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Just wondering.

OnePostWonder wrote:Just wondering.

There was a guy at CCN who was doing a JD/MBA. Was #1 in his class at the law school and the business school after the first year. Turned down law review because he said "he didn't need it anyway," and ended up having a blast for the next two years. Got a very prestigious clerkship after law school and is now working for one of the most prestigious boutiques in the country. Looks like he didn't actually need it.

Dunno, but man I often wish I had. After striking out at OCI, doing the bs work for LR is unbearable.

Helmholtz wrote:

OnePostWonder wrote:Just wondering.

There was a guy at CCN who was doing a JD/MBA. Was #1 in his class at the law school and the business school after the first year. Turned down law review because he said "he didn't need it anyway," and ended up having a blast for the next two years. Got a very prestigious clerkship after law school and is now working for one of the most prestigious boutiques in the country. Looks like he didn't actually need it.

I'm pretty skeptical that LR really helps for most jobs. Especially since it doesn't seem to help people who wrote on all that much.

Desert Fox wrote:

Helmholtz wrote:

OnePostWonder wrote:Just wondering.

There was a guy at CCN who was doing a JD/MBA. Was #1 in his class at the law school and the business school after the first year. Turned down law review because he said "he didn't need it anyway," and ended up having a blast for the next two years. Got a very prestigious clerkship after law school and is now working for one of the most prestigious boutiques in the country. Looks like he didn't actually need it.

I'm pretty skeptical that LR really helps for most jobs. Especially since it doesn't seem to help people who wrote on all that much.

I think this might go a little too far in the other direction. LR certainly doesn't guarantee you a job, but of course it helps. It's probably like softs in admissions. It'll never stand alone, but helps if you have the numbers.

G. T. L. Rev. wrote:

Desert Fox wrote:
I'm pretty skeptical that LR really helps for most jobs. Especially since it doesn't seem to help people who wrote on all that much.

I cannot speak to biglaw or other types of hiring -- the effect of LR there is probably an easily-answered empirical question -- but in clerkship hiring LR makes a difference for lots of judges. Thus, if OP wants to clerk, s/he should consider that reality as part of the overall picture. If all you want is biglaw, and you have awesome grades, then foregoing LR seems completely rational to me.

And if you miss biglaw, you are gonna want that clerkship bump real bad... but are judges going to seriously look at a write-on kid?

IAFG wrote:

G. T. L. Rev. wrote:

Desert Fox wrote:
I'm pretty skeptical that LR really helps for most jobs. Especially since it doesn't seem to help people who wrote on all that much.

I cannot speak to biglaw or other types of hiring -- the effect of LR there is probably an easily-answered empirical question -- but in clerkship hiring LR makes a difference for lots of judges. Thus, if OP wants to clerk, s/he should consider that reality as part of the overall picture. If all you want is biglaw, and you have awesome grades, then foregoing LR seems completely rational to me.

And if you miss biglaw, you are gonna want that clerkship bump real bad... but are judges going to seriously look at a write-on kid?

Going the clerkship route also requires having an interest in Con law, right?

Important to note too that when a write-on member writes on, she only has 1/3 of her grades. If she dramatically improved over 2L/3L, she could still have a clerkship-worthy transcript.

MrKappus wrote:Important to note too that when a write-on member writes on, she only has 1/3 of her grades. If she dramatically improved over 2L/3L, she could still have a clerkship-worthy transcript.

Don't judges already decide well before 3L grades come in?

IAFG wrote:

MrKappus wrote:Important to note too that when a write-on member writes on, she only has 1/3 of her grades. If she dramatically improved over 2L/3L, she could still have a clerkship-worthy transcript.

Don't judges already decide well before 3L grades come in?

Hell, some judges hire before even a single 2L grade comes out. Then again, a fair number of people clerk after a couple years of working, so the judge would see every grade.

Helmholtz wrote:

IAFG wrote:

MrKappus wrote:Important to note too that when a write-on member writes on, she only has 1/3 of her grades. If she dramatically improved over 2L/3L, she could still have a clerkship-worthy transcript.

Don't judges already decide well before 3L grades come in?

Hell, some judges hire before even a single 2L grade comes out. Then again, a fair number of people clerk after a couple years of working, so the judge would see every grade.

But, if you're an unemployed write-on kid...

MrKappus wrote:Important to note too that when a write-on member writes on, she only has 1/3 1/2 of her grades that are relevant to clerkships. If she dramatically improved over 2L/3L, she could still have a clerkship-worthy transcript.

Good points above.

Desert Fox wrote:

Helmholtz wrote:

OnePostWonder wrote:Just wondering.

There was a guy at CCN who was doing a JD/MBA. Was #1 in his class at the law school and the business school after the first year. Turned down law review because he said "he didn't need it anyway," and ended up having a blast for the next two years. Got a very prestigious clerkship after law school and is now working for one of the most prestigious boutiques in the country. Looks like he didn't actually need it.

I'm pretty skeptical that LR really helps for most jobs. Especially since it doesn't seem to help people who wrote on all that much.

Eh, we talked about it in every interview and I feel it was the sole relating factor i had to several of my interviewers. A few firms have only ever hired LR people from my school. One of my callbacks even scheduled interviewers who shared an interest with my note topic. Hard to believe it had no impact.

G. T. L. Rev. wrote:

Helmholtz wrote:

IAFG wrote:

MrKappus wrote:Important to note too that when a write-on member writes on, she only has 1/3 of her grades. If she dramatically improved over 2L/3L, she could still have a clerkship-worthy transcript.

Don't judges already decide well before 3L grades come in?

Hell, some judges hire before even a single 2L grade comes out. Then again, a fair number of people clerk after a couple years of working, so the judge would see every grade.

Clerking does not require an interest in conlaw. Lots of the material you encounter as a federal clerk arises under statutes or the common law, rather than the Constitution.

As for the above, I am unaware of any judge who hires "before even a single 2L grade comes out." Any chance you are willing to share who these judges are?

I believe that a certain judge on the Ninth Circuit will snap up some people more than a month before they sit down for their first 2L exam

G. T. L. Rev. wrote:

Helmholtz wrote:I believe that a certain judge on the Ninth Circuit will snap up some people more than a month before they sit down for their first 2L exam

In prior years, said judge waited until second semester. My application year (spring/summer 2009), the judge in question waited until spring!

This is madness. If anyone else has credible, specific reports of hiring before second semester of 2L year, please let me know. I promise to keep the specific judge names & courts confidential.

I'm pretty sure both Wilkinson and Kozinski hire that early whenever they feel like doing so (and don't when they don't?)

Desert Fox wrote:

Helmholtz wrote:

OnePostWonder wrote:Just wondering.

There was a guy at CCN who was doing a JD/MBA. Was #1 in his class at the law school and the business school after the first year. Turned down law review because he said "he didn't need it anyway," and ended up having a blast for the next two years. Got a very prestigious clerkship after law school and is now working for one of the most prestigious boutiques in the country. Looks like he didn't actually need it.

I'm pretty skeptical that LR really helps for most jobs. Especially since it doesn't seem to help people who wrote on all that much.

at fordham it helps big time. outside the t14 i imagine its super important. fordham takes the top 25 students as grade ons and another 30+ as write ons. write ons can be in the top 33%. so basically everyone after the 6% percentile up to the 33rd % or so that is on lr has a HUGE advantage over other non-lr students considering fordham OCIs at around 25%.

I did(effectively). Best decision I made in law school. Never affected me negatively in the slightest(although I never wanted to clerk).

Not many, but many later wish they did.

I turned it down. Don't want to clerk and don't want biglaw.

thesealocust wrote:

G. T. L. Rev. wrote:

Helmholtz wrote:I believe that a certain judge on the Ninth Circuit will snap up some people more than a month before they sit down for their first 2L exam

In prior years, said judge waited until second semester. My application year (spring/summer 2009), the judge in question waited until spring!

This is madness. If anyone else has credible, specific reports of hiring before second semester of 2L year, please let me know. I promise to keep the specific judge names & courts confidential.

I'm pretty sure both Wilkinson and Kozinski hire that early whenever they feel like doing so (and don't when they don't?)

Lol at kozinski.

He trolled my contracts class.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OdjCdbGucCU

Apparently my professor clerked with him so he stopped by to harass us when he came to visit my LS. He's even more hardcore in person.

Helmholtz wrote:

OnePostWonder wrote:Just wondering.

There was a guy at CCN who was doing a JD/MBA. Was #1 in his class at the law school and the business school after the first year. Turned down law review because he said "he didn't need it anyway," and ended up having a blast for the next two years. Got a very prestigious clerkship after law school and is now working for one of the most prestigious boutiques in the country. Looks like he didn't actually need it.

I decided to look up this guy again. Seems that the "very prestigious clerkship" I alluded to was actually a SCOTUS clerkship (for some reason, I had thought he only did COA).

Know some people with the grades who never did the write on - didn't want it.

I tried to turn down Law Review, but those jackasses never gave me the chance to.




I'm looking at you, Betasteve.