Paid Leave for Mental Health? Forum

[Anonymous User]

My primary care physician is a family friend and I have been going to him for years. I expressed the need to go on leave and requested his assistance to complete the requisite paperwork for Unum so that my leave would be paid. His response was that "that's a lot of paperwork" and that I should just quit my job. Needless to say, I won't be using him as my PCP anymore.

However, I am still in need of taking leave but don't know what to do or where to turn next to get the medical support for taking paid leave. I have reached my limit with work; my hair is falling out; I have constant headaches; I have given up on basic hygiene; I go weeks without leaving the house; and even when I have a few hours off at night, I experience severe anxiety about the workload. I'm a corporate midlevel who is one of the last few associates standing at my firm given recent lateral moves and the work continues to compound. I just learned that three of my partners are taking vacations during the same week and I have been tasked with covering matters for all of them as there are no more associates senior to me.

I want to get an appointment with a doctor and get out on leave ASAP but to be frank I don't know how I would see a doctor (as a first-time patient) who wouldn't assume I'm just bullshitting them to get paid time off. I would be grateful for any advice on how to navigate next steps. I have spoken with mentors and others who have told me I should take the leave but they are not doctors.

[Kikero]

Sorry to hear about your situation and I wish you the best of luck. The first thing to do might be to check out your firm’s HR portal or intranet site to see what is available. For example, my firm only offers unpaid time off via a Family and Medical Leave program. But whatever your firm offers they will probably provide basic instructions for requesting it and any required forms that you or your doctor need to fill out there.

[Poldy]

Your family friend/PCP is right IMO. If the job is causing you that many issues, it is time to quit.

[Anonymous User]

Your family friend/PCP is right IMO. If the job is causing you that many issues, it is time to quit.

This job hasn't always been that way for me, just for the past 9-10 months. I need a break to catch my breath and reset, and to generally take care of myself given the shitty year of work/non-work events. No need for me to give up my career that I am 5 years into because I need some personal time. Isn't that the point of leave? I have paid the short-term disability premium for my policy for 5 years and am entitled to draw on it and keep my job.

Apologies if this comes off as rude; I just feel that I should be able to take time off and keep my job that I have actually enjoyed for many years.

[2013]

Your family friend/PCP is right IMO. If the job is causing you that many issues, it is time to quit.

This job hasn't always been that way for me, just for the past 9-10 months. I need a break to catch my breath and reset, and to generally take care of myself given the shitty year of work/non-work events. No need for me to give up my career that I am 5 years into because I need some personal time. Isn't that the point of leave? I have paid the short-term disability premium for my policy for 5 years and am entitled to draw on it and keep my job.

Apologies if this comes off as rude; I just feel that I should be able to take time off and keep my job that I have actually enjoyed for many years.

Medical leave isn’t supposed to be used to catch your breath. It sounds like you’re struggling, but your characterization of leave is off-putting.

Regardless, for most mental issues (including burnout), I know that people I know have asked their therapists to fill these out. I think PCPs want nothing to do with this just in case of insurance fraud claims (doctor CYA). If you haven’t been seeing a therapist, maybe that’s a first step.

[nixy]

Medical leave isn’t supposed to be used to catch your breath. It sounds like you’re struggling, but your characterization of leave is off-putting.

I don't understand why you say that. Catching your breath, resetting, and taking care of yourself are totally reasonable mental health goals, especially given what the OP describes in their first post. Maybe they'll go on leave and decide that no, they can't go back to this job, but there's no reason they have to decide that now. There have been a bunch of threads on this kind of thing recently where people have talked about quitting their jobs, and everyone has urged them to look into taking medical leave first.

Personally I don't think a doctor being presented with the OP's state of mind would/should write that off as someone trying to get paid time off, but of course I'm not a doctor.

[Anonymous User]

Your family friend/PCP is right IMO. If the job is causing you that many issues, it is time to quit.

This job hasn't always been that way for me, just for the past 9-10 months. I need a break to catch my breath and reset, and to generally take care of myself given the shitty year of work/non-work events. No need for me to give up my career that I am 5 years into because I need some personal time. Isn't that the point of leave? I have paid the short-term disability premium for my policy for 5 years and am entitled to draw on it and keep my job.

Apologies if this comes off as rude; I just feel that I should be able to take time off and keep my job that I have actually enjoyed for many years.

When I needed a break I just approached my teams and told them I needed time to handle a health issue. My firm is one of those with the (possibly unintentionally) scammy "unlimited vacation" policies. I worked basically part time for a couple of weeks and then took a full week off. Every associate I spoke to said "we've got you covered" and every partner said "take the time you need; health and family come first." I have later opened up to a few partners I trust, explaining why I needed the time off, and every one of them has thanked me and reassured me.

I took the time to adjust to anxiety medication (newly prescribed - I had previously depended on occasional prescribed sleep meds, but the symptoms of my anxiety had spun out of control, leading me to seek the time off) and today I'm doing great, back to enjoying many aspects of my job as a midlevel, not to mention being there for my family in a way I couldn't be when the anxiety was crushing me. I'm getting more interesting work than ever - work I wanted - from a couple of the partners I confided in.

I don't have advice on finding a PCP, though I would note: my PCP wasn't the person who diagnosed me with anxiety, but took my word for it when I told him at the beginning of our relationship and was later the one who prescribed me the meds. It can't hurt to reach out to a new doc, maybe one recommended by friends. And if you're not already on meds, consider them - I held off for a long time, first from the sleep meds and then from the daily anti-anxiety pill to replace the sleep meds, out of fear of chemical dependence, and there's a possibility I'll be on the anti-anxiety meds for the rest of my life, which kinda sucks. But it's totally worth it for the quality of life improvement I've seen, and I sort of see it as an investment in both my family and my career (in that order).

Also, I've found that nearly every associate I speak to about my experience responds with something along the lines of "You take [x] for anxiety? Nobody talks about it but I take [x] also" or "Yeah, my therapist says...." Do you know people at your firm with whom you're close enough to talk about this? Obviously my experience may not be universal, there's always the concern that the stigma of mental health issues could affect your career, YMMV, etc. but my PCP and a therapist with whom I spoke were both recommendations from colleagues.

Posting anonymously for obvious reasons, though frankly several people at my firm could probably identify me just from the above details. It's important to talk about this stuff, though, so there it is.

[Anonymous User]

Medical leave isn’t supposed to be used to catch your breath. It sounds like you’re struggling, but your characterization of leave is off-putting.

I don't understand why you say that. Catching your breath, resetting, and taking care of yourself are totally reasonable mental health goals, especially given what the OP describes in their first post. Maybe they'll go on leave and decide that no, they can't go back to this job, but there's no reason they have to decide that now. There have been a bunch of threads on this kind of thing recently where people have talked about quitting their jobs, and everyone has urged them to look into taking medical leave first.

Personally I don't think a doctor being presented with the OP's state of mind would/should write that off as someone trying to get paid time off, but of course I'm not a doctor.

It's off-putting because health leave is intended for people who need to address health issues (physical or mental). It's not to "catch your breath." If a person has a mental illness (depression, anxiety, whatever else) that needs to be treated and can only be effectively treated with leave, that's one thing. Vague wellness goals are another thing entirely. It's like equating being tired because of working hard with someone who has chronic fatigue and needs time off to address it -- the symptoms might look similar, but one is an illness requiring medical intervention and the other is not. (This is not a judgment of OP who may or may not have a mental illness).

[nixy]

Maybe if the only thing the OP had ever said was that they need to catch their breath. In the context of this thread, though, given what the OP described in the first post, the stigma still attached to mental illness (which can dissuade people from speaking more directly), and the role that burnout can play in mental illness, none of what the OP said seems to suggest any inappropriate use of mental health leave. Taking leave to preserve your mental health is appropriate.

[Anonymous User]

My primary care physician is a family friend and I have been going to him for years. I expressed the need to go on leave and requested his assistance to complete the requisite paperwork for Unum so that my leave would be paid. His response was that "that's a lot of paperwork" and that I should just quit my job. Needless to say, I won't be using him as my PCP anymore.

However, I am still in need of taking leave but don't know what to do or where to turn next to get the medical support for taking paid leave. I have reached my limit with work; my hair is falling out; I have constant headaches; I have given up on basic hygiene; I go weeks without leaving the house; and even when I have a few hours off at night, I experience severe anxiety about the workload. I'm a corporate midlevel who is one of the last few associates standing at my firm given recent lateral moves and the work continues to compound. I just learned that three of my partners are taking vacations during the same week and I have been tasked with covering matters for all of them as there are no more associates senior to me.

I want to get an appointment with a doctor and get out on leave ASAP but to be frank I don't know how I would see a doctor (as a first-time patient) who wouldn't assume I'm just bullshitting them to get paid time off. I would be grateful for any advice on how to navigate next steps. I have spoken with mentors and others who have told me I should take the leave but they are not doctors.

OP, on the narrow point of getting a medical profession to support you taking health leave, I'd google clinics in your area that have a focus on professional/workplace stress/burnout, or words to that effect. HR at my firm literally gives you the address and number of such a place that is two blocks away from the office. You can walk in and walk out same day with a doctor's note saying that so-and-so requires leaves. They're used to it and see it all the time. The firm wants you to get the medical sign off, because that unlocks short-term disability (rather than sick days), which the firm uses to pay your salary, so it's a cost savings for them.

I don't want to get sidetracked with the semantics argument about leave and catching your breath, but you should feel entitled to utilize any and all of the benefits provided by your firm, so if you feel like you need/should/want to take medical leave, then take medical leave.

[Anonymous User]

I don't understand why everyone is pushing back on this. My firm has given paid mental health leave to associates who were struggling - what you're describing in your original post would be taken seriously by partners in my firm. I would go find a mental health specialist (psychologist/psychiatrist/therapist) to start getting the help you need, and then talk to HR about your options and what kind of paperwork they need to cover your leave. Then, tell the partners you have a medical issue that needs to be sorted out and you have to take 6-8 weeks off. Even if you didn't have physical symptoms it wouldn't matter (mental health shouldn't be treated any differently than physical health) but you have actual physical symptoms that need to be sorted out.

[Wanderingdrock]

I don't understand why everyone is pushing back on this. My firm has given paid mental health leave to associates who were struggling - what you're describing in your original post would be taken seriously by partners in my firm. I would go find a mental health specialist (psychologist/psychiatrist/therapist) to start getting the help you need, and then talk to HR about your options and what kind of paperwork they need to cover your leave. Then, tell the partners you have a medical issue that needs to be sorted out and you have to take 6-8 weeks off. Even if you didn't have physical symptoms it wouldn't matter (mental health shouldn't be treated any differently than physical health) but you have actual physical symptoms that need to be sorted out.

I think two people pushed back on it? Everyone else has been fairly supportive, including you, and for good reason. I don't mean to sound like I'm attacking you, because I agree with everything you said except the first sentence - I just want to point out that "everyone is pushing back on this" is a mischaracterization of the empathy and support most posters are showing for the OP.

[sparty99]

Medical leave isn’t supposed to be used to catch your breath. It sounds like you’re struggling, but your characterization of leave is off-putting.

I don't understand why you say that. Catching your breath, resetting, and taking care of yourself are totally reasonable mental health goals, especially given what the OP describes in their first post. Maybe they'll go on leave and decide that no, they can't go back to this job, but there's no reason they have to decide that now. There have been a bunch of threads on this kind of thing recently where people have talked about quitting their jobs, and everyone has urged them to look into taking medical leave first.

Personally I don't think a doctor being presented with the OP's state of mind would/should write that off as someone trying to get paid time off, but of course I'm not a doctor.

It's off-putting because health leave is intended for people who need to address health issues (physical or mental). It's not to "catch your breath." If a person has a mental illness (depression, anxiety, whatever else) that needs to be treated and can only be effectively treated with leave, that's one thing. Vague wellness goals are another thing entirely. It's like equating being tired because of working hard with someone who has chronic fatigue and needs time off to address it -- the symptoms might look similar, but one is an illness requiring medical intervention and the other is not. (This is not a judgment of OP who may or may not have a mental illness).

Your use of anon is off putting and I wouldn't waste my time listening to someone complain about someone using leave because they needed a break. Loser

[2013]

First, I think people on here think it’s a lot easier to get FMLA-protected leave than it actually is. Your firm may give you leave, but I wouldn’t take it unless it is federally protected. There is a mountain of paperwork that is required at some places, and usually a mental health specialist is the one who fills out the forms and attests to your seeking treatment with them. Some firms require you to continue to update the firm on your treatment.

Second, I said the characterization was off-putting because there are people who have mental issues who really need the leave (OP may be in this boat), but there is an entirely separate group of people that just want to take advantage of it for a pause to “catch” their breath. That’s what PTO is made for (and firms should do a better job respecting time off so that associates get a reset). A person with mental illness dealing with burnout is very different than a person without mental illness dealing with burnout. Others on here clearly disagree with me.

Also, I think that given the current associate market, firms will gladly give leave for burnout. But I wouldn’t take it unless your benefits department specifically states that it is FMLA.

[Anonymous User]

First, I think people on here think it’s a lot easier to get FMLA-protected leave than it actually is. Your firm may give you leave, but I wouldn’t take it unless it is federally protected. There is a mountain of paperwork that is required at some places, and usually a mental health specialist is the one who fills out the forms and attests to your seeking treatment with them. Some firms require you to continue to update the firm on your treatment.

Second, I said the characterization was off-putting because there are people who have mental issues who really need the leave (OP may be in this boat), but there is an entirely separate group of people that just want to take advantage of it for a pause to “catch” their breath. That’s what PTO is made for (and firms should do a better job respecting time off so that associates get a reset). A person with mental illness dealing with burnout is very different than a person without mental illness dealing with burnout. Others on here clearly disagree with me.

Also, I think that given the current associate market, firms will gladly give leave for burnout. But I wouldn’t take it unless your benefits department specifically states that it is FMLA.

I can speak to the FMLA paperwork. It can be excruciating for MDs to have to liaise with your insurer, which is why many won't do it (unfortunately, especially psychiatrists). But it's part of the job, and if your primary won't go to bat for you then maybe time to look around.

Also, do not think this poster has bad intentions but we really shouldn't gate keep mental health and leave. Burnout is an existential threat for people with a mental health history, but that shouldn't be the bar. Hygiene and isolation are pretty classic symptoms of depression, and I think the first step here for OP should be getting a professional to talk through things with. You would be surprised what prescription can do for your attitude and well being.

That said, I think your order of operations is wrong here. It sucks but you need to let the partner you trust know what's going on and that you're struggling. They'll handle the initial HR stuff, it's happening way, way too much right now and I think you'll be surprised by the reception.

Take care of yourself! You will feel better if you stop trying to normalize burnout as "just needing a break" and accept that you aren't in control of what your brain and body are doing right now.

[fmrez]

Your family friend/PCP is right IMO. If the job is causing you that many issues, it is time to quit.

This job hasn't always been that way for me, just for the past 9-10 months. I need a break to catch my breath and reset, and to generally take care of myself given the shitty year of work/non-work events. No need for me to give up my career that I am 5 years into because I need some personal time. Isn't that the point of leave? I have paid the short-term disability premium for my policy for 5 years and am entitled to draw on it and keep my job.

Apologies if this comes off as rude; I just feel that I should be able to take time off and keep my job that I have actually enjoyed for many years.

Medical leave isn’t supposed to be used to catch your breath. It sounds like you’re struggling, but your characterization of leave is off-putting.

Regardless, for most mental issues (including burnout), I know that people I know have asked their therapists to fill these out. I think PCPs want nothing to do with this just in case of insurance fraud claims (doctor CYA). If you haven’t been seeing a therapist, maybe that’s a first step.

Your dismissal of the very real and dangerous effects of overworking without breaks is what is off-putting. OP said that their hair is falling out and they have constant headaches. This immediately made me think of the Skadden associate who died. Prolonged stress and anxiety can lead to adverse physiological outcomes. We live in a work-obsessed culture in a particularly work-obsessed industry where OP has been trained to call any pause in their labor to stop their brain from hurting and their hair follicles from dying "catching my breath."

[bretby]

I think the problem is that some people are talking about what OP is facing/should do and others are talking more generally about when taking mental health leave is appropriate. I don't think anyone disagrees that if someone is experiencing mental illness, then they should seek out mental health leave. If burnout is a mental illness/diagnosis (I honestly don't know if it is or not), then someone who is facing burnout should seek a diagnosis and appropriate care and treatment, which may include a leave. But if someone does not have a diagnosed mental illness, then mental health leave is probably not the right solution and they should instead seek out another way to reset, maybe through traditional medical leave if appropriate or through PTO. I don't see why this is controversial.

[Anonymous User]

I think the problem is that some people are talking about what OP is facing/should do and others are talking more generally about when taking mental health leave is appropriate. I don't think anyone disagrees that if someone is experiencing mental illness, then they should seek out mental health leave. If burnout is a mental illness/diagnosis (I honestly don't know if it is or not), then someone who is facing burnout should seek a diagnosis and appropriate care and treatment, which may include a leave. But if someone does not have a diagnosed mental illness, then mental health leave is probably not the right solution and they should instead seek out another way to reset, maybe through traditional medical leave if appropriate or through PTO. I don't see why this is controversial.

Our profession has a big problem with the number of people who should take better care of themselves, and they don't, and a large part of the reason why is a culture that discourages acknowledging the value and normalcy of tending to our mental health. The most helpful and appropriate benefit to access, or exact amount of time to take, or the right leave classification to use, can all be complicated to weigh, but the challenge we're facing as a community isn't a lack of policing whether someone should consider taking any given leave, it's giving our peers permission to act in their own best interest and take leave. Maybe the simpler way to put it is "people seek out mental health assistance when they probably shouldn't be looking for mental health assistance" really isn't a problem, but "people feel dissuaded from seeking out mental health assistance when they could benefit from it" is a problem, and so that's the thing we should be focused on addressing.

[nixy]

Is there some kind of material difference between "mental health leave" and "medical leave"? Isn't mental health leave a kind of medical leave and it would fall under the same umbrella?

[bretby]

Is there some kind of material difference between "mental health leave" and "medical leave"? Isn't mental health leave a kind of medical leave and it would fall under the same umbrella?

I don't think there's a difference. And I completely agree with the person above who said that we need to normalize seeking treatment for mental illness, both in this profession and more generally, to combat the stigma that unfortunately still exists for many around mental illness. I would imagine that many people who feel burnt out do have a diagnosable illness, whether physical or mental, and they should absolutely do what they need to do to recover, and that might include taking leave. I also see the point that we don't want to diminish the seriousness of mental illness by equating it generally with stress, though of course severe and prolonged stress can cause/contribute to mental and/or physical illness. I don't think the people saying "shut up, loser" to people who make the point that serious mental illness that prevents a person from working needs to be diagnosed and treated as such are helping the conversation.

[bretby]

I think the problem is that some people are talking about what OP is facing/should do and others are talking more generally about when taking mental health leave is appropriate. I don't think anyone disagrees that if someone is experiencing mental illness, then they should seek out mental health leave. If burnout is a mental illness/diagnosis (I honestly don't know if it is or not), then someone who is facing burnout should seek a diagnosis and appropriate care and treatment, which may include a leave. But if someone does not have a diagnosed mental illness, then mental health leave is probably not the right solution and they should instead seek out another way to reset, maybe through traditional medical leave if appropriate or through PTO. I don't see why this is controversial.

Our profession has a big problem with the number of people who should take better care of themselves, and they don't, and a large part of the reason why is a culture that discourages acknowledging the value and normalcy of tending to our mental health. The most helpful and appropriate benefit to access, or exact amount of time to take, or the right leave classification to use, can all be complicated to weigh, but the challenge we're facing as a community isn't a lack of policing whether someone should consider taking any given leave, it's giving our peers permission to act in their own best interest and take leave. Maybe the simpler way to put it is "people seek out mental health assistance when they probably shouldn't be looking for mental health assistance" really isn't a problem, but "people feel dissuaded from seeking out mental health assistance when they could benefit from it" is a problem, and so that's the thing we should be focused on addressing.

That's a good point -- thanks for making it.

[nixy]

Is there some kind of material difference between "mental health leave" and "medical leave"? Isn't mental health leave a kind of medical leave and it would fall under the same umbrella?

I don't think there's a difference. And I completely agree with the person above who said that we need to normalize seeking treatment for mental illness, both in this profession and more generally, to combat the stigma that unfortunately still exists for many around mental illness. I would imagine that many people who feel burnt out do have a diagnosable illness, whether physical or mental, and they should absolutely do what they need to do to recover, and that might include taking leave. I also see the point that we don't want to diminish the seriousness of mental illness by equating it generally with stress, though of course severe and prolonged stress can cause/contribute to mental and/or physical illness. I don't think the people saying "shut up, loser" to people who make the point that serious mental illness that prevents a person from working needs to be diagnosed and treated as such are helping the conversation.

I agree to the extent that someone with mental illness needs to get professional help/treatment, but the comments criticizing “catching your breath” seemed more gate-keepy than concerned about someone getting properly diagnosed.

[jimmythecatdied6]

First, I think people on here think it’s a lot easier to get FMLA-protected leave than it actually is. Your firm may give you leave, but I wouldn’t take it unless it is federally protected. There is a mountain of paperwork that is required at some places, and usually a mental health specialist is the one who fills out the forms and attests to your seeking treatment with them. Some firms require you to continue to update the firm on your treatment.

Second, I said the characterization was off-putting because there are people who have mental issues who really need the leave (OP may be in this boat), but there is an entirely separate group of people that just want to take advantage of it for a pause to “catch” their breath. That’s what PTO is made for (and firms should do a better job respecting time off so that associates get a reset). A person with mental illness dealing with burnout is very different than a person without mental illness dealing with burnout. Others on here clearly disagree with me.

Also, I think that given the current associate market, firms will gladly give leave for burnout. But I wouldn’t take it unless your benefits department specifically states that it is FMLA.

OP listed several severe medical issues in his OP. Why is it even remotely appropriate to compare his situation to anyone trying to use medical leave for purposes of simply "catching their breath"? You must be really impressed with your opinion to offer it so thoughtlessly.

[2013]

First, I think people on here think it’s a lot easier to get FMLA-protected leave than it actually is. Your firm may give you leave, but I wouldn’t take it unless it is federally protected. There is a mountain of paperwork that is required at some places, and usually a mental health specialist is the one who fills out the forms and attests to your seeking treatment with them. Some firms require you to continue to update the firm on your treatment.

Second, I said the characterization was off-putting because there are people who have mental issues who really need the leave (OP may be in this boat), but there is an entirely separate group of people that just want to take advantage of it for a pause to “catch” their breath. That’s what PTO is made for (and firms should do a better job respecting time off so that associates get a reset). A person with mental illness dealing with burnout is very different than a person without mental illness dealing with burnout. Others on here clearly disagree with me.

Also, I think that given the current associate market, firms will gladly give leave for burnout. But I wouldn’t take it unless your benefits department specifically states that it is FMLA.

OP listed several severe medical issues in his OP. Why is it even remotely appropriate to compare his situation to anyone trying to use medical leave for purposes of simply "catching their breath"? You must be really impressed with your opinion to offer it so thoughtlessly.

If you read my other post, you would see that I’m not accusing OP of using it when OP doesn’t need it. I said that just saying that someone should take leave to catch their breath was off-putting, which led to the larger discussion of using medical leave for mental illness v. stress.

Others have discussed it above, but there is a very big difference between mental health issues and dealing with stress. So to categorize it as “catching my breath” felt odd. That’s all I was saying. OP said that he needed to catch his breath, which downplays some major issues he may be dealing with. I know that could be because of the stigma behind mental health issues, but I do think people need to identify the difference between someone who is having a mental health episode from someone (like many of us) dealing with burnout from being overworked.