Type 1 Diabetes and exams Forum

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HonestAdvice

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by HonestAdvice » Mon May 16, 2016 12:33 pm

El Pollito wrote:
Chrstgtr wrote:If you haven't already, contact an attorney. This is pretty standard ADA/Section 504 stuff and the school should have had accommodations in place for you
How can anyone say this without seeing OP's application for accommodations? lol
TBF, hypoglycemia and testing accommodations is extremely vanilla in the case of Juvenile Diabetics.

The reason is that as you know, your emotions can impact how your body functions. When you're really nervous, your heart might race, you might sweat, you might suddenly get really hungry, etc. Your body doesn't know why you're stressed, and assumes it's related to being under life threatening attack, no food supply or anything else your ancestors would've been afraid of 100k years ago.

The thing is that your pancreas is functioning, and even in a Type 2 Diabetic, the pancreas is either producing no/not enough insulin but is still working with other organs to ensure your blood sugar doesn't drop too low. So when you're in a stressful situation your blood sugar level probably drops, but it's never going to drop below 80. Your blood sugar, no matter the situation, how fat, skinny, tired, awake you are will always be between 80 and 120. A Juvenile Diabetic's blood sugar could literally go from 0-1000 in a few hours on any given day. Your mood and cognitive functioning will change drastically based on a fluctuation from 85 to 105. Imagine if you went from 800 to 40 on a given day.

A type-1 Diabetic's pancreas is virtually dead. It will not communicate anything, and the Type 1's Diabetic blood sugar will drop and drop and drop to the single digits, and the person will die. The obvious response here is to therefore run the Type 1 Diabetic high before a stressful event in anticipation of a blood sugar drop. This makes sense but for the fact that how the body reacts to emotional stress is unpredictable. If you run or play a sport then the blood sugar drops are predictable, but with exam stress and those sorts of situations, the blood sugar could also go very high. Even when Diabetics sleep it's impossible to predict blood sugar levels within a 40 point range, because even dreams can fuck up the blood sugar levels.

In addition, running high at a level of roughly 200 has an impact on cognition - children get more "silly," and adults show drastic alterations in IQ tests. Even if a Juvenile Diabetic could plan to run high as a safety net to stress induced hypoglycemia, which most can't, it is unfair to basically tell a student they need to do damage on their kidneys and perform worse on a test, because they're a Juvenile Diabetic.

This is why it is covered by the ADA, which not every similar condition is. Its impact is greatest in testing situations, and if you look at the case law and 504 plans, they almost always deal with testing for this very reason. When people say speak with an attorney, it's not because being Type-1 and not having class accommodations in and of itself is the basis of a lawsuit. It's that it is one of those conditions where accommodations in this context are incredibly common. It's not like ADHD, because it only impacts individuals like this in highly stressful situations they will not encounter frequently in the real world, and it's clearly entirely traceable solely to this preexisting medical condition, and nothing in the brain or character of the person.

Most people aren't educated on this subject, and you see Type-1 Diabetes like how you see a fat person's Diabetes. These are completely different diseases. In Type-2 the pancreas is overworked so struggles to produce insulin. In a Type-1, the person is born with a gene that causes their pancreas to completely die, normally before the individual reaches grade school and something like Chicken Pox is more than enough to kill the pancreas forever, which not only makes it unable to produce insulin, but also unable to communicate with any other part of the body at all, recognize blood sugar levels or stop the blood sugar from dropping. Hypoglycemia is very rare in type-2, and while high blood sugar will destroy organs over time, one low blood sugar results in an absence of cognitive functioning for a number of hours, can result in immediate brain damage and is the main cause of death in Juvenile Diabetics - one bad low, and you can die. Prior to the 20th century, if you were a 5 year old and diagnosed, which is the norm for Juvenile Diabetics, the life expectancy was a few months. Today, the normal life OP has is predicated on their pricking their finger, and eating sugar tablets. It's not exactly a fail proof plan here, and when things happen for which there is no cure and which OP hasn't brought on themselves, it's not unreasonable to say, if I'm temporarily unconscious/semi-conscious due to a constant life threatening disease, I should not have to lose that testing time.

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El Pollito

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by El Pollito » Mon May 16, 2016 12:35 pm

I've been dating a T1 diabetic for 5 years, but thanks for that!

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Desert Fox

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by Desert Fox » Mon May 16, 2016 12:58 pm

El Pollito wrote:I've been dating a T1 diabetic for 5 years, but thanks for that!
Do you have accommodations in your home? A med team on standby?
Last edited by Desert Fox on Sat Jan 27, 2018 2:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

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El Pollito

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by El Pollito » Mon May 16, 2016 3:21 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
El Pollito wrote:I've been dating a T1 diabetic for 5 years, but thanks for that!
Do you have accommodations in your home? A med team on standby?
In addition to being a sugar momma, I am a one-woman med team. I'm always there to be like "hey you seem a little out of it, have you tested lately?"

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Desert Fox

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by Desert Fox » Mon May 16, 2016 3:23 pm

El Pollito wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:
El Pollito wrote:I've been dating a T1 diabetic for 5 years, but thanks for that!
Do you have accommodations in your home? A med team on standby?
In addition to being a sugar momma, I am a one-woman med team. I'm always there to be like "hey you seem a little out of it, have you tested lately?"
(DF on the phone to assketchup) "You got a nice lil ADA claim going buddy, GET A LAWYER"

(SBL feels sharp pain in brain for seemingly no reason)
Last edited by Desert Fox on Sat Jan 27, 2018 2:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Person1111

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by Person1111 » Mon May 16, 2016 7:01 pm

To be fair, I think pretty much every school would give you a mulligan if you got a lawyer, had him/her draft a complaint, and sent it along with a strongly worded letter. You may or may not win if the case went to trial/summary judgment (we don't know enough about what you communicated to the dean), but you would almost certainly survive an MTD and make things really expensive for them. Query, however, whether it would be worth the expense and likely blowback from your school/peers/potential employers.

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by DragonWell » Mon May 16, 2016 8:11 pm

Mr. Archer wrote:
HonestAdvice wrote: Obviously I'm mad at what happened to you, but if your version of the facts is accurate this is tantamount to the professor making an announcement that all black students will be downgraded a letter grade for being black. That's essentially what they did to you - harmed your future because of a failure to provide the accommodations needed legally and practically for you to be like other students.
Your "HonestAdvice" is horrible. This is not even close to the same situation. If you're still in law school, please learn how to analogize situations before you graduate. It's a pretty important skill for being a lawyer.

Also, everyone should slow down on the "call a lawyer/this was discrimination" talk. It sounds like OP asked for an accommodation, and the school considered it but decided it wasn't needed. It doesn't sound like the school just made a blanket rule that anyone can get accommodations but diabetics. Saying this is obviously discriminatory is not helpful because OP didn't provide a lot of facts. OP should talk to the universities accommodation office first and see if they can offer any advice.

Maybe OP can clarify if he/she talked to the exam proctor about the issue when it was happening? If not, then the school really can't be expected to do anything. OP notifying them after the fact puts the school in an awkward situation: OP could be telling the truth or, since OP said the diabetes was controlled and apparently didn't have problems first semester or at any other point second semester, OP could be trying to game the system after not doing well on an exam. That's a harsh way to look at things, but its necessary.

Also, OP did you have any testing accommodations in college?
OP has provided enough information by given a diagnosis "Type I diabetes". OP is not a medical professional, so when he says type I diabetes is under control, he maybe mean it is controlled under regular conditions. it shouldn't be taken as a proof for "he will be fine under all situations, --sitting quietly, or under stress." Or, as "his body will regulate blood sugar level 100% normally, just like a person with functional pancreas, who can tolerate a wide range of fluctuation of sugar intake, and help release sugar from storage to battle stress, like in a fight-or-flight situation". An exam is such a stressful situation. The occurrence is not always predictable. However, even if in only one out of ten exams you have this, it is a big enough impact on your overall performance. Even if he did not have it in college when he was younger, he might need it when he is a few year older. Human body changes. The disease itself also changes. It's a dynamic.

The dean should've consulted medical professional if she doesn't have working knowledge for the disease, instead of judging by imagination, since the dean is charged with the responsibility to make important decisions like providing an accommodation. A student can exaggerate or underreport his own conditions, intentionally or merely because they are not trained to describe it professionally--you don't need to be an MD to be a patient. And therefore the dean, as a functional adult, earning a paycheck, should know what her/his decision should be based on. Unfortunately, I don't think the person make a phone call to understand what the disease really is. During an exam, human body is under unusual stress. Hormones in response to stress could be secreted in large amounts. Those hormones would change sugar levels. OP maybe just ask for accommodation out caution and that caution is totally warranted.

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lacrossebrother

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by lacrossebrother » Mon May 16, 2016 8:52 pm

Dear Dean of Students,
I had a diabetic incident during the most recent exam. I met with student services earlier this semester but they explained there's nothing they could do. I was hoping I could get through exams despite this, given that I didn't seem to have a choice. However, having had this attack during the exam it seems that I will either need to drop out if I can't get in touch with the right people to help me. All I need is the ability to bring my glucometer into the exam with me along with some saltines and apple juice.

Do you have time this week to talk?

Regards,
TLSER

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Mr. Archer

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by Mr. Archer » Mon May 16, 2016 10:24 pm

DragonWell wrote:
Mr. Archer wrote:
HonestAdvice wrote:

OP has provided enough information by given a diagnosis "Type I diabetes". . . The dean should've consulted medical professional if she doesn't have working knowledge for the disease, instead of judging by imagination, since the dean is charged with the responsibility to make important decisions like providing an accommodation. A student can exaggerate or underreport his own conditions, intentionally or merely because they are not trained to describe it professionally--you don't need to be an MD to be a patient. And therefore the dean, as a functional adult, earning a paycheck, should know what her/his decision should be based on. Unfortunately, I don't think the person make a phone call to understand what the disease really is. During an exam, human body is under unusual stress. Hormones in response to stress could be secreted in large amounts. Those hormones would change sugar levels. OP maybe just ask for accommodation out caution and that caution is totally warranted.
OP does have a disability and the school could easily give an accommodation. However, we don't know enough information to know the school did anything wrong.

Another post provided a link http://www.pacer.org/publications/adaqa/504.asp about ADA accommodations. The poster provided this as evidence that OP has an open and shut case of discrimination. But this information puts the responsibility of providing documentation related to disabilities on the student:

"Q. What kind of documentation might be necessary?
A. Documentation should be completed and signed by a professional familiar with the applicant and the applicant's disability such as a physician, psychologist or rehabilitation counselor. It should verify the disability and suggest appropriate accommodations. If previous documentation exists, it will likely be sufficient unless it is not current (usually no more than three years old). If no current documentation is available, it is the responsibility of the student to have new documentation prepared. This can mean paying to have an appropriate professional conduct a new evaluation. It would be prudent to get an evaluation the year before you leave high school. This information is confidential and not a part of the student's permanent record."

The disability accommodations website for my former university also requires the student to provide current documentation in order to show a need for accommodations. I'm just going to assume if that were illegal, it wouldn't be a requirement. If someone can show me where OP saying OP has diabetes triggers some responsibility by the school to prove OP needs accommodations, I would like to see it. Seriously, I would like to know if the ADA requires that of academic institutions.

Also, what you think happened when OP spoke to the dean doesn't matter if it's not true. We don't have many facts. Filling-in facts in a way that obviously supports your argument makes things easy for you, but it doesn't make you right.

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Chrstgtr

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by Chrstgtr » Mon May 16, 2016 10:44 pm

Mr. Archer wrote:
DragonWell wrote:
Mr. Archer wrote:
HonestAdvice wrote:

OP has provided enough information by given a diagnosis "Type I diabetes". . . The dean should've consulted medical professional if she doesn't have working knowledge for the disease, instead of judging by imagination, since the dean is charged with the responsibility to make important decisions like providing an accommodation. A student can exaggerate or underreport his own conditions, intentionally or merely because they are not trained to describe it professionally--you don't need to be an MD to be a patient. And therefore the dean, as a functional adult, earning a paycheck, should know what her/his decision should be based on. Unfortunately, I don't think the person make a phone call to understand what the disease really is. During an exam, human body is under unusual stress. Hormones in response to stress could be secreted in large amounts. Those hormones would change sugar levels. OP maybe just ask for accommodation out caution and that caution is totally warranted.
OP does have a disability and the school could easily give an accommodation. However, we don't know enough information to the school did anything wrong.

Another post provided a link http://www.pacer.org/publications/adaqa/504.asp about ADA accommodations. The poster provided this as evidence that OP has an open and shut case of discrimination. But this information puts the responsibility of providing documentation related to disabilities on the student:

"Q. What kind of documentation might be necessary?
A. Documentation should be completed and signed by a professional familiar with the applicant and the applicant's disability such as a physician, psychologist or rehabilitation counselor. It should verify the disability and suggest appropriate accommodations. If previous documentation exists, it will likely be sufficient unless it is not current (usually no more than three years old). If no current documentation is available, it is the responsibility of the student to have new documentation prepared. This can mean paying to have an appropriate professional conduct a new evaluation. It would be prudent to get an evaluation the year before you leave high school. This information is confidential and not a part of the student's permanent record."

The disability accommodations website for my former university also requires the student to provide current documentation in order to show a need for accommodations. I'm just going to assume if that was illegal, it wouldn't be there. If someone can show me where OP saying OP has diabetes triggers some responsibility by the school to prove OP needs accommodations, I would like to see it. Seriously, I would like to know if it requires that of academic institutions.

Also, what you think happened when OP spoke to the dean doesn't matter if it's not true. We don't have many facts. Filling-in facts in a way that obviously supports your argument makes things easy for you, but it doesn't make you right.
I provided the link and have read a few cases on this topic. If I remember correctly, the student just needs to put the school on notice. This notice requirement isn't statutorily prescribed but was read into courts in order to avoid placing liability on good faith actors who have no way of knowing that the student had a disability and that that disability requires accommodations. Everything else regarding documentation and proposed plans are all just school policies that go into the development of a plan to accommodate the disability. The physician input isn't taken as gospel because then everyone would get a doctor to say they're disabled. Really it is just an extended negotiation process

You're right that we don't know the full facts of the case. But I think it is fair to read into the OP's post to say that the OP's original conversation wasn't a casual conversation where OP mentioned that they had diabetes. It was a conversation about OP's disability and whether the OP needed accommodations. After being put on notice, the dean did not request verification or question whether the disability could have affected OP's academic performance. Instead the dean just said "if you've got it taken care of, then the school doesn't need to do anything," which is obviously wrong because if the OP did not have it figured out or if something like this happened, then the OP was in trouble and a plan should have been in place to accommodate the disability.

I think the most on point post here was that if OP hired an attorney, the school wouldn't want to deal with a sympathetic student with a legitimate legal claim that would make the school look bad, so the school would just give the OP what he or she wanted.

ETA: notice how the language is "might be required." Making a person show documentation isn't illegal, but it also isn't legally required and if the school never asked for it (and also took OP's claims as true), then the school was on notice

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lacrossebrother

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by lacrossebrother » Tue May 17, 2016 12:31 am

I'm 95% sure this thread is flame. But in the small chance it's not, people in this thread give terrible advice.
Please do not hire a fucking lawyer to take on your law school. You have taken exams your entire life and haven't ever gotten accommodations, and you didn't comply with your school's request procedures. If you hire a lawyer the school will crush you, not immediately back down.
Send my email. Hope for improved circumstances going forward.

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El Pollito

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by El Pollito » Tue May 17, 2016 1:22 am

Any lawyer who advises an aspiring lawyer to bring a lawsuit should stop practicing. Bunch of idiots.

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rcharter1978

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by rcharter1978 » Tue May 17, 2016 2:32 am

El Pollito wrote:I've been dating a T1 diabetic for 5 years, but thanks for that!
It must be funny dating a T1 diabetic. I have T1 diabetes and when my blood sugar gets super low I am incredibly irritable.

I remember once yelling at a lady at Red Lobster because she wouldn't get me the Cheddar Bay Biscuits with honey. I was SO MAD at her for that! My friend was scared for everyone. When I finally checked, my blood sugar like like 32.

So, if he ever gets mad at you, its not his fault.

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hdunlop

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by hdunlop » Tue May 17, 2016 5:20 am

This thread is the worst.

Sorry for the bad deal, op. That sucks.

HonestAdvice

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by HonestAdvice » Wed May 18, 2016 6:59 pm

El Pollito wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:
El Pollito wrote:I've been dating a T1 diabetic for 5 years, but thanks for that!
Do you have accommodations in your home? A med team on standby?
In addition to being a sugar momma, I am a one-woman med team. I'm always there to be like "hey you seem a little out of it, have you tested lately?"
that supports what i was saying, though. i wasn't saying you need an ambulance waiting outside for when op gets hypoglycemic. i was saying that the dean of student services is supposed to have it documented somewhere that op is hypoglycemic so that if op were to go unconscious during class, at least one person in the school would know the likely reason why and could get glucose into them... or at least whoever responds to a 911 call could know. if this happened on school property, particularly after op flat out told the dean, it's likely that 20 minute difference would cause serious brain damage and the school would be fucked. that's all i was saying.

in your relationship with a t1 diabetic, you're saying you frequently ask your partner whether they've tested lately on a day to day basis when s/he's generally fine. all i'm saying is the school is supposed to know if op were to go unconscious during a once in a lifetime low that op is hypoglycemic and may need glucose. i don't get how your relationship disproves my point that the school is lucky that op's low wasn't worse, because if it was they'd be fucked and it would be a SJ lawsuit and the board of trustees would be pissed by that dean's stupidity. he'd be gone the second op's suit was filed.

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rcharter1978

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by rcharter1978 » Wed May 18, 2016 8:36 pm

HonestAdvice wrote:
El Pollito wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:
El Pollito wrote:I've been dating a T1 diabetic for 5 years, but thanks for that!
Do you have accommodations in your home? A med team on standby?
In addition to being a sugar momma, I am a one-woman med team. I'm always there to be like "hey you seem a little out of it, have you tested lately?"
that supports what i was saying, though. i wasn't saying you need an ambulance waiting outside for when op gets hypoglycemic. i was saying that the dean of student services is supposed to have it documented somewhere that op is hypoglycemic so that if op were to go unconscious during class, at least one person in the school would know the likely reason why and could get glucose into them... or at least whoever responds to a 911 call could know. if this happened on school property, particularly after op flat out told the dean, it's likely that 20 minute difference would cause serious brain damage and the school would be fucked. that's all i was saying.

in your relationship with a t1 diabetic, you're saying you frequently ask your partner whether they've tested lately on a day to day basis when s/he's generally fine. all i'm saying is the school is supposed to know if op were to go unconscious during a once in a lifetime low that op is hypoglycemic and may need glucose. i don't get how your relationship disproves my point that the school is lucky that op's low wasn't worse, because if it was they'd be fucked and it would be a SJ lawsuit and the board of trustees would be pissed by that dean's stupidity. he'd be gone the second op's suit was filed.
In theory, you definitely have a point. I'm not sure if you have T1 diabetes, I do....and I know when my blood sugar is low enough to be an issue. There are certainly people who have hypoglycemic unawareness....but if OP had such a thing I would think he would know and would have specifically mentioned it to the dean of students. Its only to say that while its certainly possible for a T1 diabetic to have a blood sugar in the teens, most would know that they were running a low blood sugar beforehand. And if they know that they are having a hypoglycemic episode, they should take care of it. And I think you generally have to go pretty low to go into coma, or to faint/experience severe brain damage. I know that I've had blood sugars as low as 27-29 and I've still been able to check my blood sugar and treat my condition.

However, like you said, were the OP to have hypoglycemic unawareness and go so low that they fell out during an exam and no one knew what to do, after the dean of students was on notice....it would be ugly. But perhaps they figure its okay to take that risk, because the risk seems pretty remote.

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by HonestAdvice » Wed May 18, 2016 9:53 pm

rcharter1978 wrote:
HonestAdvice wrote:
El Pollito wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:
El Pollito wrote:I've been dating a T1 diabetic for 5 years, but thanks for that!
Do you have accommodations in your home? A med team on standby?
In addition to being a sugar momma, I am a one-woman med team. I'm always there to be like "hey you seem a little out of it, have you tested lately?"
that supports what i was saying, though. i wasn't saying you need an ambulance waiting outside for when op gets hypoglycemic. i was saying that the dean of student services is supposed to have it documented somewhere that op is hypoglycemic so that if op were to go unconscious during class, at least one person in the school would know the likely reason why and could get glucose into them... or at least whoever responds to a 911 call could know. if this happened on school property, particularly after op flat out told the dean, it's likely that 20 minute difference would cause serious brain damage and the school would be fucked. that's all i was saying.

in your relationship with a t1 diabetic, you're saying you frequently ask your partner whether they've tested lately on a day to day basis when s/he's generally fine. all i'm saying is the school is supposed to know if op were to go unconscious during a once in a lifetime low that op is hypoglycemic and may need glucose. i don't get how your relationship disproves my point that the school is lucky that op's low wasn't worse, because if it was they'd be fucked and it would be a SJ lawsuit and the board of trustees would be pissed by that dean's stupidity. he'd be gone the second op's suit was filed.
In theory, you definitely have a point. I'm not sure if you have T1 diabetes, I do....and I know when my blood sugar is low enough to be an issue. There are certainly people who have hypoglycemic unawareness....but if OP had such a thing I would think he would know and would have specifically mentioned it to the dean of students. Its only to say that while its certainly possible for a T1 diabetic to have a blood sugar in the teens, most would know that they were running a low blood sugar beforehand. And if they know that they are having a hypoglycemic episode, they should take care of it. And I think you generally have to go pretty low to go into coma, or to faint/experience severe brain damage. I know that I've had blood sugars as low as 27-29 and I've still been able to check my blood sugar and treat my condition.

However, like you said, were the OP to have hypoglycemic unawareness and go so low that they fell out during an exam and no one knew what to do, after the dean of students was on notice....it would be ugly. But perhaps they figure its okay to take that risk, because the risk seems pretty remote.
one of my siblings was first diagnosed after drifting into a coma when they were only about 2. granted, they had lost about 10 pounds, which for babies is pretty intense, but the doctors were dumb and never thought to check. that first shock made us all very attentive to it thereafter, and i think there's probably severity levels even though a non-functioning pancreas is a non-functioning pancreas. i've noticed that those diagnosed when they're very young fluctuate much more than those diagnosed when they're older. with somebody like adam morrison or jay cutler, you never really even hear they're being diabetic mentioned where as with other people it's more of an around the clock concern. obviously morrison and cutler are athletic so have better functioning metabolisms, but they're being diagnosed later on might have a relationship to that.

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Desert Fox

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by Desert Fox » Wed May 18, 2016 10:07 pm

Do law schools have nurses or someone responsible for knowing someone's medical information. I don't remember that. If they'd really be liable for someone passing out from the beetus, they'd probably make you wear a medical bracelet.
Last edited by Desert Fox on Sat Jan 27, 2018 2:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

Chrstgtr

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by Chrstgtr » Wed May 18, 2016 10:15 pm

Desert Fox wrote:Do law schools have nurses or someone responsible for knowing someone's medical information. I don't remember that. If they'd really be liable for someone passing out from the beetus, they'd probably make you wear a medical bracelet.
Or you could just have a system that allows the person to retake a portion of their exam in the event that they have an incident. We're not talking about a crazy plan here.

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by hdunlop » Wed May 18, 2016 11:09 pm

tho a good idea to wear a medical ID bracelet generally

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El Pollito

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by El Pollito » Wed May 18, 2016 11:25 pm

HonestAdvice wrote:
El Pollito wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:
El Pollito wrote:I've been dating a T1 diabetic for 5 years, but thanks for that!
Do you have accommodations in your home? A med team on standby?
In addition to being a sugar momma, I am a one-woman med team. I'm always there to be like "hey you seem a little out of it, have you tested lately?"
that supports what i was saying, though. i wasn't saying you need an ambulance waiting outside for when op gets hypoglycemic. i was saying that the dean of student services is supposed to have it documented somewhere that op is hypoglycemic so that if op were to go unconscious during class, at least one person in the school would know the likely reason why and could get glucose into them... or at least whoever responds to a 911 call could know. if this happened on school property, particularly after op flat out told the dean, it's likely that 20 minute difference would cause serious brain damage and the school would be fucked. that's all i was saying.

in your relationship with a t1 diabetic, you're saying you frequently ask your partner whether they've tested lately on a day to day basis when s/he's generally fine. all i'm saying is the school is supposed to know if op were to go unconscious during a once in a lifetime low that op is hypoglycemic and may need glucose. i don't get how your relationship disproves my point that the school is lucky that op's low wasn't worse, because if it was they'd be fucked and it would be a SJ lawsuit and the board of trustees would be pissed by that dean's stupidity. he'd be gone the second op's suit was filed.
It means I could have done without the long lecture on diabetes, since I know how it works and do a pretty good job of being supportive.

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rcharter1978

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by rcharter1978 » Thu May 19, 2016 12:06 am

HonestAdvice wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
HonestAdvice wrote:
El Pollito wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:
El Pollito wrote:I've been dating a T1 diabetic for 5 years, but thanks for that!
Do you have accommodations in your home? A med team on standby?
In addition to being a sugar momma, I am a one-woman med team. I'm always there to be like "hey you seem a little out of it, have you tested lately?"
that supports what i was saying, though. i wasn't saying you need an ambulance waiting outside for when op gets hypoglycemic. i was saying that the dean of student services is supposed to have it documented somewhere that op is hypoglycemic so that if op were to go unconscious during class, at least one person in the school would know the likely reason why and could get glucose into them... or at least whoever responds to a 911 call could know. if this happened on school property, particularly after op flat out told the dean, it's likely that 20 minute difference would cause serious brain damage and the school would be fucked. that's all i was saying.

in your relationship with a t1 diabetic, you're saying you frequently ask your partner whether they've tested lately on a day to day basis when s/he's generally fine. all i'm saying is the school is supposed to know if op were to go unconscious during a once in a lifetime low that op is hypoglycemic and may need glucose. i don't get how your relationship disproves my point that the school is lucky that op's low wasn't worse, because if it was they'd be fucked and it would be a SJ lawsuit and the board of trustees would be pissed by that dean's stupidity. he'd be gone the second op's suit was filed.
In theory, you definitely have a point. I'm not sure if you have T1 diabetes, I do....and I know when my blood sugar is low enough to be an issue. There are certainly people who have hypoglycemic unawareness....but if OP had such a thing I would think he would know and would have specifically mentioned it to the dean of students. Its only to say that while its certainly possible for a T1 diabetic to have a blood sugar in the teens, most would know that they were running a low blood sugar beforehand. And if they know that they are having a hypoglycemic episode, they should take care of it. And I think you generally have to go pretty low to go into coma, or to faint/experience severe brain damage. I know that I've had blood sugars as low as 27-29 and I've still been able to check my blood sugar and treat my condition.

However, like you said, were the OP to have hypoglycemic unawareness and go so low that they fell out during an exam and no one knew what to do, after the dean of students was on notice....it would be ugly. But perhaps they figure its okay to take that risk, because the risk seems pretty remote.
one of my siblings was first diagnosed after drifting into a coma when they were only about 2. granted, they had lost about 10 pounds, which for babies is pretty intense, but the doctors were dumb and never thought to check. that first shock made us all very attentive to it thereafter, and i think there's probably severity levels even though a non-functioning pancreas is a non-functioning pancreas. i've noticed that those diagnosed when they're very young fluctuate much more than those diagnosed when they're older. with somebody like adam morrison or jay cutler, you never really even hear they're being diabetic mentioned where as with other people it's more of an around the clock concern. obviously morrison and cutler are athletic so have better functioning metabolisms, but they're being diagnosed later on might have a relationship to that.
I think that may be true, but it may also be a variety of other factors. The longer you have diabetes the more likely you are to develop complications -- so it may be that those diagnosed younger simply have it longer or get complications earlier. Additionally, kids have hormones that are going nuts, especially as they go into their teen years that may make their diabetes harder to control, not necessarily that the diabetes is any worse, its just that because of the hormones they go through a difficult period. And of course....kids are just terrible at taking care of their diabetes and generally don't want to be bothered. I was diagnosed at 11....and for many, many years I didn't want to take care of myself. Even now...I do a much better job, especially with the insulin pump....but I'm not perfect. And so, some of it may also be habit. If you've been taking shitty care of yourself from childhood and just trying to avoid your disease since childhood that may be the path you follow into adulthood. I think T1 diabetes is a very difficult and complex disease...which is why, when I found an endocrinologist I liked, I did everything in my power to keep him. I currently drive like 60 miles each way to see him, and will continue to do so.

But being diagnosed later in life means the person may be mature enough to handle a disease state that requires constant monitoring and effort.

Does your sibling have hypoglycemic unawareness, or does he/she know when they are getting a low blood sugar? I certainly hope your sibling is on an insulin pump....the pump literally saved my life.

HonestAdvice

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by HonestAdvice » Thu May 19, 2016 9:44 am

rcharter1978 wrote:
HonestAdvice wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
HonestAdvice wrote:
El Pollito wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:
El Pollito wrote:I've been dating a T1 diabetic for 5 years, but thanks for that!
Do you have accommodations in your home? A med team on standby?
In addition to being a sugar momma, I am a one-woman med team. I'm always there to be like "hey you seem a little out of it, have you tested lately?"
that supports what i was saying, though. i wasn't saying you need an ambulance waiting outside for when op gets hypoglycemic. i was saying that the dean of student services is supposed to have it documented somewhere that op is hypoglycemic so that if op were to go unconscious during class, at least one person in the school would know the likely reason why and could get glucose into them... or at least whoever responds to a 911 call could know. if this happened on school property, particularly after op flat out told the dean, it's likely that 20 minute difference would cause serious brain damage and the school would be fucked. that's all i was saying.

in your relationship with a t1 diabetic, you're saying you frequently ask your partner whether they've tested lately on a day to day basis when s/he's generally fine. all i'm saying is the school is supposed to know if op were to go unconscious during a once in a lifetime low that op is hypoglycemic and may need glucose. i don't get how your relationship disproves my point that the school is lucky that op's low wasn't worse, because if it was they'd be fucked and it would be a SJ lawsuit and the board of trustees would be pissed by that dean's stupidity. he'd be gone the second op's suit was filed.
In theory, you definitely have a point. I'm not sure if you have T1 diabetes, I do....and I know when my blood sugar is low enough to be an issue. There are certainly people who have hypoglycemic unawareness....but if OP had such a thing I would think he would know and would have specifically mentioned it to the dean of students. Its only to say that while its certainly possible for a T1 diabetic to have a blood sugar in the teens, most would know that they were running a low blood sugar beforehand. And if they know that they are having a hypoglycemic episode, they should take care of it. And I think you generally have to go pretty low to go into coma, or to faint/experience severe brain damage. I know that I've had blood sugars as low as 27-29 and I've still been able to check my blood sugar and treat my condition.

However, like you said, were the OP to have hypoglycemic unawareness and go so low that they fell out during an exam and no one knew what to do, after the dean of students was on notice....it would be ugly. But perhaps they figure its okay to take that risk, because the risk seems pretty remote.
one of my siblings was first diagnosed after drifting into a coma when they were only about 2. granted, they had lost about 10 pounds, which for babies is pretty intense, but the doctors were dumb and never thought to check. that first shock made us all very attentive to it thereafter, and i think there's probably severity levels even though a non-functioning pancreas is a non-functioning pancreas. i've noticed that those diagnosed when they're very young fluctuate much more than those diagnosed when they're older. with somebody like adam morrison or jay cutler, you never really even hear they're being diabetic mentioned where as with other people it's more of an around the clock concern. obviously morrison and cutler are athletic so have better functioning metabolisms, but they're being diagnosed later on might have a relationship to that.
I think that may be true, but it may also be a variety of other factors. The longer you have diabetes the more likely you are to develop complications -- so it may be that those diagnosed younger simply have it longer or get complications earlier. Additionally, kids have hormones that are going nuts, especially as they go into their teen years that may make their diabetes harder to control, not necessarily that the diabetes is any worse, its just that because of the hormones they go through a difficult period. And of course....kids are just terrible at taking care of their diabetes and generally don't want to be bothered. I was diagnosed at 11....and for many, many years I didn't want to take care of myself. Even now...I do a much better job, especially with the insulin pump....but I'm not perfect. And so, some of it may also be habit. If you've been taking shitty care of yourself from childhood and just trying to avoid your disease since childhood that may be the path you follow into adulthood. I think T1 diabetes is a very difficult and complex disease...which is why, when I found an endocrinologist I liked, I did everything in my power to keep him. I currently drive like 60 miles each way to see him, and will continue to do so.

But being diagnosed later in life means the person may be mature enough to handle a disease state that requires constant monitoring and effort.

Does your sibling have hypoglycemic unawareness, or does he/she know when they are getting a low blood sugar? I certainly hope your sibling is on an insulin pump....the pump literally saved my life.
Yeah, everyone has the pump now. Everyone can sense when they're going low, but sone of the symptoms of going low are mood shifts and cognitive delays so it's still not perfect. There's also the coddling effect. People are less in tune to it if they're used to those around them handling it, and you can't really employ a tough love approach when you're dealing with serious medical issues.

But back on track OP is a fool if they don't push for something here. Law students are notoriously square, and this site attracts the worst of the lot so if there's any support then I'm all for then OP has a great argument. With accommodations, most law schools will generally abide by any doctor's note they get to not risk allegations of violating the ADA. People get extra time all the time for medical conditions that aren't even recognized by the ADA as being anything more than imaginary. In a situation like this, we're dealing with virtually one of the most widely accepted medical ailments requiring testing accommodations that exists so it's a no brainer. OP could also present it in such a way so as to show that the dean not only violated established norms and arguably violated the ADA, but that he also subjected the school to unnecessary risk due to conduct that arguably crossed the line from negligence and into recklessness while acting in his capacity as a dean, and therefore this is really a school problem, not a dean of student life problem.

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First Offense

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by First Offense » Thu May 19, 2016 10:10 am

Chrstgtr wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:Do law schools have nurses or someone responsible for knowing someone's medical information. I don't remember that. If they'd really be liable for someone passing out from the beetus, they'd probably make you wear a medical bracelet.
Or you could just have a system that allows the person to retake a portion of their exam in the event that they have an incident. We're not talking about a crazy plan here.
Do we know if OP alerted anyone during or immediately after the attack that he just had one and requested a pause of time?

Basically - do we know if at any point the OP said "this accomodation is necessary" or that he needed one at that moment because of a sudden appearance of his condition?

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El Pollito

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Re: Type 1 Diabetes and exams

Post by El Pollito » Thu May 19, 2016 11:21 am

she basically told me that if I have it figured out, there's no need for accommodations, and I really didn't think there was any problem.
yeah i'm sure that lawsuit will go great. sounds like OP didn't really think the were needed, didn't formally request them, and then found out they might be needed during the exam

and btw the accommodation for diabetics is generally being allowed to bring in food and juice, not more time

Seriously? What are you waiting for?

Now there's a charge.
Just kidding ... it's still FREE!


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