Hit billable target, but partial bonus Forum

[Anonymous User]

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[Anonymous User]

Has any of you ever heard of anyone at a billable target firm that didn't get a full market bonus despite hitting their firm's billable target?

Didn't Shearman do that this year?

At my firm you can get docked if you take too long to release your time, but everyone knows in advance if they are going to get hit by that.

[Anonymous User]

Deleted.

[Anonymous User]

Has any of you ever heard of anyone at a billable target firm that didn't get a full market bonus despite hitting their firm's billable target?

Didn't Shearman do that this year?

At my firm you can get docked if you take too long to release your time, but everyone knows in advance if they are going to get hit by that.

OP here. I'm not at Shearman, but based on what I read on ATL, Shearman has never had a formal billable target until last year when the firm announced one all of a sudden in December.

I'm referring to the ones with formal targets. Think Latham, Skadden, White & Case, Ropes, etc.

Okay, that point wasn't in your original post, but thanks for clarifying. Sorry I provided you relevant information.

I don't have examples from the list you provided, but there's probably something else at play here (ATL would have definitely covered other firms docking large swaths of associates for no reason). What was your review like? Is your practice group slowing down?

Have you thought about casually asking HR about the reason your bonus was lower than market? They could have made a mistake and miscalculated your hours.

[Anonymous User]

Deleted.

[Anonymous User]

Op can you disclose the firm? It's pretty important helpful info for the rest of and anon posting just the firm name will hardly risk doxxing you.

I think there are some firms that have two targets, a general bonus eligibility and a higher target for full market bonus. But those firms are usually not in the V20. There's also nothing requiring each firm to match top of the market bonuses, but it would be sleazy to pretend they do then pull back from some.

[Anonymous User]

Has any of you ever heard of anyone at a billable target firm that didn't get a full market bonus despite hitting their firm's billable target?

Didn't Shearman do that this year?

At my firm you can get docked if you take too long to release your time, but everyone knows in advance if they are going to get hit by that.

OP here. I'm not at Shearman, but based on what I read on ATL, Shearman has never had a formal billable target until last year when the firm announced one all of a sudden in December.

I'm referring to the ones with formal targets. Think Latham, Skadden, White & Case, Ropes, etc.

Okay, that point wasn't in your original post, but thanks for clarifying. Sorry I provided you relevant information.

I don't have examples from the list you provided, but there's probably something else at play here (ATL would have definitely covered other firms docking large swaths of associates for no reason). What was your review like? Is your practice group slowing down?

Have you thought about casually asking HR about the reason your bonus was lower than market? They could have made a mistake and miscalculated your hours.

OP. Actually my firm hasn't yet issued bonus letters and so I haven't been paid yet. I met my target but this year my firm's HR has been telling associates that even for those that met their target, full market bonus is not guaranteed and that ultimately it's up to their performance reviews and the discretion of the partners. I didn't have to worry about this at all in previous years, but this year I'm a little concerned and confused. Why have a target in the first place if they are going to emphasize discretion?

To be clear, bonuses are not deferred compensation. I'm 99% sure that you won't find a single firm that has "you get market bonus if you hit these hours, end of story" written into their bonus policy. They all have wiggle room, the question is whether they decide to buck the trend and exercise it.

Re: the bolded, as a lawyer, I'm sure you're familiar with the concept of necessary but not sufficient.

[Anonymous User]

OP - if your firm is one that has a written bonus memo requirement, you legitimately have met the hours listed in the bonus memo for your class year, and you are still being told you won't get the full relevant bonus, you need to out the firm here (you can post anonymously).

[Anonymous User]

Out the firm anyway! Good to know who pays below market bonus.

[objctnyrhnr]

OP, if this wasn’t an error by the firm, this isn’t good. And I don’t mean for the firm; I mean for you. (Also shady of firm but that’s not purpose of this post.)

To the extent not already said, I would be looking to lateral, go in house, whatever asap.

To be clear: I’m not saying it means you will be laid off. What I am saying is that if layoffs (or even soft pushes) come, you are in the splash zone.

[Anonymous User]

Deleted.

[Anonymous User]

OP, if this wasn’t an error by the firm, this isn’t good. And I don’t mean for the firm; I mean for you. (Also shady of firm but that’s not purpose of this post.)

To the extent not already said, I would be looking to lateral, go in house, whatever asap.

To be clear: I’m not saying it means you will be laid off. What I am saying is that if layoffs (or even soft pushes) come, you are in the splash zone.

OP here. The firm pays out bonuses this month and will send out bonus letters probably next week. So we will see. Sorry for being unclear in my post. Nothing has actually happened yet. Just concerned.

The firm has been cheap in other ways in the past too. I'm so sick and tired of this firm.

TBH based on the timing of bonus announcements (very few announce in February), you've basically outed the firm. Is it Cooley? Just tell us so we can shame them and direct naïve rising 2Ls elsewhere.

[Anonymous User]

Deleted.

[CanadianWolf]

OP: By revealing the firm prior to formal bonus announcement, you might shame them into paying the full bonus.

[12YrsAnAssociate]

I think there's a chance that OP might be overreacting. Every firm I've ever been at gave themselves wiggle room to not pay full market bonuses if they didn't want to, and I'm not aware of a single instance when that actually happened. I think OP needs to wait to get the bonus memo/hear if his or her colleagues received the full market bonus and then go from there.

[jbagelboy]

It goes routinely underacknowledged on this forum (but is widely known in practice) that "market"-paying firms frequently gyp their associates on bonuses, even occasionally for associates that meet billable-hour minimums. Sometimes there is an explanation specific to the associate, and other times, it's just economics/greed. In response to the posters that say that they are "not aware" of any instances of firms not paying full market bonuses, your friends and former classmates are either ashamed and not disclosing it or you haven't asked them.

[Anonymous User]

I think there's a chance that OP might be overreacting. Every firm I've ever been at gave themselves wiggle room to not pay full market bonuses if they didn't want to, and I'm not aware of a single instance when that actually happened. I think OP needs to wait to get the bonus memo/hear if his or her colleagues received the full market bonus and then go from there.

But see Shearman, which is definitely just a dumpster fire and not really how things normally happen.

[12YrsAnAssociate]

I think there's a chance that OP might be overreacting. Every firm I've ever been at gave themselves wiggle room to not pay full market bonuses if they didn't want to, and I'm not aware of a single instance when that actually happened. I think OP needs to wait to get the bonus memo/hear if his or her colleagues received the full market bonus and then go from there.

But see Shearman, which is definitely just a dumpster fire and not really how things normally happen.

In fairness, I'm not aware of what's going on at Shearman, and to Bagel Boy's point, I've never asked anyone if they received a full bonus, though I think I would probably hear about it if a colleague I was close with got screwed. My only point is, maybe OP is getting all worked up and this is a nothingburger, and I don't think OP will know until the bonus memos go out.

[RedNewJersey]

Yeah, this seems premature to me. Of course *HR* is going to say "who knows, you need to be in good standing, the partners could change their mind" etc. That is all formally correct, and not overpromising is sort of their job. But in practice, firms pay bonuses because of social and market pressures, not because they promised to do so in a binding policy somewhere. They won't deviate without good reason because it would really hurt their recruiting, but HR obviously can't say "I'm sure you'll get it because otherwise we'd be screwed next year."

[Anonymous User]

OP, if this wasn’t an error by the firm, this isn’t good. And I don’t mean for the firm; I mean for you. (Also shady of firm but that’s not purpose of this post.)

To the extent not already said, I would be looking to lateral, go in house, whatever asap.

To be clear: I’m not saying it means you will be laid off. What I am saying is that if layoffs (or even soft pushes) come, you are in the splash zone.

OP here. The firm pays out bonuses this month and will send out bonus letters probably next week. So we will see. Sorry for being unclear in my post. Nothing has actually happened yet. Just concerned.

The firm has been cheap in other ways in the past too. I'm so sick and tired of this firm.

TBH based on the timing of bonus announcements (very few announce in February), you've basically outed the firm. Is it Cooley? Just tell us so we can shame them and direct naïve rising 2Ls elsewhere.

Not Cooley. Let's see what happens.

How long have you been at the firm? It seems as though you may be catastrophizing without basis to do so.

[Anonymous User]

I think there's a chance that OP might be overreacting. Every firm I've ever been at gave themselves wiggle room to not pay full market bonuses if they didn't want to, and I'm not aware of a single instance when that actually happened. I think OP needs to wait to get the bonus memo/hear if his or her colleagues received the full market bonus and then go from there.

But see Shearman, which is definitely just a dumpster fire and not really how things normally happen.

In fairness, I'm not aware of what's going on at Shearman, and to Bagel Boy's point, I've never asked anyone if they received a full bonus, though I think I would probably hear about it if a colleague I was close with got screwed. My only point is, maybe OP is getting all worked up and this is a nothingburger, and I don't think OP will know until the bonus memos go out.

Shearman controversy was effectively: Previously had no official billable target for bonuses, most got full bonus after like ~1800+ hrs. Came out with a new bonus policy and they repeatedly said only applied for next year, not current year. New policy had a formal hour requirement now (2050 with some pro bono hours required/allowed). When it came to paying 2022 bonuses, however, they effectively applied the new 2023 policy onto everyone early and/or came up with other excuses like utilization rates to stiff basically everyone but the superstar associates into getting 0-75% of market bonuses for their class year. No warning from any partners that anyone was in danger of not receiving their full bonuses, including for people who billed close to the new targets.

[12YrsAnAssociate]

Shearman controversy was effectively: Previously had no official billable target for bonuses, most got full bonus after like ~1800+ hrs. Came out with a new bonus policy and they repeatedly said only applied for next year, not current year. New policy had a formal hour requirement now (2050 with some pro bono hours required/allowed). When it came to paying 2022 bonuses, however, they effectively applied the new 2023 policy onto everyone early and/or came up with other excuses like utilization rates to stiff basically everyone but the superstar associates into getting 0-75% of market bonuses for their class year. No warning from any partners that anyone was in danger of not receiving their full bonuses, including for people who billed close to the new targets.

Wow. That's nuts. I can't believe Shearman thought that was a good idea.

[Anonymous User]

Deleted.

[Anonymous User]

OP here. Firm issued bonus letters today. I'm getting a partial bonus that's less than 50% of full market bonus despite having billed above the firm's target. Some colleagues that billed close to but not above the target are getting full bonuses.

Absolutely gutted and demoralized. I even felt like rage quitting. I worked so hard and pulled many all nighters in the office, mostly alone. At one point last year, I had billed over 250 hours for several consecutive months (with some 300 hour months) and even gained weight after drinking or eating too much at odd hours at night. I no longer feel like working for this firm.

The firm's a V20 overseas satellite office. I'm a midlevel/senior. I do know that the firm's trying to push me out even though the partner that I work for has been saying otherwise. I've started looking.

OP - really sorry to hear this. It sounds like you've given it your all, and you should be proud of that. Some things are just out of your control, including politics or office downsizing, either or both of which might be at play here. Don't take it personally - keep your head up and you'll end up on top somehow!

A few things. First, the overseas portion is definitely relevant. Lots of firms pay US market abroad, but it's less consistent. You might have received more targeted advice had you mentioned that up front.

Second, you might consider talking to that partner about your bonus to see if they have any advice. It's a delicate subject, and I wouldn't outright say "do you know about this? what gives? could I have more?" Instead, you might phrase it as "I like working with you and as you saw I worked hard last year, so I was somewhat taken aback by receiving half market bonus. Do you have any advice on what I can do to improve this year to improve and avoid that happening again?" If the partner knew you were going to get docked this probably won't help much, but if the partner didn't and has any sway and see you as an asset they may try to do something about it. Worth a shot, especially if you're already looking elsewhere, right?

Third, it's a long shot, but a look at your firm's official bonus policy. I'm 99% sure it's filled with discretionary language, but who knows.

[Anonymous User]

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