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I am currently in the top 5% at a school ranked between 30 and 40. I made law review. Incorporating my scholarship, my total debt if I graduate from that school will be $130K. I am considering transferring to Duke, UVA, Penn, or Georgetown. If I make the move, my debt at graduation will be ~$200K, so the difference is ~$70K. Does such a move make sense? My goal is biglaw in D.C., and I'd like to graduate with a credential that carries some weight. I can get biglaw right now at my present school. My current law school is unwilling to increase my scholarship. What does anyone think?

Anonymous User wrote:I am currently in the top 5% at a school ranked between 30 and 40. I made law review. Incorporating my scholarship, my total debt if I graduate from that school will be $130K. I am considering transferring to Duke, UVA, Penn, or Georgetown. If I make the move, my debt at graduation will be ~$200K, so the difference is ~$70K. Does such a move make sense? My goal is biglaw in D.C., and I'd like to graduate with a credential that carries some weight. I can get biglaw right now at my present school. My current law school is unwilling to increase my scholarship. What does anyone think?

You might already know this, but with that class rank and school rank you might be able to do better than the schools you listed. I'm not sure what schools still have open applications, but consider applying to some better schools.

I know people that made a similar move and have become good friends with one. He mentioned that the name of the school was the deciding factor for him. The school will be on your resume for the rest of your life, and most people 10 years down the road won't care if you're summa cum at, say, Iowa, but they will care if you went to Duke, etc.

Thanks for the reply. I also applied to Harvard, Columbia, and NYU. I didn't list those in the original post because I'm not sure how realistic they are. I'm following those threads, and I think they are probably reach schools. If I got into Columbia, I'd be packed and on a flight to NY in minutes. But what about Penn or UVA? If I get into one of those schools, is the move worth it? I'm leaning towards transferring almost entirely because of prestige and potential options down the road. On the other hand, leaving will probably hurt my clerkship hopes. It is difficult for me to identify tangible benefits of transferring.

hartfordhockaloogies wrote:I know people that made a similar move and have become good friends with one. He mentioned that the name of the school was the deciding factor for him. The school will be on your resume for the rest of your life, and most people 10 years down the road won't care if you're summa cum at, say, Iowa, but they will care if you went to Duke, etc.

I think this is backwards. The name of your school helps you get your first job. After that, though, where you went to school becomes less and less important. By the time you're ten years out of law school, it's unlikely to matter at all.

rpupkin wrote:

hartfordhockaloogies wrote:I know people that made a similar move and have become good friends with one. He mentioned that the name of the school was the deciding factor for him. The school will be on your resume for the rest of your life, and most people 10 years down the road won't care if you're summa cum at, say, Iowa, but they will care if you went to Duke, etc.

I think this is backwards. The name of your school helps you get your first job. After that, though, where you went to school becomes less and less important. By the time you're ten years out of law school, it's unlikely to matter at all.

Are you suggesting that I stay put?

rpupkin wrote:

hartfordhockaloogies wrote:I know people that made a similar move and have become good friends with one. He mentioned that the name of the school was the deciding factor for him. The school will be on your resume for the rest of your life, and most people 10 years down the road won't care if you're summa cum at, say, Iowa, but they will care if you went to Duke, etc.

I think this is backwards. The name of your school helps you get your first job. After that, though, where you went to school becomes less and less important. By the time you're ten years out of law school, it's unlikely to matter at all.

This isn't necessarily true for all areas of law.

I was in the same position last year. The best way to answer it is this way, is a Duke degree worth 70k + interest to you? If yes, then go for it. If not, then don't. You will probably get a biglaw job where you are at, and are probably in a better position to clerk by staying put, being on LR, and reaching out to faculty to help you land one. But, staying top 5% will be hard and you probably want to do that if you decide to pass up on a t14 degree. But more debt witll strap you to 2,000+ billable hours for a few extra years than you might want to. Either way, you can't go wrong. As for me, I decided to stay, and could not imagine facing more debt than I already have to; but this was a personal choice.

redblueyellowgreen wrote:

rpupkin wrote:

hartfordhockaloogies wrote:I know people that made a similar move and have become good friends with one. He mentioned that the name of the school was the deciding factor for him. The school will be on your resume for the rest of your life, and most people 10 years down the road won't care if you're summa cum at, say, Iowa, but they will care if you went to Duke, etc.

I think this is backwards. The name of your school helps you get your first job. After that, though, where you went to school becomes less and less important. By the time you're ten years out of law school, it's unlikely to matter at all.

Are you suggesting that I stay put?

Not necessarily. I'm just saying you shouldn't transfer because of some perceived long-term effect of the value of the "name" of your law school.

If some of the short-term goals you have (like working at a law firm in DC) are only possible if you transfer, then you should consider doing it.

sandwhich wrote:

rpupkin wrote:

hartfordhockaloogies wrote:I know people that made a similar move and have become good friends with one. He mentioned that the name of the school was the deciding factor for him. The school will be on your resume for the rest of your life, and most people 10 years down the road won't care if you're summa cum at, say, Iowa, but they will care if you went to Duke, etc.

I think this is backwards. The name of your school helps you get your first job. After that, though, where you went to school becomes less and less important. By the time you're ten years out of law school, it's unlikely to matter at all.

This isn't necessarily true for all areas of law.

Please elaborate.

Thanks for the advice. I'm going to wait to see how all my apps do before I make a decision either way. Assuming I get into UVA, Duke, and Penn, which school makes the most sense? I'm leaning towards UVA and Penn since I want biglaw in D.C. Obviously, getting into harvard or CCN would make this decision pretty easy. UVA and Penn seem like peer schools.

These schools all cost about the same. Given my stats and goals, which school is arguably worth an additional $70K? What's my most rational move here?

Where is your school located. I think the best and most common advice for someone in your position is to stay if they want biglaw in general, but there's no way even top 5% at your school is guaranteed DC biglaw, so I think the move is justified if that's what you really want. Regardless you should still be bidding and mass mailing NYC and I hope you realize that DC biglaw is more than likely still not in the cards for you.

redblueyellowgreen wrote:Thanks for the reply. I also applied to Harvard, Columbia, and NYU. I didn't list those in the original post because I'm not sure how realistic they are. I'm following those threads, and I think they are probably reach schools. If I got into Columbia, I'd be packed and on a flight to NY in minutes. But what about Penn or UVA? If I get into one of those schools, is the move worth it? I'm leaning towards transferring almost entirely because of prestige and potential options down the road. On the other hand, leaving will probably hurt my clerkship hopes. It is difficult for me to identify tangible benefits of transferring.

While you can never be certain, Columbia isn't a reach for you. I'd say you are more likely to get in than to be rejected. But you can never predict these things for certain.

The location of the school and where you want to work are likely most relevant. Your school is regional so while law review is a great prestige marker, its value diminishes with distance.

scottidsntknow wrote:Where is your school located. I think the best and most common advice for someone in your position is to stay if they want biglaw in general, but there's no way even top 5% at your school is guaranteed DC biglaw, so I think the move is justified if that's what you really want. Regardless you should still be bidding and mass mailing NYC and I hope you realize that DC biglaw is more than likely still not in the cards for you.

My school is located in Virginia. And yes, I realize that DC is a tough market to break into. DC is my first choice, but I will also bid and mass mail NY.

redblueyellowgreen wrote:

scottidsntknow wrote:Where is your school located. I think the best and most common advice for someone in your position is to stay if they want biglaw in general, but there's no way even top 5% at your school is guaranteed DC biglaw, so I think the move is justified if that's what you really want. Regardless you should still be bidding and mass mailing NYC and I hope you realize that DC biglaw is more than likely still not in the cards for you.

My school is located in Virginia. And yes, I realize that DC is a tough market to break into. DC is my first choice, but I will also bid and mass mail NY.

This is tough. Either option could be argued for. On one hand, you could stay put and get DC big law, which would be your top choice. On the other, you could transfer and also get DC big law but be wondering what if every time you write your loan repayment checks. I think the deciding factor should be how people who graded onto LR at your school have fared in the last 5 years. Good luck!

If you are at W&L, run as fast as you can to Duke, Penn, Virginia, etc.

P.S. You should be admitted to Columbia.

AReasonableMan wrote:

redblueyellowgreen wrote:

scottidsntknow wrote:Where is your school located. I think the best and most common advice for someone in your position is to stay if they want biglaw in general, but there's no way even top 5% at your school is guaranteed DC biglaw, so I think the move is justified if that's what you really want. Regardless you should still be bidding and mass mailing NYC and I hope you realize that DC biglaw is more than likely still not in the cards for you.

My school is located in Virginia. And yes, I realize that DC is a tough market to break into. DC is my first choice, but I will also bid and mass mail NY.

This is tough. Either option could be argued for. On one hand, you could stay put and get DC big law, which would be your top choice. On the other, you could transfer and also get DC big law but be wondering what if every time you write your loan repayment checks. I think the deciding factor should be how people who graded onto LR at your school have fared in the last 5 years. Good luck!

Thanks for the advice!