Summer Classes 2021 Edition Forum

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Anonymous User
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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:42 pm

Wilson Sonsini (104)

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UT Austin

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Last edited by Anonymous User on Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Monochromatic Oeuvre

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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Monochromatic Oeuvre » Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:37 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:42 pm
Wilson Sonsini (104)

Palo Alto (38)
BYU (6)
Wut

I see 120 2Ls and 18% in the latest BL+FC. And six in one office?

Mormons, please explain the secret Provo to SV pipeline.

Anonymous User
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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:56 pm

Monochromatic Oeuvre wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:37 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:42 pm
Wilson Sonsini (104)

Palo Alto (38)
BYU (6)
Wut

I see 120 2Ls and 18% in the latest BL+FC. And six in one office?

Mormons, please explain the secret Provo to SV pipeline.
OP. I searched firm website upon your comment and they have one partner in Palo Alto corporate from BYU (BA & JD), maybe that partner is a hiring partner? All 6 from BYU are Palo Alto corporate.

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Monochromatic Oeuvre

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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Monochromatic Oeuvre » Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:17 pm

To be fair, every firm has one partner on the management committee who graduated from some TTT in 1980 who asks "Why aren't we recruiting from TTT? I'll bet we could get some great candidates there!", and then recruiting has to fly out to Omaha or Des Moines or Carbondale or whatever and interview a few dozen 152 LSATs to hire one kid and shut that idiot up for another year.

If you've ever seen your firm's OCI schedule and it's like "Harvard, Penn, Duke, Northern Kentucky University", that's what's going on.

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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:18 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:56 pm
Monochromatic Oeuvre wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:37 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:42 pm
Wilson Sonsini (104)

Palo Alto (38)
BYU (6)
Wut

I see 120 2Ls and 18% in the latest BL+FC. And six in one office?

Mormons, please explain the secret Provo to SV pipeline.
OP. I searched firm website upon your comment and they have one partner in Palo Alto corporate from BYU (BA & JD), maybe that partner is a hiring partner? All 6 from BYU are Palo Alto corporate.
Also interesting that WSGR Palo Alto has 0 Stanford. And 0 HYSCCN, for that matter.

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Anonymous User
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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:35 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Tue Apr 06, 2021 2:10 pm
Latham NY (76)

GULC (11)
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St. John’s (1)
Just realized this list is incomplete, and did not include 1L SAs. Roommate went to several firm events this week, and there were def a lot more HLS students, at least according to the attendee roster (maybe ~ 20 across all offices in the nation)

Anonymous User
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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:59 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:56 pm
Monochromatic Oeuvre wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:37 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:42 pm
Wilson Sonsini (104)

Palo Alto (38)
BYU (6)
Wut

I see 120 2Ls and 18% in the latest BL+FC. And six in one office?

Mormons, please explain the secret Provo to SV pipeline.
OP. I searched firm website upon your comment and they have one partner in Palo Alto corporate from BYU (BA & JD), maybe that partner is a hiring partner? All 6 from BYU are Palo Alto corporate.
Mormon, reporting in. Can confirm it's not just one partner. It's been a concerted effort the past few cycles. There are many BYU alums in the ranks, not always from the law school, that actively help with recruiting efforts. This year's summers are a solid group and we're excited to have them join.

Anonymous User
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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:24 pm

Maybe BYU and Howard are peer schools.

Anonymous User
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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:38 pm

WUSTL seems conspicuously absent — where does it place if not NY or DC? Is the biglaw placement there exclusively Chi or something?

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Monochromatic Oeuvre

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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Monochromatic Oeuvre » Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:57 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:24 pm
Maybe BYU and Howard are peer schools.
Find yourself a man who can do both:

https://ualr.edu/law/faculty/faculty-me ... -cummings/

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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:34 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:18 pm
Also interesting that WSGR Palo Alto has 0 Stanford. And 0 HYSCCN, for that matter.
I'm not surprised that there's zero Y or UChi, WSGR's strengths don't line up that much with the strengths/appeal of either school. And to a lesser extent, CLS and NYU as well; just checked Cooley's list earlier in the thread, there's one CLS across their Bay Area offices.

It does seem like Cooley took most of the H and S though.

Anonymous User
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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:42 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:59 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:56 pm
Monochromatic Oeuvre wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:37 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:42 pm
Wilson Sonsini (104)

Palo Alto (38)
BYU (6)
Wut

I see 120 2Ls and 18% in the latest BL+FC. And six in one office?

Mormons, please explain the secret Provo to SV pipeline.
OP. I searched firm website upon your comment and they have one partner in Palo Alto corporate from BYU (BA & JD), maybe that partner is a hiring partner? All 6 from BYU are Palo Alto corporate.
Mormon, reporting in. Can confirm it's not just one partner. It's been a concerted effort the past few cycles. There are many BYU alums in the ranks, not always from the law school, that actively help with recruiting efforts. This year's summers are a solid group and we're excited to have them join.
Just out of curiosity, are there many Mormons that intentionally attend BYU instead of, say, T14?

Anonymous User
Posts: 428113
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:58 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:42 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:59 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:56 pm
Monochromatic Oeuvre wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:37 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:42 pm
Wilson Sonsini (104)

Palo Alto (38)
BYU (6)
Wut

I see 120 2Ls and 18% in the latest BL+FC. And six in one office?

Mormons, please explain the secret Provo to SV pipeline.
OP. I searched firm website upon your comment and they have one partner in Palo Alto corporate from BYU (BA & JD), maybe that partner is a hiring partner? All 6 from BYU are Palo Alto corporate.
Mormon, reporting in. Can confirm it's not just one partner. It's been a concerted effort the past few cycles. There are many BYU alums in the ranks, not always from the law school, that actively help with recruiting efforts. This year's summers are a solid group and we're excited to have them join.
Just out of curiosity, are there many Mormons that intentionally attend BYU instead of, say, T14?
Yeah that happens, LDS members get super-cheap tuition, lots of them are married which constrains mobility, and only Chicago has a big Mormon contingent among the T14. It's part of why BYU's medians are in the vicinity of like GULC's.

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Ultramar vistas

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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Ultramar vistas » Wed Apr 07, 2021 9:54 pm

In my experience, schools based around an affinity group, like Howard, BYU, Notre Dame to some extent, outperform their USNews ranking for members of that affinity group, because it’s a huge networking boost.

As identified, that one Partner from [Tulane] absolutely freakin’ loves to hire from [Tulane] - but magnify that 100% when community/religion comes into it too.

If you’re a member of a group like that, I’d advise that you lean into it when picking your school, so long as you aren’t actively dropping down the rankings. A Mormon at BYU might well be better placed than a Mormon at a marginally higher ranked school, for many outcomes, anyway.

Anonymous User
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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:26 pm

Ultramar vistas wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 9:54 pm
In my experience, schools based around an affinity group, like Howard, BYU, Notre Dame to some extent, outperform their USNews ranking for members of that affinity group, because it’s a huge networking boost.

As identified, that one Partner from [Tulane] absolutely freakin’ loves to hire from [Tulane] - but magnify that 100% when community/religion comes into it too.

If you’re a member of a group like that, I’d advise that you lean into it when picking your school, so long as you aren’t actively dropping down the rankings. A Mormon at BYU might well be better placed than a Mormon at a marginally higher ranked school, for many outcomes, anyway.
"Mormon" OP above. I get your point generally, but speaking specifically to this case, our BYU recruiting efforts are not about religion or even community (though I have nothing against either). Not everyone who attends BYU is active LDS, and we certainly wouldn't ask people that during the recruiting process. I am LDS and I will tell you we're not trying to hire Mormons; we're trying to hire law students we hope will be great associates. BYU is doing a good job training talent with an interest in entrepreneurship, technology and the work we do, and demonstrated interest goes a long way here. Plus, Utah tech has been on fire the past few years, so many candidates are coming to us with practical experience at local start-ups, PE/VC shops and student clubs that directly relate to our key practice areas.

I'll go to bat for a candidate like that any day. Except Sunday. Obviously.

2013

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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by 2013 » Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:48 pm

Why are people so shocked by BYU? It’s always been ranked around schools that have great biglaw placement (Fordham). Compared to Fordham, I think BYU’s biglaw placement is meh.

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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:56 pm

Ultramar vistas wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 9:54 pm
In my experience, schools based around an affinity group, like Howard, BYU, Notre Dame to some extent, outperform their USNews ranking for members of that affinity group, because it’s a huge networking boost.

As identified, that one Partner from [Tulane] absolutely freakin’ loves to hire from [Tulane] - but magnify that 100% when community/religion comes into it too.

If you’re a member of a group like that, I’d advise that you lean into it when picking your school, so long as you aren’t actively dropping down the rankings. A Mormon at BYU might well be better placed than a Mormon at a marginally higher ranked school, for many outcomes, anyway.
Cardozo for sure has some of this going on too

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Anonymous User
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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Apr 08, 2021 12:07 am

Anyone have Kirkland NY?

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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Apr 08, 2021 1:47 am

A little bit of an explanation for the WSGR BYU numbers. As mentioned, WSGR has been recruiting a couple summers from BYU each year, with an increasing number. But WSGR usually does most of its recruiting through pre-OCI. This year, WSGR made offers to BYU students before many other firms had started interviewing and set those offers to expire before the students would hear back from other firms. This left the students in a tricky position--either say yes to the sure bet at WSGR, or say no for a shot at biglaw elsewhere (which is definitely not a given coming from BYU). In short, WSGR normally extends 5-6 offers to BYU students and has 2-3 acceptances, but this year I think they had 100% yield.

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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Apr 08, 2021 2:34 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 1:47 am
But WSGR usually does most of its recruiting through pre-OCI. This year, WSGR made offers to BYU students before many other firms had started interviewing and set those offers to expire before the students would hear back from other firms.
Interesting to hear about pre-OCI. WSGR seems to have made far fewer offers than usual at my school this year and we have a pretty strict policy against pre-OCI interviewing, so could be that there were only a few spots left in the class by the time OCI rolled around.

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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Apr 08, 2021 2:40 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 12:07 am
Anyone have Kirkland NY?
They haven't sent out a list yet

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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Apr 08, 2021 9:02 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:38 pm
WUSTL seems conspicuously absent — where does it place if not NY or DC? Is the biglaw placement there exclusively Chi or something?
WUSTL dominates the STL market even if there are only like 20-25 spots in "Big Law". If WUSTL sends a little over 50 of its students into 500+ firms, like 15-20 of those will be into the big local STL firms like Bryan Cave, Husch Blackwell, and Thompson Coburn.

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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Apr 08, 2021 9:13 am

Monochromatic Oeuvre wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:37 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:42 pm
Wilson Sonsini (104)

Palo Alto (38)
BYU (6)
Wut

I see 120 2Ls and 18% in the latest BL+FC. And six in one office?

Mormons, please explain the secret Provo to SV pipeline.
Mormon church in many ways is a large professional network, and mormons help each other. Mormons are also in many ways "ideal" employees from the perspective of risk-adverse firms.

No drugs/alcohol/tattoos or anything else "unprofessional." Also likely to have multiple kids in early/late twenties, and corresponding financial pressure to earn & provide for the kids (=very hard worker who really needs the income and will put up with a lot of BS).

It's also a thing for investment banking. For a non-target school, BYU overperforms and basically everyone in Utah who wants investment banking has to go to BYU to participate in their recruitment events.

Lastly, BYU poaches a handful of really bright students every year from higher ranked schools because Mormons like to stay in Utah close to family + the lower tuition at BYU. I think BYU occasionally even places people into SCOTUS clerkships b/c of this.

Anonymous User
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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Apr 08, 2021 9:32 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 9:13 am
Monochromatic Oeuvre wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:37 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:42 pm
Wilson Sonsini (104)

Palo Alto (38)
BYU (6)
Wut

I see 120 2Ls and 18% in the latest BL+FC. And six in one office?

Mormons, please explain the secret Provo to SV pipeline.
Mormon church in many ways is a large professional network, and mormons help each other. Mormons are also in many ways "ideal" employees from the perspective of risk-adverse firms.

No drugs/alcohol/tattoos or anything else "unprofessional." Also likely to have multiple kids in early/late twenties, and corresponding financial pressure to earn & provide for the kids (=very hard worker who really needs the income and will put up with a lot of BS).

It's also a thing for investment banking. For a non-target school, BYU overperforms and basically everyone in Utah who wants investment banking has to go to BYU to participate in their recruitment events.

Lastly, BYU poaches a handful of really bright students every year from higher ranked schools because Mormons like to stay in Utah close to family + the lower tuition at BYU. I think BYU occasionally even places people into SCOTUS clerkships b/c of this.
I also suspect that schools who have a particular pull for a particular group (BYU for Mormons, Notre Dame for Catholics, HBCU for African Americans) can draw a decent chunk of students who could attend a "better" school but chose not to. This dynamic means that the top of the class at these schools is probably better regarded than the top of the class at similarly ranked schools in the USNEWS rankings. Just my off the cuff take here.

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Re: Summer Classes 2021 Edition

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Apr 08, 2021 9:52 am

Interested in the large NY classes ... anybody have: Cravath, SullCrom, STB, Cleary, Skadden, Debevoise, etc.?

Seriously? What are you waiting for?

Now there's a charge.
Just kidding ... it's still FREE!


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