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Given that your number is listed on firm websites and anyone can call, how do you approach calls from unknown numbers? Do you typically ignore unplanned calls? How often do you get calls?

Why would you not answer calls to your work number?

I'm a mid-level. When I was junior I used to answer all my calls until I discovered that it would force me to have 3-4 conversations a day with recruiters, financial planners, suit tailors, etc., that I didn't want to have. I learned that 90% of the work related calls I get are from the same partners and associates, so I save their numbers in my phone. Now I only answer a random number when I have reason to know it is actually work related, i.e., I agreed to have a call with X person at Y time and I get a call from a number at that time. Other than that, I ignore and let it go to VM and call back if it is real. I have also found that since the pandemic started cold calling for real work calls is increasingly rare, a couple partners will call me out of the blue, but other than that almost always it is preceded by a "can you chat for 5 min?" email. I have never "gotten in trouble" or caused any issues by ignoring random numbers.

That's fair. I may have been a little snarky because I'm expected to answer mine.

Maybe the best advice I ever received as a junior associate was to stop answering calls from unknown numbers (assuming you're not in crunch time on a signing/closing etc.). Think of it like this - whomever it is that's calling you already has in mind exactly what it is that they want to talk to you about. You, however, have not had any time to process whatever question or request may be coming - in fact, you're likely working on another matter or client entirely when the call comes in. The only thing that taking that call is going to do is make you look like an idiot. Instead, listen to the voicemail, and ping whomever it is via email immediately to just say "[ ], saw I just missed your call - can I call you back in 10 minutes?" 10 minutes should be enough time to at least prime yourself on the matter to be able to respond or discuss it intelligently.

All of this goes to say, things change as you get more senior - because with more experience comes more confidence and ability to know how to respond to off-hand questions, and more subject matter mastery to where you don't have to look into every single substantive question.

God no. I am not exaggerating when I say over 90 percent of my calls are recruiter calls. Fuck answering those.

No - people in my group don’t call me and opposing counsel can write anything down in an email.

No. I was advised not to during orientation because we get a shit ton of spam, and there's nothing anyone can do about it if the number's on the website. The info for everyone at the firm was already put into my work phone before I got it, so those numbers don't come up as unknown. And no one really calls out of the blue anyway - they'll either email to schedule a call, or text to ask if now is a good time. I'm too junior to have any client contact except for pro bono stuff, so maybe that will change in the future. But if someone from work called me and I didn't pick up for whatever reason, whether because I didn't recognize the number or because I was in the bathroom or something, I expect they'd either leave a voicemail or send me an email.

I have one senior who likes to call my phone and expects me to pick up immediately. It's never actually urgent. Everyone else including partners emails first, or sets up a time to chat, or just writes what they want in email like a normal person.

I guess I don't get not picking up on recruiters. I mean do you actively not want to get an in-house job that pays more and is vastly more pleasant than biglaw? Biglaw for life I guess....

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 3:20 pm

I guess I don't get not picking up on recruiters. I mean do you actively not want to get an in-house job that pays more and is vastly more pleasant than biglaw? Biglaw for life I guess....

I guess the idea is that the good in-house opportunities are not the ones that the recruiters cold calling any publicly listed associate with a pulse are selling.

No. 90% of the time it's spam, and my practice assistant screens my calls. If it was an actual client or someone I should have talked to, they'll say I was in a meeting or another call, and I'll call them back as soon as I can.

There is zero reason to pick up unrecognized phone numbers.

Quick pickup, and then if it’s a cold call i just recite 1 of several no thank you phrases and keep going.

Rather catch an issue on the fly than prep a response (if it was ever needed in the first place)

MarkmanPapers wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 5:50 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 3:20 pm

I guess I don't get not picking up on recruiters. I mean do you actively not want to get an in-house job that pays more and is vastly more pleasant than biglaw? Biglaw for life I guess....

I guess the idea is that the good in-house opportunities are not the ones that the recruiters cold calling any publicly listed associate with a pulse are selling.

Given that you are sitting in one of the most miserable jobs in the history of mankind, I would be taking any recruiter call you can get. Stop imagining you are some special snowflake the recruiters are lining up to give some customized job to.

MOD NOTE: USER VEERS OUTED FOR ANON ABUSE

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 6:55 pm

MarkmanPapers wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 5:50 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 3:20 pm

I guess I don't get not picking up on recruiters. I mean do you actively not want to get an in-house job that pays more and is vastly more pleasant than biglaw? Biglaw for life I guess....

I guess the idea is that the good in-house opportunities are not the ones that the recruiters cold calling any publicly listed associate with a pulse are selling.

Given that you are sitting in one of the most miserable jobs in the history of mankind, I would be taking any recruiter call you can get. Stop imagining you are some special snowflake the recruiters are lining up to give some customized job to.

Have you ever actually interacted with any recruiters? Your take is misinformed. Recruiters can be an annoying bunch. They’re salesmen, and you are the product. Sometimes they have good jobs, but a lot of times they just want to get your resume and plaster it everywhere without your permission, which can be harmful. I’ve had recruiters send unsolicited emails and LinkedIn messages about the most random weird jobs.

So no, I’m not about to waste my time taking to a recruiter I don’t know. Introduce yourself normally, build trust, or just send me the exact details and I’ll decide if to apply.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 3:20 pm

I guess I don't get not picking up on recruiters. I mean do you actively not want to get an in-house job that pays more and is vastly more pleasant than biglaw? Biglaw for life I guess....

Where are these in-house jobs that pay more than biglaw for the class year they're looking to hire? The ones that pay more than junior biglaw money aren't going to hire a second-year. I've never heard of anyone getting a raise by going in-house. If someone somewhere did, good for them, but I doubt they got it by answering recruiters' cold calls.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 6:55 pm

Given that you are sitting in one of the most miserable jobs in the history of mankind, I would be taking any recruiter call you can get. Stop imagining you are some special snowflake the recruiters are lining up to give some customized job to.

I've had worse jobs that paid 10% as much. If you're miserable in biglaw, then by all means, do whatever you need to do to find something you like better. But the fact that you're miserable doesn't mean that everyone else is either miserable or too stupid to know they're supposed to be miserable.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 10:18 am

I'm a mid-level. When I was junior I used to answer all my calls until I discovered that it would force me to have 3-4 conversations a day with recruiters, financial planners, suit tailors, etc., that I didn't want to have. I learned that 90% of the work related calls I get are from the same partners and associates, so I save their numbers in my phone. Now I only answer a random number when I have reason to know it is actually work related, i.e., I agreed to have a call with X person at Y time and I get a call from a number at that time. Other than that, I ignore and let it go to VM and call back if it is real. I have also found that since the pandemic started cold calling for real work calls is increasingly rare, a couple partners will call me out of the blue, but other than that almost always it is preceded by a "can you chat for 5 min?" email. I have never "gotten in trouble" or caused any issues by ignoring random numbers.

Exactly this. I screen 100% of calls, and if a client calls unexpectedly, I usually let it go to VM so they put their question in email form and I don’t have to pull up the docs and figure out what they’re asking about, unless it’s someone I have a good and relaxed relationship with where we’ve already established that I’m not going to have all of the docs pulled up at all times and all of the answers to hand.

Junior analysts at banks/PE shops are the worst at just calling and assuming we’re all also spending 100% of our time and brain power on the deal, and I learned quickly to ignore those calls and make them organize their thoughts and email the deal team.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 7:40 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 3:20 pm

I guess I don't get not picking up on recruiters. I mean do you actively not want to get an in-house job that pays more and is vastly more pleasant than biglaw? Biglaw for life I guess....

Where are these in-house jobs that pay more than biglaw for the class year they're looking to hire? The ones that pay more than junior biglaw money aren't going to hire a second-year. I've never heard of anyone getting a raise by going in-house. If someone somewhere did, good for them, but I doubt they got it by answering recruiters' cold calls.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 6:55 pm

Given that you are sitting in one of the most miserable jobs in the history of mankind, I would be taking any recruiter call you can get. Stop imagining you are some special snowflake the recruiters are lining up to give some customized job to.

I've had worse jobs that paid 10% as much. If you're miserable in biglaw, then by all means, do whatever you need to do to find something you like better. But the fact that you're miserable doesn't mean that everyone else is either miserable or too stupid to know they're supposed to be miserable.

Not sure what Alice in Wonderland universe you are living in, but both hedge funds and private equity funds will gladly pay more than biglaw, as will top investment banks in the right group. And they will hire high caliber 2nd years from V10s.

Are recruiters going to cold call random second-years for those jobs?

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 9:51 pm

Are recruiters going to cold call random second-years for those jobs?

Recruiters look for ways to automate their jobs or take short cuts all the time. Do you have any idea how many recruiters used to contact me for jobs via linkedin while I was still in law school? Working in big law invites the same but to a milder degree. Yes, recruiters contact second-years all the time and most of the time without having carefully looked at their resume or linkedin.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 9:59 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 9:51 pm

Are recruiters going to cold call random second-years for those jobs?

Recruiters look for ways to automate their jobs or take short cuts all the time. Do you have any idea how many recruiters used to contact me for jobs via linkedin while I was still in law school? Working in big law invites the same but to a milder degree. Yes, recruiters contact second-years all the time and most of the time without having carefully looked at their resume or linkedin.

I know recruiters will do this. I mean specifically recruiters with these amazing hedge funds/top investment banks paying above market.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 10:04 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 9:59 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 9:51 pm

Are recruiters going to cold call random second-years for those jobs?

Recruiters look for ways to automate their jobs or take short cuts all the time. Do you have any idea how many recruiters used to contact me for jobs via linkedin while I was still in law school? Working in big law invites the same but to a milder degree. Yes, recruiters contact second-years all the time and most of the time without having carefully looked at their resume or linkedin.

I know recruiters will do this. I mean specifically recruiters with these amazing hedge funds/top investment banks paying above market.

diff anon but to avoid this you should try to use the quoting function

I don’t. Too much spam. If it’s important they’ll call again, leave a voicemail, or send an email.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 10:04 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 9:59 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 9:51 pm

Are recruiters going to cold call random second-years for those jobs?

Recruiters look for ways to automate their jobs or take short cuts all the time. Do you have any idea how many recruiters used to contact me for jobs via linkedin while I was still in law school? Working in big law invites the same but to a milder degree. Yes, recruiters contact second-years all the time and most of the time without having carefully looked at their resume or linkedin.

I know recruiters will do this. I mean specifically recruiters with these amazing hedge funds/top investment banks paying above market.

No. The ones spamming you are the ones not worth talking to. Like any other sales people.

veers wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 06, 2022 9:47 pm

Not sure what Alice in Wonderland universe you are living in, but both hedge funds and private equity funds will gladly pay more than biglaw, as will top investment banks in the right group. And they will hire high caliber 2nd years from V10s.

That may be true of some groups, but it's not true across the board. How often do they take lit second-years? For that matter, how often do they hire someone brought to them by a recruiter who found that person by cold-calling them?

By definition, most V10 second-years aren't "high caliber" relative to other V10 second-years. Most associates in even the most sought-after groups would know they're wasting their time pursuing such a job if they've got an iota of self-awareness about their own desirability. Just because a recruiter has decided that the best approach is to call every single number on a firm's website without regard for qualifications doesn't mean that the mediocre lit second-year who answers the phone has a snowball's chance in hell of getting the job. And that's assuming he wants it anyway, which he probably doesn't, because if he wanted to be in-house for a hedge fund he wouldn't have chosen lit in the first place.

I'm not saying recruiters aren't a good option for the right person in the right circumstances, but PP's position that anyone who isn't interested in answering their cold-calls must be either stupid or brainwashed is a huge overgeneralization.