Kirkland Megathread Forum

[Anonymous User]

If the firm gave you a crisp $100 bill for showing up in person each day, would you come in everyday?

No. The hour I would lose commuting is worth more than $100. Sure would be nice on the days I did come in, though.

[Anonymous User]

If the firm gave you a crisp $100 bill for showing up in person each day, would you come in everyday?

No. The hour I would lose commuting is worth more than $100. Sure would be nice on the days I did come in, though.

Jon, if you're listening, ignore this guy, I'd absolutely come in to the office for an extra $2,000 - $2,300 per month (just looked at a calendar), particularly if you made it post-tax and were reasonable about the time commitment (like in no later than 10, out no earlier than 4, and must be in the office at least 8 hours). Sign me up.

[Anonymous User]

Anyone able to give some information to a future SA in NY? At the end of the summer are you asked to rank your preference of practice area for a potential offer? Any insight on going in as corporate/transactional for the summer but switching over to lit or vice versa? I know the market obviously demands corporate folks - but is there any room to move or would it be unheard of in this market? I know someone asked something similar earlier this month, but just wanted to see if anyone had any more insight for a very nervous, somewhat introverted future SA. Thanks!

[Anonymous User]

Anyone able to give some information to a future SA in NY? At the end of the summer are you asked to rank your preference of practice area for a potential offer? Any insight on going in as corporate/transactional for the summer but switching over to lit or vice versa? I know the market obviously demands corporate folks - but is there any room to move or would it be unheard of in this market? I know someone asked something similar earlier this month, but just wanted to see if anyone had any more insight for a very nervous, somewhat introverted future SA. Thanks!

In my experience as a NY SA, you will have ample opportunity to explore both litigation and corporate. I would recommend that you express your interest in trying out both to Recruiting at the start of the summer. In addition, I would actively attend dinners and other events hosted by both litigation and corporate to get a feel of the culture of both groups. As your interest in one path or the other solidifies, I would recommend talking to a partner or two in that group expressing your interest.

As a fellow introvert, I know that attending social events and going to coffee chats with associates/partners sounds daunting but I promise you’ll find someone with a similar personality as you in whatever group you end up in.

To recap, so long as you’ve done some lit and corporate work throughout the summer, and you’ve gotten a chance to meet a partner or two on both sides and expressed your interest in the group that you like most, I think you should be okay! And again, it can’t hurt to check-in with Recruiting as the summer progresses. They want to make sure you choose KE as your full-time firm as much as you want to make sure you end up in the practice group that’s best for you.

[Anonymous User]

Realistically what would happen/how long could I last if I worked 1800-1900 billable hours at Kirkland? Not concerned about making partner or getting a big bonus or any bonus at all.

If closer to 1900 probably forever

[Anonymous User]

Anyone able to give some information to a future SA in NY? At the end of the summer are you asked to rank your preference of practice area for a potential offer? Any insight on going in as corporate/transactional for the summer but switching over to lit or vice versa? I know the market obviously demands corporate folks - but is there any room to move or would it be unheard of in this market? I know someone asked something similar earlier this month, but just wanted to see if anyone had any more insight for a very nervous, somewhat introverted future SA. Thanks!

In my experience as a NY SA, you will have ample opportunity to explore both litigation and corporate. I would recommend that you express your interest in trying out both to Recruiting at the start of the summer. In addition, I would actively attend dinners and other events hosted by both litigation and corporate to get a feel of the culture of both groups. As your interest in one path or the other solidifies, I would recommend talking to a partner or two in that group expressing your interest.

As a fellow introvert, I know that attending social events and going to coffee chats with associates/partners sounds daunting but I promise you’ll find someone with a similar personality as you in whatever group you end up in.

To recap, so long as you’ve done some lit and corporate work throughout the summer, and you’ve gotten a chance to meet a partner or two on both sides and expressed your interest in the group that you like most, I think you should be okay! And again, it can’t hurt to check-in with Recruiting as the summer progresses. They want to make sure you choose KE as your full-time firm as much as you want to make sure you end up in the practice group that’s best for you.

This was so helpful. Thank you so much!!

[Anonymous User]

Anyone able to give some information to a future SA in NY? At the end of the summer are you asked to rank your preference of practice area for a potential offer? Any insight on going in as corporate/transactional for the summer but switching over to lit or vice versa? I know the market obviously demands corporate folks - but is there any room to move or would it be unheard of in this market? I know someone asked something similar earlier this month, but just wanted to see if anyone had any more insight for a very nervous, somewhat introverted future SA. Thanks!

In my experience as a NY SA, you will have ample opportunity to explore both litigation and corporate. I would recommend that you express your interest in trying out both to Recruiting at the start of the summer. In addition, I would actively attend dinners and other events hosted by both litigation and corporate to get a feel of the culture of both groups. As your interest in one path or the other solidifies, I would recommend talking to a partner or two in that group expressing your interest.

As a fellow introvert, I know that attending social events and going to coffee chats with associates/partners sounds daunting but I promise you’ll find someone with a similar personality as you in whatever group you end up in.

To recap, so long as you’ve done some lit and corporate work throughout the summer, and you’ve gotten a chance to meet a partner or two on both sides and expressed your interest in the group that you like most, I think you should be okay! And again, it can’t hurt to check-in with Recruiting as the summer progresses. They want to make sure you choose KE as your full-time firm as much as you want to make sure you end up in the practice group that’s best for you.

This was so helpful. Thank you so much!!

I agree with the above, as someone that tried both during the summer and had the choice between them. They make you pick transactional vs. litigation when you accept your post-grad offer, though I know at least one person who made the switch as a first year (it’s just a question of the group you’re switching into approving it).

Once you start in either of those big buckets, you have no further restrictions in practice area for the first couple years. Transactional juniors can freely switch between M&A, Debt, CapM, etc. and litigators can freely switch between all sorts of cases. Around year 3 they push you to declare something more specific.

[Anonymous User]

Realistically what would happen/how long could I last if I worked 1800-1900 billable hours at Kirkland? Not concerned about making partner or getting a big bonus or any bonus at all.

If closer to 1900 probably forever

I've averaged about 1900 during my career here and they made me a real partner. YMMV

[Anonymous User]

Realistically what would happen/how long could I last if I worked 1800-1900 billable hours at Kirkland? Not concerned about making partner or getting a big bonus or any bonus at all.

If closer to 1900 probably forever

I've averaged about 1900 during my career here and they made me a real partner. YMMV

This one line anecdote is going to cause some people's eyes to bulge out lol

[Anonymous User]

Realistically what would happen/how long could I last if I worked 1800-1900 billable hours at Kirkland? Not concerned about making partner or getting a big bonus or any bonus at all.

If closer to 1900 probably forever

I've averaged about 1900 during my career here and they made me a real partner. YMMV

This one line anecdote is going to cause some people's eyes to bulge out lol

Maybe not crazy if in some specialized practice like ERISA or T&E or whatever? To the extent you can become a subject matter expert in a field few people can be bothered to specialize in, there is the potential to make it far on reasonable hours. That being said, don't expect to ever get a lot of shares.

[Anonymous User]

how many events should SAs expect per week? Does this differ based on location? I'll be at the Chicago office and I'm generally an introverted person. I feel a bit of anxiety around social outings/events and I'm trying to gauge how many I can expect to attend.

[Sackboy]

Maybe not crazy if in some specialized practice like ERISA or T&E or whatever? To the extent you can become a subject matter expert in a field few people can be bothered to specialize in, there is the potential to make it far on reasonable hours. That being said, don't expect to ever get a lot of shares.

David Handler is the only T&E share partner, and ERISA has no equity partners, so that's definitely not a thing. Exec Comp works like dogs too. This person got lucky and won the work lottery. Good for him or her.

[Anonymous User]

how many events should SAs expect per week? Does this differ based on location? I'll be at the Chicago office and I'm generally an introverted person. I feel a bit of anxiety around social outings/events and I'm trying to gauge how many I can expect to attend.

dw bro come and find me i’ll talk to you anytime

but i heard (precovid) it’d be lunch nearly every day and quite a few social events outside. if you count lunch i’d just say 3-6 a week would be a good guess

[Anonymous User]

How busy are your KE offices now that we’re in wk3 of rTo?

[Anonymous User]

how many events should SAs expect per week? Does this differ based on location? I'll be at the Chicago office and I'm generally an introverted person. I feel a bit of anxiety around social outings/events and I'm trying to gauge how many I can expect to attend.

dw bro come and find me i’ll talk to you anytime

but i heard (precovid) it’d be lunch nearly every day and quite a few social events outside. if you count lunch i’d just say 3-6 a week would be a good guess

Thanks for the info! Ah that sounds like a nightmare. Are the lunches usually group lunches or are we supposed to network and find people to go to lunch with?

Honestly I kind of wish this summer would take place entirely over zoom. But I'm sure it won't be as bad as I am fearing it will be.

[Anonymous User]

how many events should SAs expect per week? Does this differ based on location? I'll be at the Chicago office and I'm generally an introverted person. I feel a bit of anxiety around social outings/events and I'm trying to gauge how many I can expect to attend.

dw bro come and find me i’ll talk to you anytime

but i heard (precovid) it’d be lunch nearly every day and quite a few social events outside. if you count lunch i’d just say 3-6 a week would be a good guess

I feel like people are trickling in but it's not night and day. I'm still noticing a ton of people working remotely. I think the key to this happening (getting people to come in long term) is if it sustains. Attorneys are like lemmings in that way; if they see their colleagues doing something, they'll eventually do it themselves. If we don't do another COVID shut down then I think more and more people will head into the office over time although it'll probably never be like it was pre-COVID, but it'll at least feel like a decently full place rather than a ghost town.

[Anonymous User]

how many events should SAs expect per week? Does this differ based on location? I'll be at the Chicago office and I'm generally an introverted person. I feel a bit of anxiety around social outings/events and I'm trying to gauge how many I can expect to attend.

dw bro come and find me i’ll talk to you anytime

but i heard (precovid) it’d be lunch nearly every day and quite a few social events outside. if you count lunch i’d just say 3-6 a week would be a good guess

I feel like people are trickling in but it's not night and day. I'm still noticing a ton of people working remotely. I think the key to this happening (getting people to come in long term) is if it sustains. Attorneys are like lemmings in that way; if they see their colleagues doing something, they'll eventually do it themselves. If we don't do another COVID shut down then I think more and more people will head into the office over time although it'll probably never be like it was pre-COVID, but it'll at least feel like a decently full place rather than a ghost town.

Does anyone wear masks indoors (assuming the requirement has been lifted like in many places in Chicago). I don't think another shutdown is likely but I can see mask mandates coming back in Chicago if we move away from "low" transmission numbers.

[Anonymous User]

how many events should SAs expect per week? Does this differ based on location? I'll be at the Chicago office and I'm generally an introverted person. I feel a bit of anxiety around social outings/events and I'm trying to gauge how many I can expect to attend.

dw bro come and find me i’ll talk to you anytime

but i heard (precovid) it’d be lunch nearly every day and quite a few social events outside. if you count lunch i’d just say 3-6 a week would be a good guess

I feel like people are trickling in but it's not night and day. I'm still noticing a ton of people working remotely. I think the key to this happening (getting people to come in long term) is if it sustains. Attorneys are like lemmings in that way; if they see their colleagues doing something, they'll eventually do it themselves. If we don't do another COVID shut down then I think more and more people will head into the office over time although it'll probably never be like it was pre-COVID, but it'll at least feel like a decently full place rather than a ghost town.

Does anyone wear masks indoors (assuming the requirement has been lifted like in many places in Chicago). I don't think another shutdown is likely but I can see mask mandates coming back in Chicago if we move away from "low" transmission numbers.

I went to a visit day last summer after accepting my offer and nobody was wearing masks then, so I doubt anyone is now

[Anonymous User]

how many events should SAs expect per week? Does this differ based on location? I'll be at the Chicago office and I'm generally an introverted person. I feel a bit of anxiety around social outings/events and I'm trying to gauge how many I can expect to attend.

dw bro come and find me i’ll talk to you anytime

but i heard (precovid) it’d be lunch nearly every day and quite a few social events outside. if you count lunch i’d just say 3-6 a week would be a good guess

Thanks for the info! Ah that sounds like a nightmare. Are the lunches usually group lunches or are we supposed to network and find people to go to lunch with?

Honestly I kind of wish this summer would take place entirely over zoom. But I'm sure it won't be as bad as I am fearing it will be.

I would assume group lunches. I’m an incoming SA too, so I’m not sure. I just heard there’s a stuff nearly every day (really, 3 days now with RTO) and at some point we’ll be on a yacht on lake michigan

[Anonymous User]

I'm happy to go to lunch with any/all SAs this summer--most associates won't pass up that opportunity. Take advantage and go to as many events as possible, stay for as long as you prefer. While your job won't necessarily depend on it, you'll still want to attend social events as a way to get to know your fellow SAs, esp in your group, since you'll spend a lot of time with them when you start.

Re masks, most aren't wearing, but a handful are. I don't look twice, and I don't think most people care. Do what feels comfortable/safe.

Re RTO, in my group, it was relatively well-attended the first week, but attendance has fallen off for a combo of factors. Not sure what will stick, but it hasn't seemed to matter all that much.

[Anonymous User]

I’ve heard rumors that Kirkland will actually start enforcing the Tuesday-Thursday in-office policy. If true, would you leave?

They really sold laterals on Kirkland not being “a face time kind of place”. I’m a Kirkland Kool-Aid drinker, but I’m not sure that’s a bait and switch I can live with.

[Anonymous User]

I’ve heard rumors that Kirkland will actually start enforcing the Tuesday-Thursday in-office policy. If true, would you leave?

They really sold laterals on Kirkland not being “a face time kind of place”. I’m a Kirkland Kool-Aid drinker, but I’m not sure that’s a bait and switch I can live with.

HR needs to have a stack of crisp franklins and deliver a crisp hundy / “good morning” to each eager arrival.

[Anonymous User]

I’ve heard rumors that Kirkland will actually start enforcing the Tuesday-Thursday in-office policy. If true, would you leave?

They really sold laterals on Kirkland not being “a face time kind of place”. I’m a Kirkland Kool-Aid drinker, but I’m not sure that’s a bait and switch I can live with.

I also lateralled to Kirkland within the past year. I asked a lot of people what the best estimate of the RTO policy would be, and I heard from partners all the way down to associates that it was not a "face-time-for-the sake-of-face-time" place before the pandemic, and wouldn't be after. If they do this bait-and-switch, I'd be royally annoyed and would consider leaving as well. I know a few other folks would, too (some of whom are considered "superstars" in the NY office).

It's one thing to strongly recommend coming in Tues-Thurs. It's another to start enforcing it in a way that disrupts workflow and needlessly aggravates people.

[Anonymous User]

I’ve heard rumors that Kirkland will actually start enforcing the Tuesday-Thursday in-office policy. If true, would you leave?

They really sold laterals on Kirkland not being “a face time kind of place”. I’m a Kirkland Kool-Aid drinker, but I’m not sure that’s a bait and switch I can live with.

I also lateralled to Kirkland within the past year. I asked a lot of people what the best estimate of the RTO policy would be, and I heard from partners all the way down to associates that it was not a "face-time-for-the sake-of-face-time" place before the pandemic, and wouldn't be after. If they do this bait-and-switch, I'd be royally annoyed and would consider leaving as well. I know a few other folks would, too (some of whom are considered "superstars" in the NY office).

It's one thing to strongly recommend coming in Tues-Thurs. It's another to start enforcing it in a way that disrupts workflow and needlessly aggravates people.

In Houston at least, they didn’t really enforce face time before Covid, so I’d be surprised if they started doing it now. Of course, as with all things BigLaw it depends heavily on the partners/seniors you work for directly and their expectations. I doubt Kirkland as a whole would enforce, but a few specific partners might. If you work with cross-office teams (as many of us do), who would even know you weren’t there?

[Anonymous User]

I also lateralled to Kirkland within the past year. I asked a lot of people what the best estimate of the RTO policy would be, and I heard from partners all the way down to associates that it was not a "face-time-for-the sake-of-face-time" place before the pandemic, and wouldn't be after. If they do this bait-and-switch, I'd be royally annoyed and would consider leaving as well. I know a few other folks would, too (some of whom are considered "superstars" in the NY office).

It's one thing to strongly recommend coming in Tues-Thurs. It's another to start enforcing it in a way that disrupts workflow and needlessly aggravates people.

In Houston at least, they didn’t really enforce face time before Covid, so I’d be surprised if they started doing it now. Of course, as with all things BigLaw it depends heavily on the partners/seniors you work for directly and their expectations. I doubt Kirkland as a whole would enforce, but a few specific partners might. If you work with cross-office teams (as many of us do), who would even know you weren’t there?

If you're a partner in NYC sitting, e.g., on the 45th floor, you can walk around and easily see which associates are not there and usually never there. And in litigation, it's a small enough group that you notice. As others have said, it would be particularly stupid to enforce RTO for litigators because the whole "in-person training" is total bullshit and we can do our jobs just as if not more effectively either WFH or choosing to come in on select days, rather than specific mandatory days a week.

But yeah, guess "enforcement" depends on whether the partners in your group care enough to say something, make future assignments, or rate your EOY review partially based on stuff like that.