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Choosing between an offer at Foley and an offer at another firm. I know that Foley matched the DPW scale for the first three years, but can anyone speak to salaries for midlevels and senior associates under this new scale? Also, what do bonuses look like?

Would also be interested in hearing whether Foley is actually a better lifestyle firm than other biglaw, or whether that’s just fluff.

Also interested

bump

Lifestyle and culture will be very office and practice dependent. Generally, I’ve heard NY office is chill by NY standards, but Milwaukee and Tampa offices are sweatshops relative to other offices in those cities.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Wed Oct 06, 2021 2:35 pm

Lifestyle and culture will be very office and practice dependent. Generally, I’ve heard NY office is chill by NY standards, but Milwaukee and Tampa offices are sweatshops relative to other offices in those cities.

Not OP, but could you speak more to the Tampa office? I applied to firms in Tampa and am curious. If you'd prefer to PM, I'd be thankful for that, too.

ETA: I'm interested in the litigation side.

I did not apply to Foley (Tampa) simply because I heard it was a sweatshop and that it had a really bad culture. This was a report from a lot of sources.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Fri Oct 08, 2021 1:56 pm

I did not apply to Foley (Tampa) simply because I heard it was a sweatshop and that it had a really bad culture. This was a report from a lot of sources.

Would you be willing to PM with some more info?

axolawtl wrote: ↑

Fri Oct 08, 2021 5:01 pm

Would you be willing to PM with some more info?

I don't know if I would be able to explain much more. I just live in Orlando and worked for a peer-firm. My close friends are partners in other peer firms. They specifically mentioned to avoid Foley and Greenberg.

Hours are around 2K, my particular practice (M&A) and office seems chill. No one is rude and accept “no” when your plate is full. Pay scale is kravath if you make hours, but the bonus falls below market after year 3

I recently declined an offer from one of the satellite offices for $260. I am a fourth year.

Any insights on the Madison office? Anything near market would be obscene there, one of the best deals in BL probably

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 10, 2022 12:04 am

Any insights on the Madison office? Anything near market would be obscene there, one of the best deals in BL probably

All offices start at $202.5 and follow DPW scale for the first three years. Not sure how compressed it is after that.

Effective Feb. 1, 2022, all offices are going to be on the same scale. Associate base salary range is $202,500 - $335,000. Bonuses are generally less than market (range between 5% and 35% of salary based on hours and business). So pretty great if you're in a smaller market and not as great if you're in a major market.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 10, 2022 11:14 am

Effective Feb. 1, 2022, all offices are going to be on the same scale. Associate base salary range is $202,500 - $335,000. Bonuses are generally less than market (range between 5% and 35% of salary based on hours and business). So pretty great if you're in a smaller market and not as great if you're in a major market.

Would you be willing to PM me?

axolawtl wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 10, 2022 4:22 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 10, 2022 11:14 am

Effective Feb. 1, 2022, all offices are going to be on the same scale. Associate base salary range is $202,500 - $335,000. Bonuses are generally less than market (range between 5% and 35% of salary based on hours and business). So pretty great if you're in a smaller market and not as great if you're in a major market.

Would you be willing to PM me?

I work in a satellite Foley office, support this view. Get paid above market here, but compared to peers in major offices of other firms it's below market - firm announced that top-line bonus was moved from 40% to 50% for anyone above year 3, but my understanding is that anything above 35% never really happens.

There are other more national firms that pay market salary and market bonuses in the city where I live, and myself and the other associates in my office get recruiting emails from Kirkland and similar firms willing to do remote at least once a week, so it'll be interesting to see what Foley does to compete - right now they still see themselves as a lifestyle firm but salary and hour expectations don't match that - so they have a bit of a culture conflict at the moment. Can't say I'm unhappy with working here; people are great, pay is great, opportunities are good, but the conflict in culture and expectations has me concerned for the future.

Can anyone speak to whether Foley is going to match? And, if so, do we have any chance of moving to lockstep all the way though?

(fwiw, I’m a 3L who summered and will be working at the firm after graduation).

Anyone have insight on the new Foley office in Salt Lake City?

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Tue Jan 25, 2022 3:19 pm

Can anyone speak to whether Foley is going to match? And, if so, do we have any chance of moving to lockstep all the way though?

(fwiw, I’m a 3L who summered and will be working at the firm after graduation).

Foley associate here. I think they will, but like always it won't go into effect until the next fiscal year (the 2021 raise won't go into effect until Feb 15 paychecks). By all accounts last year was one of the best years ever and rates are going up across the industry. They acknowledged that meeting national scale across the board was huge with getting laterals and law grads. I'd bet they will compress at the top end which is what happens right now (for instance right now, having matched the 2021 raise (which as I mentioned above, goes into effect in the Feb 2022 pay cycle) years 1-3 make the same as any other year 1-3 at other national firms, but after year 3 you're about 10-30k below peers in other markets (I think this applies whether you are in a city like NY/CHI/LA or a place like Tampa/Milwaukee/SLC).

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 26, 2022 10:02 am

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Tue Jan 25, 2022 3:19 pm

Can anyone speak to whether Foley is going to match? And, if so, do we have any chance of moving to lockstep all the way though?

(fwiw, I’m a 3L who summered and will be working at the firm after graduation).

Foley associate here. I think they will, but like always it won't go into effect until the next fiscal year (the 2021 raise won't go into effect until Feb 15 paychecks). By all accounts last year was one of the best years ever and rates are going up across the industry. They acknowledged that meeting national scale across the board was huge with getting laterals and law grads. I'd bet they will compress at the top end which is what happens right now (for instance right now, having matched the 2021 raise (which as I mentioned above, goes into effect in the Feb 2022 pay cycle) years 1-3 make the same as any other year 1-3 at other national firms, but after year 3 you're about 10-30k below peers in other markets (I think this applies whether you are in a city like NY/CHI/LA or a place like Tampa/Milwaukee/SLC).

Compensation letters came out today, right? Does that mean that there's no real chance of a raise until the next fiscal year?

I heard Foley isn’t actually full market after a few years. Is that true after the latest raises?

2013 wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 28, 2022 10:33 pm

I heard Foley isn’t actually full market after a few years. Is that true after the latest raises?

No, it’s only market through year 3. Then it’s about 25k below market; someone who knows more than me explained it in more detail above.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 28, 2022 6:32 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 26, 2022 10:02 am

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Tue Jan 25, 2022 3:19 pm

Can anyone speak to whether Foley is going to match? And, if so, do we have any chance of moving to lockstep all the way though?

(fwiw, I’m a 3L who summered and will be working at the firm after graduation).

Foley associate here. I think they will, but like always it won't go into effect until the next fiscal year (the 2021 raise won't go into effect until Feb 15 paychecks). By all accounts last year was one of the best years ever and rates are going up across the industry. They acknowledged that meeting national scale across the board was huge with getting laterals and law grads. I'd bet they will compress at the top end which is what happens right now (for instance right now, having matched the 2021 raise (which as I mentioned above, goes into effect in the Feb 2022 pay cycle) years 1-3 make the same as any other year 1-3 at other national firms, but after year 3 you're about 10-30k below peers in other markets (I think this applies whether you are in a city like NY/CHI/LA or a place like Tampa/Milwaukee/SLC).

Compensation letters came out today, right? Does that mean that there's no real chance of a raise until the next fiscal year?

Unless the new CEO desires to break from tradition, I think that's right. I've been at Foley my entire legal career and each raise was announced mid-year and then didn't go into effect until the following fiscal year. So I assume the same will happen, here.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 29, 2022 12:19 am

2013 wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 28, 2022 10:33 pm

I heard Foley isn’t actually full market after a few years. Is that true after the latest raises?

No, it’s only market through year 3. Then it’s about 25k below market; someone who knows more than me explained it in more detail above.

That's correct, though the second half is $15-40k below market. And this doesn't detail it, but year end bonus is also at most, half of market. not so bad if you work in a secondary market, in primary markets it sucks. Here's the breakdown:

Associate Tier 1 (years 1-3)
2022 (Stub Yr) $202,500
2021 (Full 1st Yr) $205,000
2020 (Year 2) $220,000
2019 (Year 3) $240,000

Associate Tier 2 (years 4+) which you can jump class years
Level 1 $260,000
Level 2 $275,000
Level 3 $290,000
Level 4 $305,000
Level 5 $320,000
Level 6 $335,000

Senior Counsel starts at $350,000

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 31, 2022 10:41 am

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 29, 2022 12:19 am

2013 wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 28, 2022 10:33 pm

I heard Foley isn’t actually full market after a few years. Is that true after the latest raises?

No, it’s only market through year 3. Then it’s about 25k below market; someone who knows more than me explained it in more detail above.

That's correct, though the second half is $15-40k below market. And this doesn't detail it, but year end bonus is also at most, half of market. not so bad if you work in a secondary market, in primary markets it sucks. Here's the breakdown:

Associate Tier 1 (years 1-3)
2022 (Stub Yr) $202,500
2021 (Full 1st Yr) $205,000
2020 (Year 2) $220,000
2019 (Year 3) $240,000

Associate Tier 2 (years 4+) which you can jump class years
Level 1 $260,000
Level 2 $275,000
Level 3 $290,000
Level 4 $305,000
Level 5 $320,000
Level 6 $335,000

Senior Counsel starts at $350,000

This is very helpful, thank you. Are bonuses below market in years 1-3, too?

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 31, 2022 3:30 pm

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Mon Jan 31, 2022 10:41 am

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Sat Jan 29, 2022 12:19 am

2013 wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 28, 2022 10:33 pm

I heard Foley isn’t actually full market after a few years. Is that true after the latest raises?

No, it’s only market through year 3. Then it’s about 25k below market; someone who knows more than me explained it in more detail above.

That's correct, though the second half is $15-40k below market. And this doesn't detail it, but year end bonus is also at most, half of market. not so bad if you work in a secondary market, in primary markets it sucks. Here's the breakdown:

Associate Tier 1 (years 1-3)
2022 (Stub Yr) $202,500
2021 (Full 1st Yr) $205,000
2020 (Year 2) $220,000
2019 (Year 3) $240,000

Associate Tier 2 (years 4+) which you can jump class years
Level 1 $260,000
Level 2 $275,000
Level 3 $290,000
Level 4 $305,000
Level 5 $320,000
Level 6 $335,000

Senior Counsel starts at $350,000

This is very helpful, thank you. Are bonuses below market in years 1-3, too?

Annan who posted above. take with a grain of salt, as I am sure there is someone out there that disagrees with my view. Bonuses at Foley are all based on performance and then there is some leeway -

for years 1-3, if you bill 2k hours, you should get a minimum of 10% of salary, max of 30%; if you bill 2.2k hours+ you should get a bonus of 20%, max 30% of salary.

For years 4+, if you bill 2k hours, you should get a minimum of 10% of salary, max of 50%; if you bill 2.2k hours+ you should get a bonus of 20%, max 50% of salary.

From personal experience, I don't think they make working much over 2300 hours worth it - most I've seen and heard people get at that level is 30% of salary (still a lot of money) but I know some that were 2.5k and some that were 2.8k hours and they all got 30% - so diminishing returns.

All that said, I've enjoyed my time here- just makes me realize there is not much benefit to going above and beyond.