Using Recruiter Lowers Chance? Forum

[Anonymous User]

Does using a recruiter lower my chances at lateraling? By background, I'm at an Amlaw100 but have mediocre grades (above 3.0, but no top percentage by any means). Would it be better to submit on my own or go through a recruiter? I wonder if a firm would like me better without having to pay a recruiters' fee?

[objctnyrhnr]

Does using a recruiter lower my chances at lateraling? By background, I'm at an Amlaw100 but have mediocre grades (above 3.0, but no top percentage by any means). Would it be better to submit on my own or go through a recruiter? I wonder if a firm would like me better without having to pay a recruiters' fee?

What’s the approximate vault ranking of the firm and how on demand are associates in your area of expertise? Also what year are you.

Regardless of the answer to those questions, common wisdom is that it’s always better to go “through” an associate at the firm. Remember: most firms have a referral bonus so associates have a vested interest in assisting. Is there no way you can go through a connection of a connection? Anybody who knows somebody there and who could send an introductory email?

[Anonymous User]

OP here - I'm in L&E so I think we're in demand? I'm a 4th year. I haven't really tried to go through someone, but I can try. So I would find a job posting and then reach out to a former classmate or someone and try to get it submitted that way? Would it be weird if the person isn't like a friend I regularly interact with?

[objctnyrhnr]

OP here - I'm in L&E so I think we're in demand? I'm a 4th year. I haven't really tried to go through someone, but I can try. So I would find a job posting and then reach out to a former classmate or someone and try to get it submitted that way? Would it be weird if the person isn't like a friend I regularly interact with?

Was just wondering if you were the type of transactional junior/mid that all firms want right now.

Yeah, that’s what I’d do. I don’t think it’s weird. They can always say no. Remember: most v50 firms give several thousand at least in bonuses for referrals.

[hdr]

I have no firsthand knowledge but I can't imagine fees are a huge factor in lateral hiring, especially in this market. Firms can always state "direct submissions only" in their postings (as many do).

Applying through a direct connection is always best, but if you don't know anyone, using a good recruiter increases your chances of being looked at, especially if you're not a perfect match for the posting. Otherwise you risk being screened out by HR.

[Anonymous User]

I think the answer is very much "it depends". If you have a former colleague or classmate with whom you keep in touch who works at a firm you're interested in, I'd absolutely consider hitting them up.

I'd also start answering those calls from recruiters and maybe consider responding to e-mails that seem interesting. Sometimes recruiters will have an established relationship with a particular firm and may either be working on a non-posted position or have just a better ability to get your resume in front of the people who matter. I'd aim to at least work with one recruiter for one posting so you can at least get an extra set of eyes on your resume.

I recently lateraled and sent 3 applications:

• One through a recruiter who is local to my search area and who had an established relationship with the firm. I ended up getting an offer relatively quickly, and I think the recruiter's understanding of what exactly the firm was looking for, both in terms of experience and personality, really helped. I also think this recruiter did a good job of selling me to the firm.

• One through a recruiter who was not local and did not have an established relationship with the firm. I ultimately withdrew from consideration with this firm, but I still thought it was nice to have someone to follow up with the firm on my behalf.

• One through a former colleague. I actually had a poor experience with this. I had a hard time really getting details about the position from recruiting (when I asked the recruiter, she pretty much told me to ask in the interview). That said, this isn't a firm I would have applied to through a recruiter anyway and it ultimately only cost me ~30 mins of time so I don't regret doing it.

[Anonymous User]

Thank you all so much!! How do you know if a recruiter has a good connection with a firm though? I feel like they always say they have good relationships with everyone? I'm in that position where I'm not going to check all the boxes and risk being screened so I'm thinking I would benefit from having either a classmate or a recruiter with an connection advocate for me?

[2013]

I don’t think it lowers your chances, but if you’re not a shoe-in at the firm, the recruiter isn’t going to help.

[Anonymous User]

Double post

[Anonymous User]

Thank you all so much!! How do you know if a recruiter has a good connection with a firm though? I feel like they always say they have good relationships with everyone? I'm in that position where I'm not going to check all the boxes and risk being screened so I'm thinking I would benefit from having either a classmate or a recruiter with an connection advocate for me?

Nobody is connected to every firm. If a recruiter just says "Oh yeah I have connections with all the firms," they're probably full of shit. Neither recruiter I worked with said that to me. I'd be more willing to believe something along the lines of: "I'm working on a particular opening at Firm A. I've placed multiple candidates at Firm A in the last X years. Based on your profile I think you might be a good fit."

I don’t think it lowers your chances, but if you’re not a shoe-in at the firm, the recruiter isn’t going to help.

I think you have that backwards...if you're a shoe-in the recruiter won't help (unless the opening is un-posted) because how could they? But if you're not, a good recruiter can definitely help. I can tell you there is a 0% chance I would have even applied to the position I recently accepted if not for the recruiter telling me that this firm would be interested in talking to me. I definitely was not a shoe-in, either.

[Anonymous User]

Thank you all so much!! How do you know if a recruiter has a good connection with a firm though? I feel like they always say they have good relationships with everyone? I'm in that position where I'm not going to check all the boxes and risk being screened so I'm thinking I would benefit from having either a classmate or a recruiter with an connection advocate for me?

Nobody is connected to every firm. If a recruiter just says "Oh yeah I have connections with all the firms," they're probably full of shit. Neither recruiter I worked with said that to me. I'd be more willing to believe something along the lines of: "I'm working on a particular opening at Firm A. I've placed multiple candidates at Firm A in the last X years. Based on your profile I think you might be a good fit."

I don’t think it lowers your chances, but if you’re not a shoe-in at the firm, the recruiter isn’t going to help.

I think you have that backwards...if you're a shoe-in the recruiter won't help (unless the opening is un-posted) because how could they? But if you're not, a good recruiter can definitely help. I can tell you there is a 0% chance I would have even applied to the position I recently accepted if not for the recruiter telling me that this firm would be interested in talking to me. I definitely was not a shoe-in, either.

This is really helpful. Thank you for giving me some context on what is a realistic recruiter pitch and whether someone like me should use a recruiter. If you really liked your recruiter, would you be willing to share their name or contact either here anonymously or in a PM (whatever you're more comfortable with)?

[2013]

Thank you all so much!! How do you know if a recruiter has a good connection with a firm though? I feel like they always say they have good relationships with everyone? I'm in that position where I'm not going to check all the boxes and risk being screened so I'm thinking I would benefit from having either a classmate or a recruiter with an connection advocate for me?

Nobody is connected to every firm. If a recruiter just says "Oh yeah I have connections with all the firms," they're probably full of shit. Neither recruiter I worked with said that to me. I'd be more willing to believe something along the lines of: "I'm working on a particular opening at Firm A. I've placed multiple candidates at Firm A in the last X years. Based on your profile I think you might be a good fit."

I don’t think it lowers your chances, but if you’re not a shoe-in at the firm, the recruiter isn’t going to help.

I think you have that backwards...if you're a shoe-in the recruiter won't help (unless the opening is un-posted) because how could they? But if you're not, a good recruiter can definitely help. I can tell you there is a 0% chance I would have even applied to the position I recently accepted if not for the recruiter telling me that this firm would be interested in talking to me. I definitely was not a shoe-in, either.

To each his own. I think a majority of lateral hires are competitive associates (maybe not shoe-in) who are busy and don’t want to research the firm themselves. I don’t think an L&E associate at Ogletree or Jackson Lewis or like Polsinelli without a T14 pedigree (or honors at a T50 or so) should use a recruiter to apply to like Proskauer or McDermott. It’s possible that the person could get an offer, but why start at a disadvantage?

OP, there are recruiters who have recommendations on LinkedIn. You can see the types of candidates they usually place. It’ll give you a better idea about what I’m talking about.

I’m not saying it’s impossible to lateral up like that, but it is more difficult and may take over a year. A friend of mine went from a midsize firm in a secondary market to a V20 in NY with mediocre grades from a T50 school using a recruiter, but it took 2 years to get an offer from any market-paying firm.

[nealric]

I don’t think it lowers your chances, but if you’re not a shoe-in at the firm, the recruiter isn’t going to help.

It certainly can lower your chances compared to a good inside connection, but it really depends on the firm. Some firms are just really adverse to paying recruiter fees. This is especially the case when it's not a public listing type situation.

I think recruiters can hurt or help depending on the situation. If you are applying to large offices in a hot practice area where you have no connections and don't have time to work connections yourself, a recruiter can help. This is especially true if the recruiter has worked with the firm before. If you are applying in a small niche practice and/or in a smaller office and you already know people in that office, using a recruiter can be offputting. Recruiters can also be offputting to firms if they are the resume spam variety who don't have any relationship with the firm.

[Anonymous User]

To each his own. I think a majority of lateral hires are competitive associates (maybe not shoe-in) who are busy and don’t want to research the firm themselves. I don’t think an L&E associate at Ogletree or Jackson Lewis or like Polsinelli without a T14 pedigree (or honors at a T50 or so) should use a recruiter to apply to like Proskauer or McDermott. It’s possible that the person could get an offer, but why start at a disadvantage?

OP, there are recruiters who have recommendations on LinkedIn. You can see the types of candidates they usually place. It’ll give you a better idea about what I’m talking about.

I’m not saying it’s impossible to lateral up like that, but it is more difficult and may take over a year. A friend of mine went from a midsize firm in a secondary market to a V20 in NY with mediocre grades from a T50 school using a recruiter, but it took 2 years to get an offer from any market-paying firm.

I'm not really clear why you think it would be disadvantageous for that sort of candidate to use a recruiter versus another candidate...the fact that it took your friend 2 years isn't really evidence of that. We don't know they would have gotten an offer at all without using a recruiter. I don't think the fact that the recruiter gets paid by the firm is enough to support the premise that using a recruiter is a net drag on your chances considering that a good recruiter should also be helping with your resume, searching for and vetting openings (possibly including calling contacts at firms regarding potential unposted openings), feeling out each firm's interest before submitting your resume, marketing you to the firm, etc.

Using a recruiter helped me go from a niche practice area at a V100 to a more marketable practice area at a V10. I have a friend who was the sort of candidate whom you say a recruiter won't help (non-t14, not great grades, non-market-paying firm) and he landed at a V10 through a recruiter. I really don't think either of us would have had those outcomes otherwise. I know a recruiter won't help every person, but they absolutely can be helpful.