a different thread mentioned he refuses to hire from T14 law schools. Is this true?
I don’t know him that well, but he’s a cowboy type who has chambers in Roswell. He’s probably looking for clerks with whom he would get along with.
Definitely worth applying to regardless.
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
I only know that he will hire and interview people from schools outside (and sometimes very far outside) the T14. No idea if that means he doesn’t consider T14 students at all.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Sep 12, 2022 4:33 pmI saw Carson just posted on OSCAR. An earlier commenter on a different thread mentioned he refuses to hire from T14 law schools. Is this true?
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
The three Carson clerks identifiable from a quick Google search for his name went to Baylor, Arizona, and New Mexico. That would seem to suggest he likes ties to the Southwest.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Sep 14, 2022 9:29 pmI only know that he will hire and interview people from schools outside (and sometimes very far outside) the T14. No idea if that means he doesn’t consider T14 students at all.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Sep 12, 2022 4:33 pmI saw Carson just posted on OSCAR. An earlier commenter on a different thread mentioned he refuses to hire from T14 law schools. Is this true?
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
I can confirm that it definitely helps.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue Sep 20, 2022 3:33 pmThe three Carson clerks identifiable from a quick Google search for his name went to Baylor, Arizona, and New Mexico. That would seem to suggest he likes ties to the Southwest.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Sep 14, 2022 9:29 pmI only know that he will hire and interview people from schools outside (and sometimes very far outside) the T14. No idea if that means he doesn’t consider T14 students at all.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Sep 12, 2022 4:33 pmI saw Carson just posted on OSCAR. An earlier commenter on a different thread mentioned he refuses to hire from T14 law schools. Is this true?
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
What would you say counts as a tie to the Southwest? To me, Southwest means Arizona and New Mexico, but maybe Texas counts too I guess?Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Sep 21, 2022 7:54 pmI can confirm that it definitely helps.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue Sep 20, 2022 3:33 pmThe three Carson clerks identifiable from a quick Google search for his name went to Baylor, Arizona, and New Mexico. That would seem to suggest he likes ties to the Southwest.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Sep 14, 2022 9:29 pmI only know that he will hire and interview people from schools outside (and sometimes very far outside) the T14. No idea if that means he doesn’t consider T14 students at all.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Sep 12, 2022 4:33 pmI saw Carson just posted on OSCAR. An earlier commenter on a different thread mentioned he refuses to hire from T14 law schools. Is this true?
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
He had at least one clerk who went to University of Texas last year.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Sep 21, 2022 8:43 pmWhat would you say counts as a tie to the Southwest? To me, Southwest means Arizona and New Mexico, but maybe Texas counts too I guess?Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Sep 21, 2022 7:54 pmI can confirm that it definitely helps.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue Sep 20, 2022 3:33 pmThe three Carson clerks identifiable from a quick Google search for his name went to Baylor, Arizona, and New Mexico. That would seem to suggest he likes ties to the Southwest.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Sep 14, 2022 9:29 pmI only know that he will hire and interview people from schools outside (and sometimes very far outside) the T14. No idea if that means he doesn’t consider T14 students at all.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Sep 12, 2022 4:33 pmI saw Carson just posted on OSCAR. An earlier commenter on a different thread mentioned he refuses to hire from T14 law schools. Is this true?
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
He’s had more than one. Considering Roswell is just west Texas, being from Texas seems like a plus.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Thu Sep 22, 2022 3:16 pmHe had at least one clerk who went to University of Texas last year.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Sep 21, 2022 8:43 pmWhat would you say counts as a tie to the Southwest? To me, Southwest means Arizona and New Mexico, but maybe Texas counts too I guess?Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Sep 21, 2022 7:54 pmI can confirm that it definitely helps.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue Sep 20, 2022 3:33 pmThe three Carson clerks identifiable from a quick Google search for his name went to Baylor, Arizona, and New Mexico. That would seem to suggest he likes ties to the Southwest.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Sep 14, 2022 9:29 pmI only know that he will hire and interview people from schools outside (and sometimes very far outside) the T14. No idea if that means he doesn’t consider T14 students at all.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Sep 12, 2022 4:33 pmI saw Carson just posted on OSCAR. An earlier commenter on a different thread mentioned he refuses to hire from T14 law schools. Is this true?
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
Does anyone know how quickly Carson tends to extend interview invitations?
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
An extremely long time.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Thu Sep 22, 2022 7:55 pmDoes anyone know how quickly Carson tends to extend interview invitations?
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
To clarify Holmes is not remotely worth it right?
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
Not. At. All.
Stay far, far away.
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
I saw the new posting said minimum 60-hour work weeks. If you have personal experience, can you say whether issues would be more to do with work hours or chambers demeanor?
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
Let me put it this way: there are plenty of happy clerks working 60-hour work weeks even though that is far from the norm in clerking. 60 hours with a boss who respects you and cares about your career is something most clerkship applicants will sign up for. Holmes is not that.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Oct 12, 2022 12:23 pmI saw the new posting said minimum 60-hour work weeks. If you have personal experience, can you say whether issues would be more to do with work hours or chambers demeanor?
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
The culture was bad in the chambers of Jerome Holmes.
You work alone in your office 12+ hours a day in business attire. You work on Saturday and some Sundays. He sort of nods at you in the mornings (I think to monitor who is there when he is). He then works with his door closed until 9-11pm, often eating alone in his office. He hardly ever announces when he is leaving; I suspect to keep people working.
When I clerked, we'd have these forced in-chambers lunches like every two months. He would often talk about himself. That was about it as far as "mentorship." If you had a personal emergency or a big interview, he never asked about it. I doubt he knows where his clerks work or even live.
Sittings were highly informative. Other Judges and clerks would make comments expressing condolences for our experience with him. It has been said, but he travels alone, eats alone, and works alone. He has no kids and takes no vacations. For others, he is a manic worker and profoundly socially awkward.
You can see a real bad side of him as a clerk though. During my year, some of his "all clerk" emails were downright mean, almost designed to make you feel bad. As the year went on, co-clerks shared some of the things he sent individually. It was clear by the end that he's not a good person.
You work alone in your office 12+ hours a day in business attire. You work on Saturday and some Sundays. He sort of nods at you in the mornings (I think to monitor who is there when he is). He then works with his door closed until 9-11pm, often eating alone in his office. He hardly ever announces when he is leaving; I suspect to keep people working.
When I clerked, we'd have these forced in-chambers lunches like every two months. He would often talk about himself. That was about it as far as "mentorship." If you had a personal emergency or a big interview, he never asked about it. I doubt he knows where his clerks work or even live.
Sittings were highly informative. Other Judges and clerks would make comments expressing condolences for our experience with him. It has been said, but he travels alone, eats alone, and works alone. He has no kids and takes no vacations. For others, he is a manic worker and profoundly socially awkward.
You can see a real bad side of him as a clerk though. During my year, some of his "all clerk" emails were downright mean, almost designed to make you feel bad. As the year went on, co-clerks shared some of the things he sent individually. It was clear by the end that he's not a good person.
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
Peep the last three paragraphs of this recent article, too. https://www.coloradopolitics.com/news/c ... 5c2d6.htmlAnonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Oct 12, 2022 3:25 pmThe culture was bad in the chambers of Jerome Holmes.
You work alone in your office 12+ hours a day in business attire. You work on Saturday and some Sundays. He sort of nods at you in the mornings (I think to monitor who is there when he is). He then works with his door closed until 9-11pm, often eating alone in his office. He hardly ever announces when he is leaving; I suspect to keep people working.
When I clerked, we'd have these forced in-chambers lunches like every two months. He would often talk about himself. That was about it as far as "mentorship." If you had a personal emergency or a big interview, he never asked about it. I doubt he knows where his clerks work or even live.
Sittings were highly informative. Other Judges and clerks would make comments expressing condolences for our experience with him. It has been said, but he travels alone, eats alone, and works alone. He has no kids and takes no vacations. For others, he is a manic worker and profoundly socially awkward.
You can see a real bad side of him as a clerk though. During my year, some of his "all clerk" emails were downright mean, almost designed to make you feel bad. As the year went on, co-clerks shared some of the things he sent individually. It was clear by the end that he's not a good person.
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
Former CA10 clerk with several friends who (unfortunately) clerked for Holmes here. In addition to the other reasons noted by prior posters--all of which are consistent with what I've heard--the professional experience sounds borderline worthless. He takes forever to write opinions, and the backlog is so bad that clerks almost never actually work on opinions dealing with the cases from that clerk's term. Everything goes through dozens of cycles of review, so you're almost always editing someone else's work on an opinion that (maybe) resolves a case from two terms prior. In most cases, "editing" involves cite-checking or other menial tasks; after all, those three-page string citations for the standard of review under Rule 56 don't just "write" themselves!
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
For those speaking up about their experiences with Holmes I just want ya'll to know that I really deeply appreciate it and it saved me from even the chance of a terrible year. I know often there is a culture of not being vocal with negative experiences in clerkships so I just wanted to personally thank everyone for this highly useful information.
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
Echoing this comment: thank you all for sharing the detailed info -- it's hugely helpful.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Oct 12, 2022 7:07 pmFor those speaking up about their experiences with Holmes I just want ya'll to know that I really deeply appreciate it and it saved me from even the chance of a terrible year. I know often there is a culture of not being vocal with negative experiences in clerkships so I just wanted to personally thank everyone for this highly useful information.
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
Anybody know if Judge Shelby in Utah has hired?
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
School shows that he's been interviewing but nothing about hiring
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
Phillips posted, anyone have any insights on him as in how he is to work for?
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
I'm friends with someone who clerked for Phillips. Really nice and supportive of his clerks. And great hours from what I remember.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Feb 01, 2023 9:54 amPhillips posted, anyone have any insights on him as in how he is to work for?
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
Can someone who clerked on the Tenth give thoughts on each of the judges (active & senior) generally? Thank you!
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Re: Let's Talk 10th Circuit!
Lot's of great info on Holmes, which is much appreciated. I have also seen negative things about Hartz on this board, but not as detailed. Does anyone have personal or secondhand experience they would be willing to share?
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