Kirkland Megathread Forum

[Anonymous User]

Has anyone successfully lateraled to KE with less than 1 year of experience?

[Anonymous User]

is the new chicago office building going to still have free food for breakfast and lunch, and a bar in the building?

[Anonymous User]

How are bonuses calculated for laterals that start in the middle of a year?

[Anonymous User]

is the new chicago office building going to still have free food for breakfast and lunch, and a bar in the building?

Rumor is new office is going to have a full service spa staffed with service partners. Everything will be on the menu. *Everything.*

[Anonymous User]

is the new chicago office building going to still have free food for breakfast and lunch, and a bar in the building?

Rumor is new office is going to have a full service spa staffed with service partners. Everything will be on the menu. *Everything.*

I just placed an order for Sashimi Jon Ballis Nyotaimori

[Anonymous User]

Has anyone successfully lateraled to KE with less than 1 year of experience?

Given the rumors of layoffs, would you want to?

[Anonymous User]

Has anyone successfully lateraled to KE with less than 1 year of experience?

Given the rumors of layoffs, would you want to?

What are the rumors? Actual layoffs? Or just a culling come review time?

[Anonymous User]

is the new chicago office building going to still have free food for breakfast and lunch, and a bar in the building?

Rumor is new office is going to have a full service spa staffed with service partners. Everything will be on the menu. *Everything.*

I just placed an order for Sashimi Jon Ballis Nyotaimori

I vomited in my mouth a little but I remain intrigued. I'll try it.

[Anonymous User]

Has anyone successfully lateraled to KE with less than 1 year of experience?

Given the rumors of layoffs, would you want to?

What are the rumors? Actual layoffs? Or just a culling come review time?

I have not heard rumors of any layoffs - and no one has left recently. Sure, they might trim the fat come review time, but I don't think it will be anything crazy?

[Anonymous User]

Has anyone successfully lateraled to KE with less than 1 year of experience?

Given the rumors of layoffs, would you want to?

What are the rumors? Actual layoffs? Or just a culling come review time?

I have not heard rumors of any layoffs - and no one has left recently. Sure, they might trim the fat come review time, but I don't think it will be anything crazy?

Sorry, not necessarily layoffs, but stealthing etc.

viewtopic.php?f=23&t=313376
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=312738
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=313242

See also fishbowl

[Ultramar vistas]

Has anyone successfully lateraled to KE with less than 1 year of experience?

Given the rumors of layoffs, would you want to?

What are the rumors? Actual layoffs? Or just a culling come review time?

I have not heard rumors of any layoffs - and no one has left recently. Sure, they might trim the fat come review time, but I don't think it will be anything crazy?

Sorry, not necessarily layoffs, but stealthing etc.

viewtopic.php?f=23&t=313376
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=312738
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=313242

See also fishbowl

Literally the first two links you posted reference a V40 and a lateral from a V5 to a V25, neither of which can be Kirkland. The third is mostly rumors about Goodwin? Idk why you are linking those threads to Kirkland when they are clearly not about that firm.

[Anonymous User]

Has anyone successfully lateraled to KE with less than 1 year of experience?

Given the rumors of layoffs, would you want to?

What are the rumors? Actual layoffs? Or just a culling come review time?

I have not heard rumors of any layoffs - and no one has left recently. Sure, they might trim the fat come review time, but I don't think it will be anything crazy?

Sorry, not necessarily layoffs, but stealthing etc.

viewtopic.php?f=23&t=313376
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=312738
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=313242

See also fishbowl

Literally the first two links you posted reference a V40 and a lateral from a V5 to a V25, neither of which can be Kirkland. The third is mostly rumors about Goodwin? Idk why you are linking those threads to Kirkland when they are clearly not about that firm.

Because people love stirring up shit about Kirkland, and it’s very easy to do in anonymous forums like here and Fishbowl. To be fair, people love anonymously stirring up shit in general, but Kirkland is probably the most popular target.

[Anonymous User]

Has anyone successfully lateraled to KE with less than 1 year of experience?

Given the rumors of layoffs, would you want to?

What are the rumors? Actual layoffs? Or just a culling come review time?

I have not heard rumors of any layoffs - and no one has left recently. Sure, they might trim the fat come review time, but I don't think it will be anything crazy?

Sorry, not necessarily layoffs, but stealthing etc.

viewtopic.php?f=23&t=313376
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=312738
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=313242

See also fishbowl

Literally the first two links you posted reference a V40 and a lateral from a V5 to a V25, neither of which can be Kirkland. The third is mostly rumors about Goodwin? Idk why you are linking those threads to Kirkland when they are clearly not about that firm.

Because people love stirring up shit about Kirkland, and it’s very easy to do in anonymous forums like here and Fishbowl. To be fair, people love anonymously stirring up shit in general, but Kirkland is probably the most popular target.

All fair points. Having said that, do I think it's a reasonable inference that the legions of midlaw laterals and TTT grads we casually hired over the last 30 months so we could load up with lucrative SPAC and M&A work might be on the chopping block come annual review time now that things are looking more "normal?" Yes. Was everyone and their brother predicting that exactly that would happen back when the firm went on its hiring spree to juice profits during COVID? Yes. Would it probably make sense to cull the herd for the long run health of the firm? Arguably, yes.

So I think the rumors about KE, to the extent they're out there, are also based on rationally reading the tea leaves that are available (plus, as you point out, a healthy dose of spite). If I'm one of those "new recruits" who came over spring '21 to spam SPAC work I'm not exactly feeling confident right now. Having said all that, I haven't heard a peep of actionable information that any of that is actually going to happen, so who the hell knows; maybe the relevant transactional practices love having this huge army of available associates now and don't care about the short term profit dip if they're idle for a few months.

[Anonymous User]

I can't believe I'm chiming in here in favor of K&E, but I highly doubt the firm will show new laterals the door. K&E's growth model has been built on gobbling up other attorneys - they depend on people wanting to lateral. Looking from the outside in, K&E is remarkably strategic for its size, so I doubt they would risk throwing a wrench in their growth model just because they over-hired a bit. At most, I'd expect to see forced practice group changes to spread the work more evenly.

[Anonymous User]

Given the rumors of layoffs, would you want to?

What are the rumors? Actual layoffs? Or just a culling come review time?

I have not heard rumors of any layoffs - and no one has left recently. Sure, they might trim the fat come review time, but I don't think it will be anything crazy?

Sorry, not necessarily layoffs, but stealthing etc.

viewtopic.php?f=23&t=313376
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=312738
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=313242

See also fishbowl

Literally the first two links you posted reference a V40 and a lateral from a V5 to a V25, neither of which can be Kirkland. The third is mostly rumors about Goodwin? Idk why you are linking those threads to Kirkland when they are clearly not about that firm.

Because people love stirring up shit about Kirkland, and it’s very easy to do in anonymous forums like here and Fishbowl. To be fair, people love anonymously stirring up shit in general, but Kirkland is probably the most popular target.

All fair points. Having said that, do I think it's a reasonable inference that the legions of midlaw laterals and TTT grads we casually hired over the last 30 months so we could load up with lucrative SPAC and M&A work might be on the chopping block come annual review time now that things are looking more "normal?" Yes. Was everyone and their brother predicting that exactly that would happen back when the firm went on its hiring spree to juice profits during COVID? Yes. Would it probably make sense to cull the herd for the long run health of the firm? Arguably, yes.

So I think the rumors about KE, to the extent they're out there, are also based on rationally reading the tea leaves that are available (plus, as you point out, a healthy dose of spite). If I'm one of those "new recruits" who came over spring '21 to spam SPAC work I'm not exactly feeling confident right now. Having said all that, I haven't heard a peep of actionable information that any of that is actually going to happen, so who the hell knows; maybe the relevant transactional practices love having this huge army of available associates now and don't care about the short term profit dip if they're idle for a few months.

Yeah - interesting to speculate about. If KE can always have availability to capture ALL of the work, then they will capture more market share etc. So maybe it does make sense to leave ppl on board.

On the other hand, KE furiously hired underqualified associates in a rando secondary market. Does KE really intend to keep them on during a downturn? Or was its rationale for hiring randos in a rando market that maybe it can as easily drop these associates as it picked them up, with little to no hit to reputation?

I hope the former is KE's approach.

[Anonymous User]

What are the rumors? Actual layoffs? Or just a culling come review time?

I have not heard rumors of any layoffs - and no one has left recently. Sure, they might trim the fat come review time, but I don't think it will be anything crazy?

Sorry, not necessarily layoffs, but stealthing etc.

viewtopic.php?f=23&t=313376
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=312738
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=313242

See also fishbowl

Literally the first two links you posted reference a V40 and a lateral from a V5 to a V25, neither of which can be Kirkland. The third is mostly rumors about Goodwin? Idk why you are linking those threads to Kirkland when they are clearly not about that firm.

Because people love stirring up shit about Kirkland, and it’s very easy to do in anonymous forums like here and Fishbowl. To be fair, people love anonymously stirring up shit in general, but Kirkland is probably the most popular target.

All fair points. Having said that, do I think it's a reasonable inference that the legions of midlaw laterals and TTT grads we casually hired over the last 30 months so we could load up with lucrative SPAC and M&A work might be on the chopping block come annual review time now that things are looking more "normal?" Yes. Was everyone and their brother predicting that exactly that would happen back when the firm went on its hiring spree to juice profits during COVID? Yes. Would it probably make sense to cull the herd for the long run health of the firm? Arguably, yes.

So I think the rumors about KE, to the extent they're out there, are also based on rationally reading the tea leaves that are available (plus, as you point out, a healthy dose of spite). If I'm one of those "new recruits" who came over spring '21 to spam SPAC work I'm not exactly feeling confident right now. Having said all that, I haven't heard a peep of actionable information that any of that is actually going to happen, so who the hell knows; maybe the relevant transactional practices love having this huge army of available associates now and don't care about the short term profit dip if they're idle for a few months.

Yeah - interesting to speculate about. If KE can always have availability to capture ALL of the work, then they will capture more market share etc. So maybe it does make sense to leave ppl on board.

On the other hand, KE furiously hired underqualified associates in a rando secondary market. Does KE really intend to keep them on during a downturn? Or was its rationale for hiring randos in a rando market that maybe it can as easily drop these associates as it picked them up, with little to no hit to reputation?

I hope the former is KE's approach.

I’m at K&E. Totally agree with the theory that over hiring during a boom might end up with trimming when things slow down. Definitely fair to predict that and discuss the possibility. But I feel like some people out there are converting these theories into rumors that layoffs ARE happening, instead of predicting that they MIGHT happen, which is just irresponsible.

I’m personally super curious about the same dynamics you guys are talking about. My practice, in my office, is fucking slammed right now so I’m personally not concerned in the slightest. I’ve also heard from many sources that Funds is drowning in work firmwide, both from friends in the group and from senior leadership in my office saying they wished they had more bodies to throw at the group. However, some people on K&E Fishbowl in other practices in other offices have mentioned being slow and worrying about it, so it could be uneven across the firm.

Personally my theory is that any right-sizing will be minor, and that the compensating will instead come from smaller summer classes and tighter lateral criteria. The firm still seems to have a growth mindset and is building brand new office buildings in 4 different cities to house our growing footprint.

We’re profitable enough that cuts don’t need to be made for survival or to cover debts (we have none) - they would instead be done solely to keep PPP high, which obviously they might do. But partners taking a profit reduction now (by keeping everyone around) so they have capacity to reap bigger profits later is totally possible too. As opposed to being forced to cut people because of financial instability. Also, any firm like ours charging $700/hour for first years has a lot more leeway to keep folks with low hours since the profit margin on each associate is higher.

Then again, partner greed is a powerful force at any firm, so who knows for sure...

[Anonymous User]

I have not heard rumors of any layoffs - and no one has left recently. Sure, they might trim the fat come review time, but I don't think it will be anything crazy?

Sorry, not necessarily layoffs, but stealthing etc.

viewtopic.php?f=23&t=313376
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=312738
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=313242

See also fishbowl

Literally the first two links you posted reference a V40 and a lateral from a V5 to a V25, neither of which can be Kirkland. The third is mostly rumors about Goodwin? Idk why you are linking those threads to Kirkland when they are clearly not about that firm.

Because people love stirring up shit about Kirkland, and it’s very easy to do in anonymous forums like here and Fishbowl. To be fair, people love anonymously stirring up shit in general, but Kirkland is probably the most popular target.

All fair points. Having said that, do I think it's a reasonable inference that the legions of midlaw laterals and TTT grads we casually hired over the last 30 months so we could load up with lucrative SPAC and M&A work might be on the chopping block come annual review time now that things are looking more "normal?" Yes. Was everyone and their brother predicting that exactly that would happen back when the firm went on its hiring spree to juice profits during COVID? Yes. Would it probably make sense to cull the herd for the long run health of the firm? Arguably, yes.

So I think the rumors about KE, to the extent they're out there, are also based on rationally reading the tea leaves that are available (plus, as you point out, a healthy dose of spite). If I'm one of those "new recruits" who came over spring '21 to spam SPAC work I'm not exactly feeling confident right now. Having said all that, I haven't heard a peep of actionable information that any of that is actually going to happen, so who the hell knows; maybe the relevant transactional practices love having this huge army of available associates now and don't care about the short term profit dip if they're idle for a few months.

Yeah - interesting to speculate about. If KE can always have availability to capture ALL of the work, then they will capture more market share etc. So maybe it does make sense to leave ppl on board.

On the other hand, KE furiously hired underqualified associates in a rando secondary market. Does KE really intend to keep them on during a downturn? Or was its rationale for hiring randos in a rando market that maybe it can as easily drop these associates as it picked them up, with little to no hit to reputation?

I hope the former is KE's approach.

I’m at K&E. Totally agree with the theory that over hiring during a boom might end up with trimming when things slow down. Definitely fair to predict that and discuss the possibility. But I feel like some people out there are converting these theories into rumors that layoffs ARE happening, instead of predicting that they MIGHT happen, which is just irresponsible.

I’m personally super curious about the same dynamics you guys are talking about. My practice, in my office, is fucking slammed right now so I’m personally not concerned in the slightest. I’ve also heard from many sources that Funds is drowning in work firmwide, both from friends in the group and from senior leadership in my office saying they wished they had more bodies to throw at the group. However, some people on K&E Fishbowl in other practices in other offices have mentioned being slow and worrying about it, so it could be uneven across the firm.

Personally my theory is that any right-sizing will be minor, and that the compensating will instead come from smaller summer classes and tighter lateral criteria. The firm still seems to have a growth mindset and is building brand new office buildings in 4 different cities to house our growing footprint.

We’re profitable enough that cuts don’t need to be made for survival or to cover debts (we have none) - they would instead be done solely to keep PPP high, which obviously they might do. But partners taking a profit reduction now (by keeping everyone around) so they have capacity to reap bigger profits later is totally possible too. As opposed to being forced to cut people because of financial instability. Also, any firm like ours charging $700/hour for first years has a lot more leeway to keep folks with low hours since the profit margin on each associate is higher.

Then again, partner greed is a powerful force at any firm, so who knows for sure...

At KE the work very much trickles down. Assuming you are good, I imagine you are as busy as ever. I know the best associates were slammed with M&A in April 2020 even though M&A seemed to grind to a halt, while everyone else was twiddling their thumbs, getting staffed on RX. I understand that ppl are slow right now, which you may not be seeing because maybe you are the first phone call ppl make when a new deal comes in the door, or you have enough portcos going off to supplement your work.

[Anonymous User]

For people in RX, what is the expectation when RX is very slow? I was a summer in KE RX this year and felt a lot of people were very slow/didn't have much to do. Didn't come across anyone that was staffed on corporate matters because they were slow.

Just curious about how this plays out in terms of hitting 2000 hours and whether you're supposed to take the initiative to find hours elsewhere (in other groups) or if someone tells you when it's time to do that.

[Anonymous User]

For people in RX, what is the expectation when RX is very slow? I was a summer in KE RX this year and felt a lot of people were very slow/didn't have much to do. Didn't come across anyone that was staffed on corporate matters because they were slow.

Just curious about how this plays out in terms of hitting 2000 hours and whether you're supposed to take the initiative to find hours elsewhere (in other groups) or if someone tells you when it's time to do that.

The recent slow period was an anomaly. Some folks went on secondment, others were staffed on corp/funds/debt fin work. I did a ton of pro bono and some biz dev work.

I banged on every door I could, kept in touch with colleagues, went into the office every so often simply to get out of my house. The work simply wasn't there, and most folks are going to have a sizeable dip in hours.

Then the last week of June, everything hit at once--crypto cases, mass torts, some creditor-side work. Group has been cranking since.

In a typical workflow scenario, the group is typically fairly busy, and you'll have no issue hitting 2000.

[Anonymous User]

For people in RX, what is the expectation when RX is very slow? I was a summer in KE RX this year and felt a lot of people were very slow/didn't have much to do. Didn't come across anyone that was staffed on corporate matters because they were slow.

Just curious about how this plays out in terms of hitting 2000 hours and whether you're supposed to take the initiative to find hours elsewhere (in other groups) or if someone tells you when it's time to do that.

The recent slow period was an anomaly. Some folks went on secondment, others were staffed on corp/funds/debt fin work. I did a ton of pro bono and some biz dev work.

I banged on every door I could, kept in touch with colleagues, went into the office every so often simply to get out of my house. The work simply wasn't there, and most folks are going to have a sizeable dip in hours.

Then the last week of June, everything hit at once--crypto cases, mass torts, some creditor-side work. Group has been cranking since.

In a typical workflow scenario, the group is typically fairly busy, and you'll have no issue hitting 2000.

Thanks for the info. Forgive my inexperience but how do you know when it's slow enough for you to hit up corporate?

Do you ever worry about layoffs in RX? I know it's a counter cyclical practice but has there been an instance where things were too good for too long?

[thisismytlsuername]

For people in RX, what is the expectation when RX is very slow? I was a summer in KE RX this year and felt a lot of people were very slow/didn't have much to do. Didn't come across anyone that was staffed on corporate matters because they were slow.

Just curious about how this plays out in terms of hitting 2000 hours and whether you're supposed to take the initiative to find hours elsewhere (in other groups) or if someone tells you when it's time to do that.

The recent slow period was an anomaly. Some folks went on secondment, others were staffed on corp/funds/debt fin work. I did a ton of pro bono and some biz dev work.

I banged on every door I could, kept in touch with colleagues, went into the office every so often simply to get out of my house. The work simply wasn't there, and most folks are going to have a sizeable dip in hours.

Then the last week of June, everything hit at once--crypto cases, mass torts, some creditor-side work. Group has been cranking since.

In a typical workflow scenario, the group is typically fairly busy, and you'll have no issue hitting 2000.

Thanks for the info. Forgive my inexperience but how do you know when it's slow enough for you to hit up corporate?

Do you ever worry about layoffs in RX? I know it's a counter cyclical practice but has there been an instance where things were too good for too long?

Oh, don't worry, you'll know. Andy Calder will send out a firmwide email telling you to get off the gravy train and roll up your sleeves and get to work.

[Joachim2017]

Do you ever worry about layoffs in RX? I know it's a counter cyclical practice but has there been an instance where things were too good for too long?

Oh, don't worry, you'll know. Andy Calder will send out a firmwide email telling you to get off the gravy train and roll up your sleeves and get to work.

Andy Calder already moonlighting for Law.com with articles with headlines like, "Have Associates Become Too Entitled?"

https://www.law.com/2022/09/27/do-assoc ... 92-130284/

[Anonymous User]

For people in RX, what is the expectation when RX is very slow? I was a summer in KE RX this year and felt a lot of people were very slow/didn't have much to do. Didn't come across anyone that was staffed on corporate matters because they were slow.

Just curious about how this plays out in terms of hitting 2000 hours and whether you're supposed to take the initiative to find hours elsewhere (in other groups) or if someone tells you when it's time to do that.

The recent slow period was an anomaly. Some folks went on secondment, others were staffed on corp/funds/debt fin work. I did a ton of pro bono and some biz dev work.

I banged on every door I could, kept in touch with colleagues, went into the office every so often simply to get out of my house. The work simply wasn't there, and most folks are going to have a sizeable dip in hours.

Then the last week of June, everything hit at once--crypto cases, mass torts, some creditor-side work. Group has been cranking since.

In a typical workflow scenario, the group is typically fairly busy, and you'll have no issue hitting 2000.

Thanks for the info. Forgive my inexperience but how do you know when it's slow enough for you to hit up corporate?

Do you ever worry about layoffs in RX? I know it's a counter cyclical practice but has there been an instance where things were too good for too long?

In a typical scenario, it's never really slow enough, but during 2021 when the group/industry was slow, leadership was sure to communicate regarding the state of the market. I spoke to colleagues at other firms, FAs, and IBs, and all were going through the same thing.

Outside of the usual class departures, never been worried about layoffs. As long as we have a capitalist market, there will always be large ch 11 filings, and bankruptcy work isn't something that companies can bring in house.

[Anonymous User]

does rx really work harder than other groups? outside of the actual practice area and type of work you would do in rx, is there a benefit to choosing it over one of k&e's corporate groups? what is the culture like? A second year in the chi office mentioned it's the most pleasant group you can join at k&e in terms of personalities and culture/the people.

trying to get a sense of what you guys have to say since anonymous opinions can at times be more insightful.

[Anonymous User]

does rx really work harder than other groups? outside of the actual practice area and type of work you would do in rx, is there a benefit to choosing it over one of k&e's corporate groups? what is the culture like? A second year in the chi office mentioned it's the most pleasant group you can join at k&e in terms of personalities and culture/the people.

trying to get a sense of what you guys have to say since anonymous opinions can at times be more insightful.

LMFAO