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This is ridiculous trolling. Bottom of the class can get NYC “litigation.” There is not a significant difference in grade requirements for hiring between litigation and corporate. S&C also draws down to low Stone.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 9:10 pmFor S&C NY, you need roughly a 3.65
You need at least Stone to be competitive for NY litigation.
CLS grad who worked as a litigator at one of W&C/WH/Covington in DC. Obviously it is easier to get from HYS, and DC is more competitive than NYC (where anyone in the class can get biglaw if they interview OK), but hard disagree that it is better to be at “UVA/GULC.” Lots of Columbia grads are at DC firms doing litigation, and there is variation below the most selective firms for people with middling grades who are committed to the DC market.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 8:40 pmNew York: Good.
DC: Not so good. Better to be at UVA/GULC/HYS.
Much better to be at UVA for DC. GULC is better only if you have high grades at both.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 11:52 amCLS grad who worked as a litigator at one of W&C/WH/Covington in DC. Obviously it is easier to get from HYS, and DC is more competitive than NYC (where anyone in the class can get biglaw if they interview OK), but hard disagree that it is better to be at “UVA/GULC.” Lots of Columbia grads are at DC firms doing litigation, and there is variation below the most selective firms for people with middling grades who are committed to the DC market.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 8:40 pmNew York: Good.
DC: Not so good. Better to be at UVA/GULC/HYS.
S&C requires what averages out to better than top 1/3 grades at HLS so i have to imagine its higher than low stonejbagelboy wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 11:47 amThis is ridiculous trolling. Bottom of the class can get NYC “litigation.” There is not a significant difference in grade requirements for hiring between litigation and corporate. S&C also draws down to low Stone.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 9:10 pmFor S&C NY, you need roughly a 3.65
You need at least Stone to be competitive for NY litigation.
Stone and above is helpful for DC generally, but it is insane to suggest that a student at somewhere like GULC has better odds all else equal at any DC firm than a CLS student with the same grades.
I’d say they probably target at least top 1/3 at CLS as well, which is closer to 3.5+ as another poster suggested, not 3.65+.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 12:29 pmS&C requires what averages out to better than top 1/3 grades at HLS so i have to imagine its higher than low stonejbagelboy wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 11:47 amThis is ridiculous trolling. Bottom of the class can get NYC “litigation.” There is not a significant difference in grade requirements for hiring between litigation and corporate. S&C also draws down to low Stone.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 9:10 pmFor S&C NY, you need roughly a 3.65
You need at least Stone to be competitive for NY litigation.
Stone and above is helpful for DC generally, but it is insane to suggest that a student at somewhere like GULC has better odds all else equal at any DC firm than a CLS student with the same grades.
I might just not know where CLS's percentiles sit because Stone/Kent is a nonsense fucking dividejbagelboy wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 1:11 pmI’d say they probably target at least top 1/3 at CLS as well, which is closer to 3.5+ as another poster suggested, not 3.65+.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 12:29 pmS&C requires what averages out to better than top 1/3 grades at HLS so i have to imagine its higher than low stonejbagelboy wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 11:47 amThis is ridiculous trolling. Bottom of the class can get NYC “litigation.” There is not a significant difference in grade requirements for hiring between litigation and corporate. S&C also draws down to low Stone.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 9:10 pmFor S&C NY, you need roughly a 3.65
You need at least Stone to be competitive for NY litigation.
Stone and above is helpful for DC generally, but it is insane to suggest that a student at somewhere like GULC has better odds all else equal at any DC firm than a CLS student with the same grades.
This somewhat tracks with the Penn to S&C pipeline. You need about a 3.7 from Penn as a white person to get S&C NYC.jbagelboy wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 1:11 pmI’d say they probably target at least top 1/3 at CLS as well, which is closer to 3.5+ as another poster suggested, not 3.65+.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 12:29 pmS&C requires what averages out to better than top 1/3 grades at HLS so i have to imagine its higher than low stonejbagelboy wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 11:47 amThis is ridiculous trolling. Bottom of the class can get NYC “litigation.” There is not a significant difference in grade requirements for hiring between litigation and corporate. S&C also draws down to low Stone.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 9:10 pmFor S&C NY, you need roughly a 3.65
You need at least Stone to be competitive for NY litigation.
Stone and above is helpful for DC generally, but it is insane to suggest that a student at somewhere like GULC has better odds all else equal at any DC firm than a CLS student with the same grades.
I wish OCI stats were broken out URM/notAnonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 8:17 pmThis somewhat tracks with the Penn to S&C pipeline. You need about a 3.7 from Penn as a white person to get S&C NYC.jbagelboy wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 1:11 pmI’d say they probably target at least top 1/3 at CLS as well, which is closer to 3.5+ as another poster suggested, not 3.65+.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 12:29 pmS&C requires what averages out to better than top 1/3 grades at HLS so i have to imagine its higher than low stonejbagelboy wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 11:47 amThis is ridiculous trolling. Bottom of the class can get NYC “litigation.” There is not a significant difference in grade requirements for hiring between litigation and corporate. S&C also draws down to low Stone.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 9:10 pmFor S&C NY, you need roughly a 3.65
You need at least Stone to be competitive for NY litigation.
Stone and above is helpful for DC generally, but it is insane to suggest that a student at somewhere like GULC has better odds all else equal at any DC firm than a CLS student with the same grades.
It's ridiculous when they don't when there is a huge disparity for URM and nonURM recruitingAnonymous User wrote: ↑Tue Apr 25, 2023 9:29 amI wish OCI stats were broken out URM/notAnonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 8:17 pmThis somewhat tracks with the Penn to S&C pipeline. You need about a 3.7 from Penn as a white person to get S&C NYC.jbagelboy wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 1:11 pmI’d say they probably target at least top 1/3 at CLS as well, which is closer to 3.5+ as another poster suggested, not 3.65+.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 12:29 pmS&C requires what averages out to better than top 1/3 grades at HLS so i have to imagine its higher than low stonejbagelboy wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 11:47 amThis is ridiculous trolling. Bottom of the class can get NYC “litigation.” There is not a significant difference in grade requirements for hiring between litigation and corporate. S&C also draws down to low Stone.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 9:10 pmFor S&C NY, you need roughly a 3.65
You need at least Stone to be competitive for NY litigation.
Stone and above is helpful for DC generally, but it is insane to suggest that a student at somewhere like GULC has better odds all else equal at any DC firm than a CLS student with the same grades.
Not wanting to show that is probably exactly why they don’t break it out.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue Apr 25, 2023 12:17 pmIt's ridiculous when they don't when there is a huge disparity for URM and nonURM recruiting
At the same time, it's always been roughly that high for that group. Just because they are letting other people in with other stats doesn't really change anything. It's always required tippy top grades.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue Apr 25, 2023 1:04 pmNot wanting to show that is probably exactly why they don’t break it out.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue Apr 25, 2023 12:17 pmIt's ridiculous when they don't when there is a huge disparity for URM and nonURM recruiting
The above posters are pointing out that including URMs in average/median school stats makes it seem like the cutoffs are lower.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Apr 26, 2023 11:30 amAt the same time, it's always been roughly that high for that group. Just because they are letting other people in with other stats doesn't really change anything. It's always required tippy top grades.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue Apr 25, 2023 1:04 pmNot wanting to show that is probably exactly why they don’t break it out.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue Apr 25, 2023 12:17 pmIt's ridiculous when they don't when there is a huge disparity for URM and nonURM recruiting
What is the GPA floor difference for DC between CLS/UVA/GULC?Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 12:15 pmMuch better to be at UVA for DC. GULC is better only if you have high grades at both.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 11:52 amCLS grad who worked as a litigator at one of W&C/WH/Covington in DC. Obviously it is easier to get from HYS, and DC is more competitive than NYC (where anyone in the class can get biglaw if they interview OK), but hard disagree that it is better to be at “UVA/GULC.” Lots of Columbia grads are at DC firms doing litigation, and there is variation below the most selective firms for people with middling grades who are committed to the DC market.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 8:40 pmNew York: Good.
DC: Not so good. Better to be at UVA/GULC/HYS.
IMO it's not that simple. UVA/GULC students are also more likely to be clued into nuances of the market and pursue big DC practice areas rather than showing up saying they're interested in litigation or transactional generally.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Apr 26, 2023 2:19 pmWhat is the GPA floor difference for DC between CLS/UVA/GULC?Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 12:15 pmMuch better to be at UVA for DC. GULC is better only if you have high grades at both.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 11:52 amCLS grad who worked as a litigator at one of W&C/WH/Covington in DC. Obviously it is easier to get from HYS, and DC is more competitive than NYC (where anyone in the class can get biglaw if they interview OK), but hard disagree that it is better to be at “UVA/GULC.” Lots of Columbia grads are at DC firms doing litigation, and there is variation below the most selective firms for people with middling grades who are committed to the DC market.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 8:40 pmNew York: Good.
DC: Not so good. Better to be at UVA/GULC/HYS.
Experiences vary but which firms are you all at? Understand there aren’t many CLS litigators in DC but why hide behind three firms?Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 12:15 pmMuch better to be at UVA for DC. GULC is better only if you have high grades at both.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 11:52 amCLS grad who worked as a litigator at one of W&C/WH/Covington in DC. Obviously it is easier to get from HYS, and DC is more competitive than NYC (where anyone in the class can get biglaw if they interview OK), but hard disagree that it is better to be at “UVA/GULC.” Lots of Columbia grads are at DC firms doing litigation, and there is variation below the most selective firms for people with middling grades who are committed to the DC market.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 8:40 pmNew York: Good.
DC: Not so good. Better to be at UVA/GULC/HYS.
I’m the poster who I’m assuming this is responding to. The raw number of people who are working in that market is not correlated to the odds of landing a job in large firm litigation in that market. By your reasoning, GULC would also substantially out-punch YLS and Stanford. Moreover, the ABA data does not tell us which of those GULC grads obtained offers at DC firms, only that they stuck around in a legal position in some capacity.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Apr 26, 2023 3:12 pmExperiences vary but which firms are you all at? Understand there aren’t many CLS litigators in DC but why hide behind three firms?Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 12:15 pmMuch better to be at UVA for DC. GULC is better only if you have high grades at both.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 11:52 amCLS grad who worked as a litigator at one of W&C/WH/Covington in DC. Obviously it is easier to get from HYS, and DC is more competitive than NYC (where anyone in the class can get biglaw if they interview OK), but hard disagree that it is better to be at “UVA/GULC.” Lots of Columbia grads are at DC firms doing litigation, and there is variation below the most selective firms for people with middling grades who are committed to the DC market.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 8:40 pmNew York: Good.
DC: Not so good. Better to be at UVA/GULC/HYS.
The ABA stats are more than a little slanted away from CLS:
2022 graduates going to DC:
Gtown: 260
UVA: 88
CLS: 27
2022 graduates going to NYC:
CLS: 299
Gtown: 170
UVA: 64
Yeah, Gtown is bigger and 2022 was a good year but this trend happens decades after decade.
From a current 2L at a T6 (pre-whatever the new rankings are), I faced significant skepticism from lower to mid ranked firms in DC as an out-of-town law student with good grades but without a specific interest in, for example, international trade law. I don't think it's easier to get Wilmer DC from GULC than CLS, but I do think it's easier for a GULC student to get a spot a a smaller, lower-ranked office that only has 5-10 summers in DC. Those firms seem to focus on local schools for DC. The question was not centered on "elite" firms but litigation in DC broadly, and some people have geographic preferences where they would prefer any DC firm over higher ranked NY firms.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Apr 26, 2023 4:49 pmI’m the poster who I’m assuming this is responding to. The raw number of people who are working in that market is not correlated to the odds of landing a job in large firm litigation in that market. By your reasoning, GULC would also substantially out-punch YLS and Stanford. Moreover, the ABA data does not tell us which of those GULC grads obtained offers at DC firms, only that they stuck around in a legal position in some capacity.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Apr 26, 2023 3:12 pmExperiences vary but which firms are you all at? Understand there aren’t many CLS litigators in DC but why hide behind three firms?Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 12:15 pmMuch better to be at UVA for DC. GULC is better only if you have high grades at both.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Apr 24, 2023 11:52 amCLS grad who worked as a litigator at one of W&C/WH/Covington in DC. Obviously it is easier to get from HYS, and DC is more competitive than NYC (where anyone in the class can get biglaw if they interview OK), but hard disagree that it is better to be at “UVA/GULC.” Lots of Columbia grads are at DC firms doing litigation, and there is variation below the most selective firms for people with middling grades who are committed to the DC market.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Apr 23, 2023 8:40 pmNew York: Good.
DC: Not so good. Better to be at UVA/GULC/HYS.
The ABA stats are more than a little slanted away from CLS:
2022 graduates going to DC:
Gtown: 260
UVA: 88
CLS: 27
2022 graduates going to NYC:
CLS: 299
Gtown: 170
UVA: 64
Yeah, Gtown is bigger and 2022 was a good year but this trend happens decades after decade.
I’m not sure what you think I am “hiding behind,” but to make it expressly clear and at the risk of being somewhat pedantic, I included the fact that I worked (and participated in recruiting at) one of the more selective DC firms because I can extrapolate from that experience what hiring looks like and how these schools are perceived relative to each other at firms generally. And I’m telling you, from the anecdotal yet broad experience of myself and my peers, elite DC firms will dig deeper into the class at somewhere like Columbia than at Georgetown. I’ve been in the position of comparing resumes and transcripts from the schools side by side. That’s what we’re talking about when we are comparing which school makes it “easier” to get DC.