OCI/callbacks/etc Men's Clothing Mega-thread Forum

[Rooney]

I just got this suit for the summer and it's got to be the best sub-$500 suit I've ever seen. Really well cut, I barely have to get anything tailored.

[crazycanuck]

I just got this suit for the summer and it's got to be the best sub-$500 suit I've ever seen. Really well cut, I barely have to get anything tailored.

is it that color too?

[Rooney]

is it that color too?

Yeah, it's a little darker/richer than in the picture, and they have a navy and black version too. It's hot as hell most months where I live so I can get a lot of use out of a light suit

[emciosn]

Question:

Working on expanding my wardrobe whenever I have some money to spare in law school. Got a pretty good deal on a couple of suits the other day a medium grey and a tan suit. I already had a couple of other suits that are darker charcoal/black with muted pinstripes. A lot of people in this thread have said that darker solids or dark with muted pinstripes is appropriate for the office, what about the medium grey or tan suit? Appropriate for certain seasons?

This thread has been pretty helpful, thanks.

[Rooney]

Question:

Working on expanding my wardrobe whenever I have some money to spare in law school. Got a pretty good deal on a couple of suits the other day a medium grey and a tan suit. I already had a couple of other suits that are darker charcoal/black with muted pinstripes. A lot of people in this thread have said that darker solids or dark with muted pinstripes is appropriate for the office, what about the medium grey or tan suit? Appropriate for certain seasons?

This thread has been pretty helpful, thanks.

Absolutely

[emciosn]

Question:

Working on expanding my wardrobe whenever I have some money to spare in law school. Got a pretty good deal on a couple of suits the other day a medium grey and a tan suit. I already had a couple of other suits that are darker charcoal/black with muted pinstripes. A lot of people in this thread have said that darker solids or dark with muted pinstripes is appropriate for the office, what about the medium grey or tan suit? Appropriate for certain seasons?

This thread has been pretty helpful, thanks.

Absolutely

So is a good rule of thumb, the colder it is, the darker your suit?

[Rooney]

So is a good rule of thumb, the colder it is, the darker your suit?

To a point yes, but the main factor is the material, i.e. don't wear wool in the summer or seersucker/light cotton in winter...

[Stanford4Me]

Yeah, it's a little darker/richer than in the picture, and they have a navy and black version too. It's hot as hell most months where I live so I can get a lot of use out of a light suit

Where at? I'm looking for a khaki suit for a summer wedding.

[Rooney]

Yeah, it's a little darker/richer than in the picture, and they have a navy and black version too. It's hot as hell most months where I live so I can get a lot of use out of a light suit

Where at? I'm looking for a khaki suit for a summer wedding.

Oh, I just realized I didn't say where in the picture post.

http://www.jcrew.com/mens_feature/weartoworkshop.jsp
I recommend the Ludlow cut. A little more European, slimmer (jacket and trousers) and the jacket sleeves are about a inch or two shorter

[Pufer]

So is a good rule of thumb, the colder it is, the darker your suit?

To a point yes, but the main factor is the material, i.e. don't wear wool in the summer or seersucker/light cotton in winter...

That's absolutely the rule of thumb in the rest of the world. The legal world is much more conservative than the rest of the world.

The law world rule of thumb is, if you do anything different in summer at all, it's switching to a tropical wool or maybe a poplin (wool/silk preferably, wool/polyester if you must) in navy or medium gray. I suppose partners might wander around in seersucker suits in Atlanta or something, but that doesn't mean that anybody else should (at least until they make partner).

What you want to think of is how politicians dress themselves when they know they'll be seen. Below is the freshman class of the 112th Congress. I've pointed out the dipshits who have managed to miss the memo on how you're supposed to look when you're going to work:



Guy at front-right isn't wearing a suit. Guy to the far right, balcony has a maroon shirt on. Guy next to the tall guy is wearing a light suit. The fat guy in the cowboy hat is being folksy, but he's old and has still managed to properly dress himself otherwise, so he gets a pass on the red arrow. The pass notwithstanding, don't be those guys.

Your mission in dressing yourself for a law job is to pretend that you're somewhere in the middle of that picture. If anything you have on would make you stick out amongst that bunch of folks as much as the guys I have big arrows pointing at—no matter the season or where in the country you are—take that shit off.

-Pufer

[Borhas]

I like how litigators have so many more options, especially criminal side

[Bronte]

Nice post, Pufer.

[HenryKillinger]

Nice post, Pufer.

I don't think I've ever seen a Pufer post that hasn't contained useful info. Then again, he did overlook the crazy lady in the front row (red dress) sporting what looks to be an undersized red sequin cowboy hat.

[crazycanuck]

Nice post, Pufer.

I don't think I've ever seen a Pufer post that hasn't contained useful info. Then again, he did overlook the crazy lady in the front row (red dress) sporting what looks to be an undersized red sequin cowboy hat.

Yeah but bitches be crazy

[PirateCap'n]

So is a good rule of thumb, the colder it is, the darker your suit?

To a point yes, but the main factor is the material, i.e. don't wear wool in the summer or seersucker/light cotton in winter...

That's absolutely the rule of thumb in the rest of the world. The legal world is much more conservative than the rest of the world.

The law world rule of thumb is, if you do anything different in summer at all, it's switching to a tropical wool or maybe a poplin (wool/silk preferably, wool/polyester if you must) in navy or medium gray. I suppose partners might wander around in seersucker suits in Atlanta or something, but that doesn't mean that anybody else should (at least until they make partner).

What you want to think of is how politicians dress themselves when they know they'll be seen. Below is the freshman class of the 112th Congress. I've pointed out the dipshits who have managed to miss the memo on how you're supposed to look when you're going to work.

Guy at front-right isn't wearing a suit. Guy to the far right, balcony has a maroon shirt on. Guy next to the tall guy is wearing a light suit. The fat guy in the cowboy hat is being folksy, but he's old and has still managed to properly dress himself otherwise, so he gets a pass on the red arrow. The pass notwithstanding, don't be those guys.

Your mission in dressing yourself for a law job is to pretend that you're somewhere in the middle of that picture. If anything you have on would make you stick out amongst that bunch of folks as much as the guys I have big arrows pointing at—no matter the season or where in the country you are—take that shit off.

-Pufer

Pretty sure my SA firm qualifies as some sort of outlier. None of the attorneys in the office wear suits (or even button-ups and ties for that matter) unless it's a day that they have court. Even on court days, it's usually a sports jacket and khakis rather than suits. On non-court days, it's usually a polo and khakis. Heck, on Fridays, some of them wear shorts and t-shirts, and others just wear shorts and polos if they don't have client meetings. It's a southern firm, so, when the attorneys do wear suits, seersucker and linen are prevalent. It seems like they expect us to follow in the same style, so I've taken a liking to linen and seersucker as well. Sure beats the heck out of the usual hot and heavy suits.

[Mr. Fancy]

So is a good rule of thumb, the colder it is, the darker your suit?

To a point yes, but the main factor is the material, i.e. don't wear wool in the summer or seersucker/light cotton in winter...

That's absolutely the rule of thumb in the rest of the world. The legal world is much more conservative than the rest of the world.

The law world rule of thumb is, if you do anything different in summer at all, it's switching to a tropical wool or maybe a poplin (wool/silk preferably, wool/polyester if you must) in navy or medium gray. I suppose partners might wander around in seersucker suits in Atlanta or something, but that doesn't mean that anybody else should (at least until they make partner).

What you want to think of is how politicians dress themselves when they know they'll be seen. Below is the freshman class of the 112th Congress. I've pointed out the dipshits who have managed to miss the memo on how you're supposed to look when you're going to work.

Guy at front-right isn't wearing a suit. Guy to the far right, balcony has a maroon shirt on. Guy next to the tall guy is wearing a light suit. The fat guy in the cowboy hat is being folksy, but he's old and has still managed to properly dress himself otherwise, so he gets a pass on the red arrow. The pass notwithstanding, don't be those guys.

Your mission in dressing yourself for a law job is to pretend that you're somewhere in the middle of that picture. If anything you have on would make you stick out amongst that bunch of folks as much as the guys I have big arrows pointing at—no matter the season or where in the country you are—take that shit off.

-Pufer

Pretty sure my SA firm qualifies as some sort of outlier. None of the attorneys in the office wear suits (or even button-ups and ties for that matter) unless it's a day that they have court. Even on court days, it's usually a sports jacket and khakis rather than suits. On non-court days, it's usually a polo and khakis. Heck, on Fridays, some of them wear shorts and t-shirts, and others just wear shorts and polos if they don't have client meetings. It's a southern firm, so, when the attorneys do wear suits, seersucker and linen are prevalent. It seems like they expect us to follow in the same style, so I've taken a liking to linen and seersucker as well. Sure beats the heck out of the usual hot and heavy suits.

Does the firm pay market?

[missinglink]

So is a good rule of thumb, the colder it is, the darker your suit?

To a point yes, but the main factor is the material, i.e. don't wear wool in the summer or seersucker/light cotton in winter...

That's absolutely the rule of thumb in the rest of the world. The legal world is much more conservative than the rest of the world.

The law world rule of thumb is, if you do anything different in summer at all, it's switching to a tropical wool or maybe a poplin (wool/silk preferably, wool/polyester if you must) in navy or medium gray. I suppose partners might wander around in seersucker suits in Atlanta or something, but that doesn't mean that anybody else should (at least until they make partner).

What you want to think of is how politicians dress themselves when they know they'll be seen. Below is the freshman class of the 112th Congress. I've pointed out the dipshits who have managed to miss the memo on how you're supposed to look when you're going to work.

Guy at front-right isn't wearing a suit. Guy to the far right, balcony has a maroon shirt on. Guy next to the tall guy is wearing a light suit. The fat guy in the cowboy hat is being folksy, but he's old and has still managed to properly dress himself otherwise, so he gets a pass on the red arrow. The pass notwithstanding, don't be those guys.

Your mission in dressing yourself for a law job is to pretend that you're somewhere in the middle of that picture. If anything you have on would make you stick out amongst that bunch of folks as much as the guys I have big arrows pointing at—no matter the season or where in the country you are—take that shit off.

-Pufer

Pretty sure my SA firm qualifies as some sort of outlier. None of the attorneys in the office wear suits (or even button-ups and ties for that matter) unless it's a day that they have court. Even on court days, it's usually a sports jacket and khakis rather than suits. On non-court days, it's usually a polo and khakis. Heck, on Fridays, some of them wear shorts and t-shirts, and others just wear shorts and polos if they don't have client meetings. It's a southern firm, so, when the attorneys do wear suits, seersucker and linen are prevalent. It seems like they expect us to follow in the same style, so I've taken a liking to linen and seersucker as well. Sure beats the heck out of the usual hot and heavy suits.

The attorneys at your firm don't even wear a suit to court? It must be a regional thing.

I've never seen an attorney come through my judge's court in anything but a suit and tie. The only people not "dressed up" are the court reporter and the clerk.

[wolfpack-avvocato]

Someone give me a side by side comparison of a bankers style suite versus the typical lawyers garb.

[JamMasterJ]

Nice post, Pufer.

I don't think I've ever seen a Pufer post that hasn't contained useful info. Then again, he did overlook the crazy lady in the front row (red dress) sporting what looks to be an undersized red sequin cowboy hat.

Yeah but bitches be crazy

Yes they be... and can get away with more than us

[JamMasterJ]

So is a good rule of thumb, the colder it is, the darker your suit?

To a point yes, but the main factor is the material, i.e. don't wear wool in the summer or seersucker/light cotton in winter...

That's absolutely the rule of thumb in the rest of the world. The legal world is much more conservative than the rest of the world.

The law world rule of thumb is, if you do anything different in summer at all, it's switching to a tropical wool or maybe a poplin (wool/silk preferably, wool/polyester if you must) in navy or medium gray. I suppose partners might wander around in seersucker suits in Atlanta or something, but that doesn't mean that anybody else should (at least until they make partner).

What you want to think of is how politicians dress themselves when they know they'll be seen. Below is the freshman class of the 112th Congress. I've pointed out the dipshits who have managed to miss the memo on how you're supposed to look when you're going to work.

Guy at front-right isn't wearing a suit. Guy to the far right, balcony has a maroon shirt on. Guy next to the tall guy is wearing a light suit. The fat guy in the cowboy hat is being folksy, but he's old and has still managed to properly dress himself otherwise, so he gets a pass on the red arrow. The pass notwithstanding, don't be those guys.

Your mission in dressing yourself for a law job is to pretend that you're somewhere in the middle of that picture. If anything you have on would make you stick out amongst that bunch of folks as much as the guys I have big arrows pointing at—no matter the season or where in the country you are—take that shit off.

-Pufer

Pretty sure my SA firm qualifies as some sort of outlier. None of the attorneys in the office wear suits (or even button-ups and ties for that matter) unless it's a day that they have court. Even on court days, it's usually a sports jacket and khakis rather than suits. On non-court days, it's usually a polo and khakis. Heck, on Fridays, some of them wear shorts and t-shirts, and others just wear shorts and polos if they don't have client meetings. It's a southern firm, so, when the attorneys do wear suits, seersucker and linen are prevalent. It seems like they expect us to follow in the same style, so I've taken a liking to linen and seersucker as well. Sure beats the heck out of the usual hot and heavy suits.

That's weird, I interned for a judge in a shithole town in Indiana and even there, every attorney was suited up... though they didn't exactly look good.

[PirateCap'n]

Alright. I already have the usually suggested navy and charcoal suits. I also have black, plaid charcoal (very light stripes), and the more "summery" seersucker and linen suits (which might be frowned upon, but both wear great and fit in with the culture around here). Question is, what should be the next step for my suit collection? Navy with stripes? Charcoal with vertical stripes instead of plaid? Tan? What does a law student/lawyer really need after these? Should I get a second solid navy or charcoal?

[Pufer]

Someone give me a side by side comparison of a bankers style suite versus the typical lawyers garb.

Fundamentally, the difference is what you're doing with your professional of choice. You want to see your investment banker to help you do stuff that you figure is going to help you make big piles of money, and you want them to look successful; they're like advertising types or someone trying to sell you something. They're also in competition, so they want to look like the best guy for the job, with the most expensive suit, the greatest power tie, the $300 haircut, etc.

Most people don't like dealing with their lawyers, and they merely want them to look competent and impressed with the gravity of what is happening; think something more like a funeral director or tax accountant. Lawyers should merely exist, and whatever they're wearing should merely exist too.

Side-by-side, the I-banker's suit will have a more stylish cut, perhaps a more prominent pinstripe or similar, and will almost certainly be very expensive with a big-name brand (Zegna, Armani, etc.). His neckware will be decidedly oriented towards powerful power ties.

The lawyer will have a traditional, solid suit in a dark color made by Brooks Brothers or something. His tie will not be bright and will be very traditional in pattern.

Both of them will wear plain white shirts.

Alright. I already have the usually suggested navy and charcoal suits. I also have black, plaid charcoal (very light stripes), and the more "summery" seersucker and linen suits (which might be frowned upon, but both wear great and fit in with the culture around here). Question is, what should be the next step for my suit collection? Navy with stripes? Charcoal with vertical stripes instead of plaid? Tan? What does a law student/lawyer really need after these? Should I get a second solid navy or charcoal?

I find that having a go-to solid good occasion/interview suit set aside for that duty, and only that duty, is very useful, which would lead me to suggest a solid navy/charcoal. If not that, you might consider picking up a tropical wool navy or charcoal suit so you have something you won't die in during the summer, but will still be able to look like you're wearing a proper suit for situations where a rumpled cotton thing would be out of place (which I would assert is virtually every situation, so I'm sure some like situations exist down in your neck of the woods too, even if its just to meet that big client coming in from Denver who has never even seen a seersucker suit in real life).

-Pufer

[daesonesb]

Just my $.02, but this thread is a bit firm oriented. All the advice is great for a big conservative law firm... but applies less to other arenas in my opinion.

[Borhas]

Just my $.02, but this thread is a bit firm oriented. In criminal law, for example, lawyers have a tendency to wear more bold outfits to court (public defenders and DA's both). This is probably because the criminal lawyer needs to make an impression on the jury. Something like a light grey suit with a red tie, or a striped blue shirt with a lightly patterned tie under a navy suit, will make you stand out to the jury.
Also, criminal lawyers are not as heavily beholden to their higher ups. Their role gives them lots of autonomy, and room to wear what they actually want.
And, some of them just can't dress to save their life.

yeah pretty much all the PD's I've talked to (round 30 or so) say this is important, more so for PDs/crime defense attorneys.

Juries care a lot about how you look,. The jury must see you as a shining beacon of virtue, that requires a bit of flash... but really you have to take attention AWAY from the client. So in crim defense, unlike any other (even DA's), the lawyer is not meant to dissolve in the shadows, but actually be the most prominent figure in the room.

the folksy + wise look also seems to work for the older attorney (even DA's)

[daesonesb]

Just my $.02, but this thread is a bit firm oriented. In criminal law, for example, lawyers have a tendency to wear more bold outfits to court (public defenders and DA's both). This is probably because the criminal lawyer needs to make an impression on the jury. Something like a light grey suit with a red tie, or a striped blue shirt with a lightly patterned tie under a navy suit, will make you stand out to the jury.
Also, criminal lawyers are not as heavily beholden to their higher ups. Their role gives them lots of autonomy, and room to wear what they actually want.
And, some of them just can't dress to save their life.

yeah pretty much all the PD's I've talked to (round 30 or so) say this is important, more so for PDs/crime defense attorneys.

Juries care a lot about how you look,. The jury must see you as a shining beacon of virtue, that requires a bit of flash... but really you have to take attention AWAY from the client. So in crim defense, unlike any other (even DA's), the lawyer is not meant to dissolve in the shadows, but actually be the most prominent figure in the court.

I think you are right there too.

Some of the PD's at the court I'm working at take it pretty far. Bold pin stripes, light suits, black suits with bold ties... Most of them are doing it well. There is a surprising lack of trendiness though. You aren't going to see many criminal defense lawyers in slim modern cut suits, or with skinny ties on. Their look needs to project confidence, catch the eye, but resist flash in the pan trends which might put off the older jurors (of which there are plenty).

Public Defenders do this more than the private attorneys. Private attorneys seem a little more intimidated by the judge, and thus elect a more conservative look.