Try to lateral before “the talk”? Forum

[Anonymous User]

I’ve been at my current LA firm for just over a year and it has been slow pretty much the whole time. I’m talking never billing over 125 hours a month. My group in general just hasn’t been slammed, except for a couple partners at a couple points during the year, but they already had associates roped in. I do ask for work and check in with folks about workload, but that doesn’t always do much. Feedback on my work has generally been good, minus some learning-type mistakes. I like the firm and the people I work with, so I don’t really want to leave, but I also dread the review at the end of the fiscal year. But because folks seem generally aware of the situation, im not sure what to expect.

Being slow has been nice in some ways, of course, but I also don’t want to be somewhere where I’m not really adding any value, and don’t want to have a reputation as the slow guy. Is a lateral or clerk attempt worth it here?

[Anonymous User]

Op here: firm is amlaw/V100 for what it’s worth.

[Anonymous User]

Are you a first year or did you lateral into the firm and have been there a year? If you are a first year, you are almost certainly fine. Assuming the firm as a whole is not struggling financially (and few are right now), being slow as a first year because of factors out of your control will not be held against you. As long as you are putting in good work/effort on the assignments you do have, minimizing mistakes, and asking for more work when you're slow, it is very unlikely a firm would try to push you out at your level. If you're not doing it already, I would try to fill in some of your time with pro bono, offering to help on articles/client development projects, or thinking of other ways to add value besides billable work.

That all being said, there is no downside to testing the lateral market. It really doesn't take that much time to put together and send in resumes, prep for interviews, etc. If you can find a good recruiter to work with, it's even less of a time commitment. Ultimately, going through that work now and taking time to think about your career development at this point is better than having to do it under the gun once you've received the talk (which again, I don't think is likely in your case). Just take precautions to make sure your current firm doesn't find out you're looking, but that is much easier in the current remote work environment.

[papermateflair]

What are partners saying about your hours? Do you know what hours look like for other associates in your group? When I was a first year and slowly ramping up in a group that didn't have like, 160 hours for me right away, they were all very clear that the hours expectation for a first year was different, and that we didn't have enough work to immediately overwhelm me, and they just wanted me to be available and learn and work hard. Do you have a mentor in your group you can talk to in order to get a sense of how the group feels about hours? If the group's opinion is that this is a down year but they're fine with keeping folks around during a down year and don't think it's your fault, then I wouldn't move for at least another year (two down years may mean you aren't developing the skills you need), but if they like to blame associates for their own problems I would definitely look around.

[Anonymous User]

If you're not doing it already, I would try to fill in some of your time with pro bono, offering to help on articles/client development projects, or thinking of other ways to add value besides billable work.

This x100. If you like your practice area and want to stick with it, find one of the partners and see if they want to start publishing a series of articles. It may not be billable at your firm, but you'll get exposure to cutting edge issues in your field while showing that partner you're motivated to work/learn even when things are slow. And if the articles generate new business you'll almost certainly be considered for those matters.

[Anonymous User]

If you're not doing it already, I would try to fill in some of your time with pro bono, offering to help on articles/client development projects, or thinking of other ways to add value besides billable work.

This x100. If you like your practice area and want to stick with it, find one of the partners and see if they want to start publishing a series of articles. It may not be billable at your firm, but you'll get exposure to cutting edge issues in your field while showing that partner you're motivated to work/learn even when things are slow. And if the articles generate new business you'll almost certainly be considered for those matters.

I was going to criticize this advice, but these filthy boomer shitbags will definitely be scrutinizing your billing records, so pro bono and development wouldn't be too bad. If you're asking yourself whether you should lateral, you should lateral. And it's such a drawn out process too, so you might as well start early.

[Anonymous User]

I was going to criticize this advice, but these filthy boomer shitbags will definitely be scrutinizing your billing records, so pro bono and development wouldn't be too bad. If you're asking yourself whether you should lateral, you should lateral. And it's such a drawn out process too, so you might as well start early.

This adds nothing besides pointing out the obvious that lateraling can take time. You don't offer any good reason for the OP to leave. Of course they scrutinize the billing records; it's a business. Name another industry that keeps a bunch of employees with little to do. Go ahead, call me a filthy boomer shitbag too for saying it.

OP - do you think you're falling behind peers at other firms on relevant skills? If that's the case, then maybe lateralling will help for your professional development. But if you don't want to make partner (low hours in the group probably means low partnership prospects) and feel like you are developing, you're in the biglaw unicorn sweet spot. Unless you catch wind that they want low billing associates out the door, don't leave.

Also, why don't you just ask one of the partners or seniors if that's more comfortable? You can politely say that you've been trying to keep busy but there seems like fewer projects to work on and ask if you should be worried about that.

[hdr]

I would try to lateral. It's not unusual for firms to stealth juniors with low hours. A lot of times they don't even wait for scheduled evaluations. 1500 hours is probably enough to keep your job as a junior, especially if you can add some pro bono, but it's no guarantee.

One important factor is the overall financial health of your firm. Do they have a full summer program, are associates guaranteed lockstep raises, or do they pay midlevels and seniors below-market? If they're already making cuts, they're more likely to consider reducing headcount.

[Buglaw]

Like others said, I wouldn't be too concerned as a first year unless there are extenuating circumstances. You do need to start getting busier, though.

[Anonymous User]

I was going to criticize this advice, but these filthy boomer shitbags will definitely be scrutinizing your billing records, so pro bono and development wouldn't be too bad. If you're asking yourself whether you should lateral, you should lateral. And it's such a drawn out process too, so you might as well start early.

This adds nothing besides pointing out the obvious that lateraling can take time. You don't offer any good reason for the OP to leave. Of course they scrutinize the billing records; it's a business. Name another industry that keeps a bunch of employees with little to do. Go ahead, call me a filthy boomer shitbag too for saying it.

OP - do you think you're falling behind peers at other firms on relevant skills? If that's the case, then maybe lateralling will help for your professional development. But if you don't want to make partner (low hours in the group probably means low partnership prospects) and feel like you are developing, you're in the biglaw unicorn sweet spot. Unless you catch wind that they want low billing associates out the door, don't leave.

Also, why don't you just ask one of the partners or seniors if that's more comfortable? You can politely say that you've been trying to keep busy but there seems like fewer projects to work on and ask if you should be worried about that.

Thanks for this and the other replies. I’ll try to respond to them all at once.

The firm’s financial health is good. Our group is just on the slow side right now. I was the only new associate hired for the group last year, and we aren’t getting any new associates for another couple years probably as we didn’t have a summer last summer. So it’s a little hard to compare how I’m progressing compared to others in my position, as there aren’t any others. I started new, I didn’t lateral. I doubt most other associates in my group will hit 2000, from what I’ve picked up in conversation. 175 hours a month is probably a good month by our standards right now. This is litigation, btw.

I’ve definitely been trying to fill time with pro bono and as much non-bs nonbillable stuff as I can. I’ve taken work from other groups when mass emails go out, etc.

There’s been no indication that they are going to push me out, so maybe it’s a unicorn spot. Nobody has ever indicated that it’s my fault, but I could have gunned for work more than I have. That said, I don’t really care about making partner and didn’t really plan on staying in biglaw for more than 3-4 years.

[Elston Gunn]

If you’re a first year, I really wouldn’t stress.

[Anonymous User]

I was going to criticize this advice, but these filthy boomer shitbags will definitely be scrutinizing your billing records, so pro bono and development wouldn't be too bad. If you're asking yourself whether you should lateral, you should lateral. And it's such a drawn out process too, so you might as well start early.

This adds nothing besides pointing out the obvious that lateraling can take time. You don't offer any good reason for the OP to leave. Of course they scrutinize the billing records; it's a business. Name another industry that keeps a bunch of employees with little to do. Go ahead, call me a filthy boomer shitbag too for saying it.

OP - do you think you're falling behind peers at other firms on relevant skills? If that's the case, then maybe lateralling will help for your professional development. But if you don't want to make partner (low hours in the group probably means low partnership prospects) and feel like you are developing, you're in the biglaw unicorn sweet spot. Unless you catch wind that they want low billing associates out the door, don't leave.

Also, why don't you just ask one of the partners or seniors if that's more comfortable? You can politely say that you've been trying to keep busy but there seems like fewer projects to work on and ask if you should be worried about that.

Thanks for this and the other replies. I’ll try to respond to them all at once.

The firm’s financial health is good. Our group is just on the slow side right now. I was the only new associate hired for the group last year, and we aren’t getting any new associates for another couple years probably as we didn’t have a summer last summer. So it’s a little hard to compare how I’m progressing compared to others in my position, as there aren’t any others. I started new, I didn’t lateral. I doubt most other associates in my group will hit 2000, from what I’ve picked up in conversation. 175 hours a month is probably a good month by our standards right now. This is litigation, btw.

I’ve definitely been trying to fill time with pro bono and as much non-bs nonbillable stuff as I can. I’ve taken work from other groups when mass emails go out, etc.

There’s been no indication that they are going to push me out, so maybe it’s a unicorn spot. Nobody has ever indicated that it’s my fault, but I could have gunned for work more than I have. That said, I don’t really care about making partner and didn’t really plan on staying in biglaw for more than 3-4 years.

Stop freaking out - you're most likely not getting pushed out.