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DPW v S&C NYC
Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:39 pm
by lawschoolistough23
Any advice for sussing out the difference between the two firms? Both seem absolutely great so far!
Interested chiefly in corporate work (leaning M&A but really just don't have the experience to make a concrete decision at this point). Having a really really hard time drawing out any concrete differences between the two firms.
Re: DPW v S&C NYC
Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:57 pm
by Anonymous User
lawschoolistough23 wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:39 pm
Any advice for sussing out the difference between the two firms? Both seem absolutely great so far!
Interested chiefly in corporate work (leaning M&A but really just don't have the experience to make a concrete decision at this point). Having a really really hard time drawing out any concrete differences between the two firms.
For M&A, I’d pick S&C over DPW.
Re: DPW v S&C NYC
Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:43 pm
by Anonymous User
- Location (DPW in midtown; S&C in FiDi)
- Rotational program (DPW has two 6-month rotations when you start; S&C’s General Practice is a bit more open-ended?)
- Practice area strengths (similar profiles in the grand scheme of things, but edge for DPW in capital markets and restructuring and edge for S&C in M&A)
- Culture/personalities (DPW supposedly genteel and cordial; S&C more hard-charging and intense; but query whether it’s worth putting any stock in these stereotypes)
Re: DPW v S&C NYC
Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:51 pm
by Anonymous User
lawschoolistough23 wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:39 pm
Any advice for sussing out the difference between the two firms? Both seem absolutely great so far!
Interested chiefly in corporate work (leaning M&A but really just don't have the experience to make a concrete decision at this point). Having a really really hard time drawing out any concrete differences between the two firms.
at my school, s&c didn't screen for fit at all - if you interviewed and met their cutoff, you got an offer. i felt like that showed when i did a callback and second-look. i ended up at dpw because i preferred the culture and personalities. if you're truly not set on what you want to do (and don't think you would be after a year of practice), you might prefer s&c for that reason, but their staffing model has pros and cons. i can PM if you have any questions.
Re: DPW v S&C NYC
Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2021 2:24 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 1:51 pm
lawschoolistough23 wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:39 pm
Any advice for sussing out the difference between the two firms? Both seem absolutely great so far!
Interested chiefly in corporate work (leaning M&A but really just don't have the experience to make a concrete decision at this point). Having a really really hard time drawing out any concrete differences between the two firms.
at my school, s&c didn't screen for fit at all - if you interviewed and met their cutoff, you got an offer. i felt like that showed when i did a callback and second-look. i ended up at dpw because i preferred the culture and personalities. if you're truly not set on what you want to do (and don't think you would be after a year of practice), you might prefer s&c for that reason, but their staffing model has pros and cons. i can PM if you have any questions.
def hit me with that PM, would very much appreciate it!
Re: DPW v S&C NYC
Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2021 9:32 am
by Anonymous User
DPW - both have all around top tier corporate practices so either way you go is a win there. DPW is known for having a great culture and really nice people generally and that really goes a long way. If you're working crazy hours it really makes a huge difference when you are doing it with people who you enjoy working with and who appreciate your hard work.
Re: DPW v S&C NYC
Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2021 9:56 am
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Jul 12, 2021 9:32 am
DPW - both have all around top tier corporate practices so either way you go is a win there. DPW is known for having a great culture and really nice people generally and that really goes a long way. If you're working crazy hours it really makes a huge difference when you are doing it with people who you enjoy working with and who appreciate your hard work.
I don't think this is quite true? It's stereotyped for having a "genteel" culture but a similarly passive-aggressive culture as well. Not sure I've heard from anyone outside of law students that DPW has a "great" culture with "really nice" people. They're a great firm with a fine enough culture I'm sure, but def no reason to embellish. A bunch of my friends have left DPW and others are still there, and I don't think any of them would give better than average marks to DPW's culture.
Re: DPW v S&C NYC
Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2021 10:27 am
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Jul 12, 2021 9:56 am
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Jul 12, 2021 9:32 am
DPW - both have all around top tier corporate practices so either way you go is a win there. DPW is known for having a great culture and really nice people generally and that really goes a long way. If you're working crazy hours it really makes a huge difference when you are doing it with people who you enjoy working with and who appreciate your hard work.
I don't think this is quite true? It's stereotyped for having a "genteel" culture but a similarly passive-aggressive culture as well. Not sure I've heard from anyone outside of law students that DPW has a "great" culture with "really nice" people. They're a great firm with a fine enough culture I'm sure, but def no reason to embellish. A bunch of my friends have left DPW and others are still there, and I don't think any of them would give better than average marks to DPW's culture.
Sorry my experience doesn't match your perceived stereotype... I've been to a passive aggressive firm and a just plain aggressive firm and maybe the people here just have me fooled but people seem to be really genuinely friendly. And if they do have me fooled I am fine with that as well as long as they continue to fool me
... look it could be group specific and maybe it's a more recent development but they seem to make a real strong effort to give a positive and friendly work environment and experience for the associates.
Re: DPW v S&C NYC
Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2021 10:46 am
by Anonymous User
OP, you should look into how their work assignment systems differ and relative strengths of practice areas you are interested in. I think being direct vs passive aggressive distinction doesn’t really matter when you are going to be billing 60hrs a week.
Re: DPW v S&C NYC
Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2021 3:12 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Jul 12, 2021 10:46 am
OP, you should look into how their work assignment systems differ and relative strengths of practice areas you are interested in. I think being direct vs passive aggressive distinction doesn’t really matter when you are going to be billing 60hrs a week.
This, in my opinion, is 100% the correct response. I have worked at both of these firms. The lawyers I worked with at both firms were really great people and the "culture" difference (
that term is too loosely thrown around in biglaw IMO to begin with....) is too small to be a meaningful consideration. You're going to work hard at either place, bottom line.
If you are undecided about what practice area you want to work in as a corporate attorney and feel that 18 months of "figuring it out" would be great for you, then that sways towards S&C. If this is less of a concern and two rotations is good for you, then DPW might work. If you want to work in a particular practice area and one firm is stronger than the other in this regard, then go to that respective firm.
Generally, I would not seriously choose the firm over meaningless, broad generalizations about the firm's "culture" that you hear about in law school or read on this message board.
Re: DPW v S&C NYC
Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2021 5:21 pm
by Anonymous User
Made this decision recently so I don’t have enough of a lookback period to say whether I made the right choice, but I will echo others in saying that you should let (i) practice area strengths and (ii) the development models drive your decision-making.
I hear that S&C has super nice benefits and perks, so maybe let that be a tiebreaker if you are truly undecided after considering the two factors above. (I’m being a bit facetious; you should not be undecided after considering those factors.)
Good luck, OP!
Re: DPW v S&C NYC
Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2021 9:50 pm
by Anonymous User
Pretty sure S&C gives a $35 seamless budget while Davis Polk only gives a pitiful $25, the choice is clear.
But really there's no wrong decision and the above is as valid as any other tiebreaker.
Re: DPW v S&C NYC
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 1:44 pm
by Anonymous User
From my experience working with people at both firms and having friends at both firms:
DPW does seem to be insanely passive-aggressive, which is a style I find completely exasperating and counter-productive.
As for S&C, I have not met an associate who has ever said they actually liked it there - the reactions have rather been "meh, I make do" or "I cannot wait to get the f outta here."
Re: DPW v S&C NYC
Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2021 2:12 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 1:44 pm
From my experience working with people at both firms and having friends at both firms:
DPW does seem to be insanely passive-aggressive, which is a style I find completely exasperating and counter-productive.
As for S&C, I have not met an associate who has ever said they actually liked it there - the reactions have rather been "meh, I make do" or "I cannot wait to get the f outta here."
So both are miserable? Yay for NY biglaw!