Top Law Schools

grades are in, and I failed to meet my most modest expectations with a 2.2. I'm at a lower tier-1 school.

I've done the math, and to hit that top 15-20% ranking by graduation I would have to do pretty f*king awesome for the next 5 semesters. should I just drop out?

pocky jocky wrote:grades are in, and I failed to meet my most modest expectations with a 2.2. I'm at a lower tier-1 school.

I've done the math, and to hit that top 15-20% ranking by graduation I would have to do pretty f*king awesome for the next 5 semesters. should I just drop out?

yikes how much are you paying

pocky jocky wrote:grades are in, and I failed to meet my most modest expectations with a 2.2. I'm at a lower tier-1 school.

I've done the math, and to hit that top 15-20% ranking by graduation I would have to do pretty f*king awesome for the next 5 semesters. should I just drop out?

The long answer is long and boring. The short answer is "probably".

Sorry dude.

MrAnon wrote:

pocky jocky wrote:grades are in, and I failed to meet my most modest expectations with a 2.2. I'm at a lower tier-1 school.

I've done the math, and to hit that top 15-20% ranking by graduation I would have to do pretty f*king awesome for the next 5 semesters. should I just drop out?

yikes how much are you paying

about 23k a year

3|ink wrote:

pocky jocky wrote:grades are in, and I failed to meet my most modest expectations with a 2.2. I'm at a lower tier-1 school.

I've done the math, and to hit that top 15-20% ranking by graduation I would have to do pretty f*king awesome for the next 5 semesters. should I just drop out?

The long answer is long and boring. The short answer is "probably".

Sorry dude.

ouch. that's what I've gathered from other drop out threads.

23k isn't horrible. Is that all the debt you'll have at graduation? 70k total? Are you going to lose a scholarship?

MrAnon wrote:23k isn't horrible. Is that all the debt you'll have at graduation? 70k total? Are you going to lose a scholarship?

no scholarship, and my debt should be under 100k (maybe 80K?)

has anyone known students who have made the kind of turnaround I would need to make law school worth it?

People end up with more debt than you're going to have from undergraduate institutions. I would think that graduating in the middle of a T1 law school class is worth quite a bit more than graduating with any sort of Humanities degree from a liberal arts college.

Kikero wrote:People end up with more debt than you're going to have from undergraduate institutions. I would think that graduating in the middle of a T1 law school class is worth quite a bit more than graduating with any sort of Humanities degree from a liberal arts college.

the only other option I can think of at this point is going for some MBA program...and that just doesn't appeal to me.

fuck.

Assuming you are neither able to turn your grades around nor get a satisfactory entry level legal job, does the program at which you are getting your degree from add anything to your resume? I ask because there may be salvageable value in the degree even if you don't practice law.

Ask yourself:
1. Does it open up a new large non-legal job market for you? (one that you would find desirable)
2. Does the degree supplement your preexisting degrees/skills? (to the extent that a third party would believe you if you tried to spin it to them in that way?)
3. Is the institution you are getting your degree from well regarded in either the (large) city it's located in or the city you are from? (preferably both)
4. Is the alumni network from the institution you are getting you law degree from strong (successful graduates) and loyal (graduates strive to hire graduates) to the school? (you need to be able read through the bs provided by the law school to figure out this one)

If you have a yes to at least three of the above questions, I would at least consider staying.

If not, I would apply to some jobs (while still in school) that you are qualified for and see how that pans out. Assuming that goes well, you should consider dropping out. Assuming that it doesn't, you might as well stay.

pocky jocky wrote:

Kikero wrote:People end up with more debt than you're going to have from undergraduate institutions. I would think that graduating in the middle of a T1 law school class is worth quite a bit more than graduating with any sort of Humanities degree from a liberal arts college.

the only other option I can think of at this point is going for some MBA program...and that just doesn't appeal to me.

fuck.

Exactly how hard did you try? Do you think you're now motivated to try MUCH harder? I mean, graduating in the middle of the pack can't be that devastating.

Why is it law or some other grad school the only options in life? Just go out there and look for work! You're going to have to eventually anyway. Grad school may not be your thing. Why do you think you are going to clean up in an MBA program after this performance?

Its pretty tough to go from 2.2 to 4.0. Still would leave you where? Below median?

how do you calculate how much of an improvement can be made in rank. like obviously not possible to be top 5% but is top 10% possible if the first semester is bottom 20%?

3|ink wrote:

pocky jocky wrote:

Kikero wrote:People end up with more debt than you're going to have from undergraduate institutions. I would think that graduating in the middle of a T1 law school class is worth quite a bit more than graduating with any sort of Humanities degree from a liberal arts college.

the only other option I can think of at this point is going for some MBA program...and that just doesn't appeal to me.

fuck.

Exactly how hard did you try? Do you think you're now motivated to try MUCH harder? I mean, graduating in the middle of the pack can't be that devastating.

I came prepared to put in the effort, but this being my first real schooling outside of undergrad I don't think I appreciated what it would be like to graded based solely on a final exam. I completely freaked out the last couple of weeks before, I felt really overwhelmed.

this semester I have a better sense of how the curriculum ties together, and I have some ideas for new strategies (e.g. outlining throughout the semester, something I didn't do despite everyone's admonition that I do so).

as for the devastation: I'll admit I've been lurking around TLS for a while and it sounds pretty grim if you're not hitting top 20% for your ranking.

Aberzombie1892 wrote:Assuming you are neither able to turn your grades around nor get a satisfactory entry level legal job, does the program at which you are getting your degree from add anything to your resume? I ask because there may be salvageable value in the degree even if you don't practice law.

Ask yourself:
1. Does it open up a new large non-legal job market for you? (one that you would find desirable)
2. Does the degree supplement your preexisting degrees/skills? (to the extent that a third party would believe you if you tried to spin it to them in that way?)
3. Is the institution you are getting your degree from well regarded in either the (large) city it's located in or the city you are from? (preferably both)
4. Is the alumni network from the institution you are getting you law degree from strong (successful graduates) and loyal (graduates strive to hire graduates) to the school? (you need to be able read through the bs provided by the law school to figure out this one)

If you have a yes to at least three of the above questions, I would at least consider staying.

If not, I would apply to some jobs (while still in school) that you are qualified for and see how that pans out. Assuming that goes well, you should consider dropping out. Assuming that it doesn't, you might as well stay.

thanks, pretty solid advice. I think I have a yes on 3 of those questions.

merc280 wrote:how do you calculate how much of an improvement can be made in rank. like obviously not possible to be top 5% but is top 10% possible if the first semester is bottom 20%?

I looked at the stats for past rankings at my school, and judged what gpa I would need for a particular class rank. then it was just a matter of averaging 6 gpas including this first semester's.

MrAnon wrote:Why is it law or some other grad school the only options in life? Just go out there and look for work! You're going to have to eventually anyway. Grad school may not be your thing. Why do you think you are going to clean up in an MBA program after this performance?

Its pretty tough to go from 2.2 to 4.0. Still would leave you where? Below median?

well, for illustration: if I managed an average of 3.6 for the remaining semesters, I would prob land in the top 30%

pocky jocky wrote:grades are in, and I failed to meet my most modest expectations with a 2.2. I'm at a lower tier-1 school.

I've done the math, and to hit that top 15-20% ranking by graduation I would have to do pretty f*king awesome for the next 5 semesters. should I just drop out?

You need to to hit this number by the end of 1L, not 3L. After 1L all that matters is connections and networking. Nothing else.

MTal wrote:

pocky jocky wrote:grades are in, and I failed to meet my most modest expectations with a 2.2. I'm at a lower tier-1 school.

I've done the math, and to hit that top 15-20% ranking by graduation I would have to do pretty f*king awesome for the next 5 semesters. should I just drop out?

You need to to hit this number by the end of 1L, not 3L. After 1L all that matters is connections and networking. Nothing else.

suspected that was the case.

motherfuck.

pocky jocky wrote:

MTal wrote:

pocky jocky wrote:grades are in, and I failed to meet my most modest expectations with a 2.2. I'm at a lower tier-1 school.

I've done the math, and to hit that top 15-20% ranking by graduation I would have to do pretty f*king awesome for the next 5 semesters. should I just drop out?

You need to to hit this number by the end of 1L, not 3L. After 1L all that matters is connections and networking. Nothing else.

suspected that was the case.

motherfuck.

You have nothing to worry about if you drop out after 1L and cut your losses.

MTal wrote:

pocky jocky wrote:

MTal wrote:

pocky jocky wrote:grades are in, and I failed to meet my most modest expectations with a 2.2. I'm at a lower tier-1 school.

I've done the math, and to hit that top 15-20% ranking by graduation I would have to do pretty f*king awesome for the next 5 semesters. should I just drop out?

You need to to hit this number by the end of 1L, not 3L. After 1L all that matters is connections and networking. Nothing else.

suspected that was the case.

motherfuck.

You have nothing to worry about if you drop out after 1L and cut your losses.

well that's something I'm considering. but here's another question I've wondered about:

I have an uncle who is a partner in a huge firm. another of my uncles has assured me that he'll help me out. my question is: exactly how much discretion could this uncle have in 'getting' me a job? I have never been the beneficiary of connections and such, so this is pretty foreign to me. I understand what cronyism and the like are, but I have no idea how it actually works. how exactly is a family member able to help someone out with a job? the whole thing seems improbable.

pocky jocky wrote: I have an uncle who is a partner in a huge firm. another of my uncles has assured me that he'll help me out. my question is: exactly how much discretion could this uncle have in 'getting' me a job? I have never been the beneficiary of connections and such, so this is pretty foreign to me. I understand what cronyism and the like are, but I have no idea how it actually works. how exactly is a family member able to help someone out with a job? the whole thing seems improbable.

Uh no, Law School is about CONNECTIONS. If you've got those then fuck it.

Yes, you should drop out of law school.

If your family connection can 100 % GUARANTEE you a job, then it may be worth staying.