Things To Know Before Going In-House Forum

[Anonymous User]

5th year in corp/M&A (two firms in my career - V5 major market and AmLaw 50 secondary market where I’m currently at, T14 grad and now living back in my hometown) that’s hit the wall and decided I’m leaving biglaw as soon as I can.

Would love to hear some anecdotes about dos/dont’s from people who have run for the exit as well, but wanted to also know if there are any rules of thumb for what positions are/are not worth applying to (e.g., if there’s an opening that’s looking for 7+ years experience, is that even worth submitting an app for)? Feels like things move a lot slower in house as far application process goes and I know market conditions likely aren’t helping, but I need to leave as soon as I find something fairly legit so any advice would be appreciated!

[Anonymous User]

Basically in the same boat.

I took a pretty good look at going in house before I switched to my current firm, and one frustration I’m facing is that I’m being offered similar roles and comp to when I looked with 3-3.5 years of experience.

Fortunately, I’m now getting some traction on jobs that call for 7-10 years experience, but I can tell I’m going to have to be patient to get an AGC job instead of a meh counsel or senior counsel job. So I’d say apply for the reasonable reach roles and also be prepared for the search to take longer than just November-January. I understand the impulse to just take the first okay offer. But I’m finding 1 in 10 jobs has a base salary over $275k while 8 in 10 are under $225k so it can literally pay to be selective and patient. My other advice is don’t undersell your experience or ability to handle responsibilities that aren’t directly in your wheelhouse—in-house recruiters try to find 100% matches for the job description so assure them you can do it all or at least know which way is up on something you haven’t really done.

[persia1921]

Above response is definitely credited. Patients is key if you want a higher level role.

I would not hesitate in applying to roles that are asking for more experience, I know plenty of folks who landed gigs with 3+ years less experience than what was being asked for.

Titles are also tricky in house and can mean different things at different companies. Some companies have several ACGs for example, and I know at least one “Senior Counsel” earning close to $400K that reports directly to the GC.

FWIW my impression of the market right now (from talking to several folks with 5 years big law experience) is that base salary is around $210-$230 with total comp around $280-300K. If you land on the higher end of that range you are doing well. There are definitely positions that will pay more (think $400k total comp) but they are few and far between and you might end up waiting a long time to see one.

[Anonymous User]

Before taking a role, intimately understand how promotion works and who decides. If your client/direct manager rotates, what does that mean for your trajectory and promotion timeline? I did not. Do not be me. Also, apply for the role even if you don't hit YOE's--if your experience matches you'll be surprised what you can get. Negotiate your title if possible--for most FAANGs this isn't an option but for smaller companies it certain is.

I was burnt out in 2020 and took the first offer and I'm now headed back to a firm. Take your time. Patience pays off in the in-house search.

[Anonymous User]

This is all super helpful info — will definitely be applying to some places where they’re asking for 7+ years, but where are people finding these jobs generally? I’ve been searching goinhouse.com and legal.io often but seems like there may be other ways to find openings? I’d jump ship tomorrow for a $225K base with an actual difference in work/life balance…

[Anonymous User]

This is all super helpful info — will definitely be applying to some places where they’re asking for 7+ years, but where are people finding these jobs generally? I’ve been searching goinhouse.com and legal.io often but seems like there may be other ways to find openings? I’d jump ship tomorrow for a $225K base with an actual difference in work/life balance…

There is also a lot of stuff posted on LinkedIn - just search "counsel" or "legal counsel" in your market. The alternative is unfortunately networking - although I had recruiters I'd used previously who would send me stuff as soon as they got it, which helps. It really just sucks and moves slowly.

On the comp stuff, there is an entire thread on TLS that can give you some goalposts. You should also search on the fishbowl app for comp threads. It's all over the place. As a general rule, the best salaries are at funds and in tech.

[existentialcrisis]

This is all super helpful info — will definitely be applying to some places where they’re asking for 7+ years, but where are people finding these jobs generally? I’ve been searching goinhouse.com and legal.io often but seems like there may be other ways to find openings? I’d jump ship tomorrow for a $225K base with an actual difference in work/life balance…

There is also a lot of stuff posted on LinkedIn - just search "counsel" or "legal counsel" in your market. The alternative is unfortunately networking - although I had recruiters I'd used previously who would send me stuff as soon as they got it, which helps. It really just sucks and moves slowly.

On the comp stuff, there is an entire thread on TLS that can give you some goalposts. You should also search on the fishbowl app for comp threads. It's all over the place. As a general rule, the best salaries are at funds and in tech.

Yeah, this. Set a LinkedIn alert and it will send you the new postings in your market that come up daily.

[Anonymous User]

Patience is key. I looked for in house jobs in funds for over a year. During that time I received a number of offers I rejected due to comp, hours or role not being a fit. I sourced jobs from LinkedIn, Google job searches, recruiters, clients, and friends in the industry. It was a grinding process so I recommend starting early in the year, especially if you are somewhere that has an hours requirement. I had to make hours after assuming I was leaving for 5 months and interviewing every week.

Agreed with you and others that there are lots of roles out there looking for 3-4 years and there’s a big gap between those and the 7-10 year jobs. I rarely saw jobs for 5-6 years experience. I would really try to get a more senior role. In house tends to be less hierarchical and you won’t move up or receive routine raises the way you do in biglaw. It pays to take a more senior job with better comp even if you wait a while to find it.

[nealric]

Patience is key. I looked for in house jobs in funds for over a year. During that time I received a number of offers I rejected due to comp, hours or role not being a fit. I sourced jobs from LinkedIn, Google job searches, recruiters, clients, and friends in the industry. It was a grinding process so I recommend starting early in the year, especially if you are somewhere that has an hours requirement. I had to make hours after assuming I was leaving for 5 months and interviewing every week.

Agreed with you and others that there are lots of roles out there looking for 3-4 years and there’s a big gap between those and the 7-10 year jobs. I rarely saw jobs for 5-6 years experience. I would really try to get a more senior role. In house tends to be less hierarchical and you won’t move up or receive routine raises the way you do in biglaw. It pays to take a more senior job with better comp even if you wait a while to find it.

I'd also echo the patience part. It took me 8 months to find my in-house job. It's a lot more complicated than a biglaw lateral unless you just get lucky. I know people who took mediocre to poor in-house jobs, and those people are more likely to be unhappy with their decision to leave biglaw. A couple of guideposts (just from my observations):

1) Try to avoid jobs at a subsidiary of a larger company, especially if the head office is abroad. You will be far away from the power center, and more likely to be viewed as expendable by the decisionmakers.

2) Try to avoid jobs at a private-equity owned/backed companies. PE firms are always looking for an eventual exit, and you probably won't fit into those exit plans.

3) Try to find a job that has as much exposure at the senior levels (C-suite, GC, SVPs, etc.) as possible. If you have a role that's just reviewing contracts or handling cases for a business sub-unit, it will be difficult to get any visibility and you will likewise be viewed as more expendable.

[jhett]

Copied from one of my old responses in an in-house thread:

You really need to vet in-house positions well before joining. In-house departments range from well-oiled machine to complete shitshow. I would ask questions about retention (and where people who have left gone), upward mobility, why the position is open, how the department is organized and makes decisions, how the department interacts with the rest of the company, etc. These factors matter just as much as the substantive work you'll be doing.

[Anonymous User]

Took me 10 months and just shy of 100 apps to land two offers. I agree with others that it can pay to be patient, but it's tough to be patient with a hit rate like mine.

[Anonymous User]

Took me 10 months and just shy of 100 apps to land two offers. I agree with others that it can pay to be patient, but it's tough to be patient with a hit rate like mine.

Sounds like my hit rate, only better. I'm 0 for 50+ in terms of offers. Currently not looking but will crank up the machine again early next year.