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Ditto for non-equity partners at my v50, around the same as senior associates.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Jan 10, 2022 4:57 pmAt my Am Law 100, I was told that some non-equity partners are making barely more than senior associates (we're on the DPW scale or whatever we're calling it). But it has less to do with being a "first year" non-equity partner and more to do with hours, collections, book of business, how badly the firm needs them, etc.
I mean yeah, it's definitely not worth it as a final destination. But the average equity partner in my corporate group made ~$3.8M last year. Gotta make non-equity before equity, so it's just another step towards the brass ring.
This is kind of silly, because that could be one partner making $1 million and one making $6.6 million. From my understanding, very few partners are near the average of any firm's PPP. They either make considerably less or considerably more with a few exceptions, not that making $1 million per year is a bad gig...Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue Jan 11, 2022 7:42 pmI mean yeah, it's definitely not worth it as a final destination. But the average equity partner in my corporate group made ~$3.8M last year. Gotta make non-equity before equity, so it's just another step towards the brass ring.
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Jan 12, 2022 12:22 amAt my V5 firm, first year partners this year made about $1.7 million.
I’m guessing this is only true for Cravath/Wachtell first years, right? Or are STB/DPW/S&C/firms with much bigger partnerships able to carve out this much for first year partners?I think DPW/Cravath equity partner is well north of $2 millionAnonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:40 amAnonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Jan 12, 2022 12:22 amAt my V5 firm, first year partners this year made about $1.7 million.
Whoa, that’s quite high.
It's quite high because they are first year equity partners; even at mammoth firms like K&E, their first year equity partners can expect around or over $1 million. But getting shares in big law, let alone the V10, is a difficult feat. Very few people make it to non-share partnership, let alone shares.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:40 amAnonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Jan 12, 2022 12:22 amAt my V5 firm, first year partners this year made about $1.7 million.
Whoa, that’s quite high.
DPW, sure. Cravath? No. Cravath's PPP is $1.8 million less than DPW. Their economics are not the same. Unless Cravath has an extraordinarily tight band from top to bottom of the partnership (doubtful), a new Cravath partner probably pulls in ~$1.0-1.5 million under the new system, not "well north" of $2 million. There are probably half a dozen or a dozen less prefftigious law firms than Cravath that pay their new equity partners as much. No clue why they are still fawned over.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Jan 12, 2022 12:25 pmI think DPW/Cravath equity partner is well north of $2 million
Sackboy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 5:33 pmDPW, sure. Cravath? No. Cravath's PPP is $1.8 million less than DPW. Their economics are not the same. Unless Cravath has an extraordinarily tight band from top to bottom of the partnership (doubtful), a new Cravath partner probably pulls in ~$1.0-1.5 million under the new system, not "well north" of $2 million. There are probably half a dozen or a dozen less prefftigious law firms than Cravath that pay their new equity partners as much. No clue why they are still fawned over.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Jan 12, 2022 12:25 pmI think DPW/Cravath equity partner is well north of $2 million
not how modified lockstep works, bet that the minimum is at least $1.5Sackboy wrote: ↑Tue Jan 18, 2022 1:05 amYour math checks out for the older system, but I'm also talking about the system that exists, not the one that is defunct and no longer relevant. All of T&E had to get hosed (but where are they going to go?). ECEB probably got hosed. Tax might have faired OK. Some lit partners probably got hosed too. Corporate on average probably made out like bandits.
Remember that associates at top firms have real alternative options. This isn't like Dechert or Goodwin deciding it only needs to pay $800k to first year non-equity partners. If DPW/Cravath/Paul Weiss etc... get cheap with 1st year partner comp the senior associates are just going to bail.Sackboy wrote: ↑Tue Jan 18, 2022 1:05 amYour math checks out for the older system, but I'm also talking about the system that exists, not the one that is defunct and no longer relevant. All of T&E had to get hosed (but where are they going to go?). ECEB probably got hosed. Tax might have faired OK. Some lit partners probably got hosed too. Corporate on average probably made out like bandits.
Senior associates bailing is part of the modelAnonymous User wrote: ↑Tue Jan 18, 2022 11:12 amRemember that associates at top firms have real alternative options. This isn't like Dechert or Goodwin deciding it only needs to pay $800k to first year non-equity partners. If DPW/Cravath/Paul Weiss etc... get cheap with 1st year partner comp the senior associates are just going to bail.Sackboy wrote: ↑Tue Jan 18, 2022 1:05 amYour math checks out for the older system, but I'm also talking about the system that exists, not the one that is defunct and no longer relevant. All of T&E had to get hosed (but where are they going to go?). ECEB probably got hosed. Tax might have faired OK. Some lit partners probably got hosed too. Corporate on average probably made out like bandits.
Not the senior associates the firms wanted to promote to partner though. Firing/losing everyone but the cream of the crop is the business model. Having the cream of the crop decide that you partner doesn't pay enough and going next door instead is not the business model.The Lsat Airbender wrote: ↑Tue Jan 18, 2022 11:25 amSenior associates bailing is part of the modelAnonymous User wrote: ↑Tue Jan 18, 2022 11:12 amRemember that associates at top firms have real alternative options. This isn't like Dechert or Goodwin deciding it only needs to pay $800k to first year non-equity partners. If DPW/Cravath/Paul Weiss etc... get cheap with 1st year partner comp the senior associates are just going to bail.Sackboy wrote: ↑Tue Jan 18, 2022 1:05 amYour math checks out for the older system, but I'm also talking about the system that exists, not the one that is defunct and no longer relevant. All of T&E had to get hosed (but where are they going to go?). ECEB probably got hosed. Tax might have faired OK. Some lit partners probably got hosed too. Corporate on average probably made out like bandits.
Where are you getting this 800k figure for a first year Dechert/Goodwin NEP from?Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue Jan 18, 2022 11:12 amRemember that associates at top firms have real alternative options. This isn't like Dechert or Goodwin deciding it only needs to pay $800k to first year non-equity partners. If DPW/Cravath/Paul Weiss etc... get cheap with 1st year partner comp the senior associates are just going to bail.Sackboy wrote: ↑Tue Jan 18, 2022 1:05 amYour math checks out for the older system, but I'm also talking about the system that exists, not the one that is defunct and no longer relevant. All of T&E had to get hosed (but where are they going to go?). ECEB probably got hosed. Tax might have faired OK. Some lit partners probably got hosed too. Corporate on average probably made out like bandits.
Davis Polk first year partners are not making over $2m a year and Cravath partners are not making $1M a year. As others have alluded in this thread PPP is highly misleading. Most old schools firms have set minimums that have risen with inflation and firm profits. The rest is based on the firms allocation system (points, rainmaker allocations etc). Lockstep has been dead for a very long time. Why would you ever believe their lies?Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:49 pmSackboy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 5:33 pmDPW, sure. Cravath? No. Cravath's PPP is $1.8 million less than DPW. Their economics are not the same. Unless Cravath has an extraordinarily tight band from top to bottom of the partnership (doubtful), a new Cravath partner probably pulls in ~$1.0-1.5 million under the new system, not "well north" of $2 million. There are probably half a dozen or a dozen less prefftigious law firms than Cravath that pay their new equity partners as much. No clue why they are still fawned over.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Jan 12, 2022 12:25 pmI think DPW/Cravath equity partner is well north of $2 million
I mean, before they moved to modified lockstep, the band was strictly 3:1. Their PPP last year was $4.5 million, so the highest paid class of partners had to be making a good chunk more than the average for the math to work out, right? Assuming the highest paid partners make $5-6 million (maybe even more?), then the most junior partner at Cravath takes home $1.6-2 million. Again, that's on pure lockstep and their self-professed 3:1 band. I wouldn't be surprised if junior partners make around what you say (around $1 million) after they're forced to shift around funds to keep rainmakers under modified lockstep.
As for why they are still fawned over...I literally do not know. Maybe the relatively short equity partnership track (some of the partners in the newest classes have made it in 7 - not even 8! - years, which is pretty unheard of at peer firms, I think)? Though no law student seriously chooses a V10 firm based on partnership chances lol...
Davis Polk first year partners are not making over $2m a year and Cravath partners are not making $1M a year. As others have alluded in this thread PPP is highly misleading. Most old schools firms have set minimums that have risen with inflation and firm profits. The rest is based on the firms allocation system (points, rainmaker allocations etc). Lockstep has been dead for a very long time. Why would you ever believe their lies?Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:49 pmSackboy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 5:33 pmDPW, sure. Cravath? No. Cravath's PPP is $1.8 million less than DPW. Their economics are not the same. Unless Cravath has an extraordinarily tight band from top to bottom of the partnership (doubtful), a new Cravath partner probably pulls in ~$1.0-1.5 million under the new system, not "well north" of $2 million. There are probably half a dozen or a dozen less prefftigious law firms than Cravath that pay their new equity partners as much. No clue why they are still fawned over.Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Jan 12, 2022 12:25 pmI think DPW/Cravath equity partner is well north of $2 million
I mean, before they moved to modified lockstep, the band was strictly 3:1. Their PPP last year was $4.5 million, so the highest paid class of partners had to be making a good chunk more than the average for the math to work out, right? Assuming the highest paid partners make $5-6 million (maybe even more?), then the most junior partner at Cravath takes home $1.6-2 million. Again, that's on pure lockstep and their self-professed 3:1 band. I wouldn't be surprised if junior partners make around what you say (around $1 million) after they're forced to shift around funds to keep rainmakers under modified lockstep.
As for why they are still fawned over...I literally do not know. Maybe the relatively short equity partnership track (some of the partners in the newest classes have made it in 7 - not even 8! - years, which is pretty unheard of at peer firms, I think)? Though no law student seriously chooses a V10 firm based on partnership chances lol...