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Dentons Project "Golden Spike"
Posted: Sun Dec 27, 2020 7:10 pm
by Anonymous User
Dentons has launched a series of "combinations" trying to enter all of the top 100 legal markets in the U.S. It's recently merged with:
Bingham Greenebaum (IN/OH/KY)
Cohen & Grigsby (PA)
Davis Brown (IA)
Durham Jones Pinegar (UT)
Sirote (AL)
And possibly others. Does anyone know what these deals are like or have any thoughts? Salary, partnership tracks, whether there's any real integration, etc.? I was considering moving to one of these firms in the near-ish future but I'm now somewhat concerned. Presumably a lot more are coming.
I know Dentons is a verein so it might not mean much beyond networking, tech sharing, etc. But this strategy seems high-risk, with the potential to dilute whatever prestige these firms (previously) and Dentons (currently) have, cause political problems with rapid expansion into very different markets very quickly, add a bunch of not-great partners to the firm (none of these are the top firms in their markets afaik), eventually erode partnership tracks and prospects in satellites, etc. It looks like Bingham Greenebaum was somewhat struggling pre-merger and others might've been as well.
Re: Dentons Project "Golden Spike"
Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2020 12:46 am
by Sackboy
It means nothing. Dentons will continue to be a massive firm that does unprestigious low margin mid-market work.
Re: Dentons Project "Golden Spike"
Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2020 8:47 am
by bodylikeatwizzler
Sackboy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 12:46 am
It means nothing. Dentons will continue to be a massive firm that does unprestigious low margin mid-market work.
"Mid-market" companies aren't "prestigious" enough for your amazing life, Sackboy? You're mortified at the thought of doing legal work for them, because it would humiliate you in the eyes of the good looking successful circle you run in? Come on Sackboy, pull up a mirror, ask yourself why you post online all day and realize that putting Denton's down won't change any of that.
Re: Dentons Project "Golden Spike"
Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2020 9:37 am
by JusticeSquee
Sackboy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 12:46 am
It means nothing. Dentons will continue to be a massive firm that does unprestigious low margin mid-market work.
Yep, its an entirely irrelevant firm that no one in the top tier considers a peer.
Re: Dentons Project "Golden Spike"
Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2020 11:49 am
by Anonymous User
Sackboy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 12:46 am
It means nothing. Dentons will continue to be a massive firm that does unprestigious low margin mid-market work.
OP here. I realize it probably means little for e.g. NYC, but for most of us interested in these markets, it’s not like the alternative is Wachtell, low-margin mid-market work is inevitable. I’m more interested in it from the perspective of the firms being merged in.
Re: Dentons Project "Golden Spike"
Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2020 1:00 pm
by Sackboy
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 11:49 am
Sackboy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 12:46 am
It means nothing. Dentons will continue to be a massive firm that does unprestigious low margin mid-market work.
OP here. I realize it probably means little for e.g. NYC, but for most of us interested in these markets, it’s not like the alternative is Wachtell, low-margin mid-market work is inevitable. I’m more interested in it from the perspective of the firms being merged in.
I think my answer still remains the same regarding the type of work that the firm will do. These firms now probably just have better technology platforms and administration than they used to. They also might have better referral streams and can sell their bids for legal work more competitively (e.g. we used to not be able to handle X aspect of the transaction, but now we have someone in Y office that can do that too). My biggest worry would be that it makes getting equity more tricky if you now need to convince the U.S. equity partners and not just the [insert state/city] equity partners that you should get equity.
Re: Dentons Project "Golden Spike"
Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2020 1:20 pm
by Auxilio
bodylikeatwizzler wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 8:47 am
Sackboy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 12:46 am
It means nothing. Dentons will continue to be a massive firm that does unprestigious low margin mid-market work.
"Mid-market" companies aren't "prestigious" enough for your amazing life, Sackboy? You're mortified at the thought of doing legal work for them, because it would humiliate you in the eyes of the good looking successful circle you run in? Come on Sackboy, pull up a mirror, ask yourself why you post online all day and realize that putting Denton's down won't change any of that.
I don't think Sackboy's comment was particularly insulting or anything. They didn't say it was a trash firm or something, but it's just denial to suggest his description isn't accurate of the type of work they focus on.
It's not a bad thing, it's a spot in the market that they are very strong in. Just like Target isn't really worse than Nordstrom.
Re: Dentons Project "Golden Spike"
Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2020 3:45 pm
by malibustacy
The Walmart of law firms.
Re: Dentons Project "Golden Spike"
Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2020 9:10 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Dec 27, 2020 7:10 pm
Dentons has launched a series of "combinations" trying to enter all of the top 100 legal markets in the U.S. It's recently merged with:
Bingham Greenebaum (IN/OH/KY)
Cohen & Grigsby (PA)
Davis Brown (IA)
Durham Jones Pinegar (UT)
Sirote (AL)
And possibly others. Does anyone know what these deals are like or have any thoughts? Salary, partnership tracks, whether there's any real integration, etc.? I was considering moving to one of these firms in the near-ish future but I'm now somewhat concerned. Presumably a lot more are coming.
I know Dentons is a verein so it might not mean much beyond networking, tech sharing, etc. But this strategy seems high-risk, with the potential to dilute whatever prestige these firms (previously) and Dentons (currently) have, cause political problems with rapid expansion into very different markets very quickly, add a bunch of not-great partners to the firm (none of these are the top firms in their markets afaik), eventually erode partnership tracks and prospects in satellites, etc. It looks like Bingham Greenebaum was somewhat struggling pre-merger and others might've been as well.
I am very close with a Cohen & Grigsby partner. Your intuition is correct: it doesn't mean much in terms of day-to-day firm life. The firm is now called "Dentons Cohen & Grigsby," its management is essentially independent, etc. It's mostly a referral system (and, to a lesser extent, a branding one: apparently clients like the idea of a "global" law firm on their side even if they're only doing local deals.) Apparently they're also trying to be a one-stop shop for BigLaw / major corporate clients looking for local counsel across America. From our conversations it sounds more like a franchise agreement than a merger.
Re: Dentons Project "Golden Spike"
Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2020 9:33 pm
by avenuem
malibustacy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 3:45 pm
The Walmart of law firms.
Does Dentons pay market, at least during first years? Salary data not available on NALP or Vault, but ranked in the 50s on vault.
Re: Dentons Project "Golden Spike"
Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2020 9:47 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue Dec 29, 2020 9:10 pm
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Sun Dec 27, 2020 7:10 pm
Dentons has launched a series of "combinations" trying to enter all of the top 100 legal markets in the U.S. It's recently merged with:
Bingham Greenebaum (IN/OH/KY)
Cohen & Grigsby (PA)
Davis Brown (IA)
Durham Jones Pinegar (UT)
Sirote (AL)
And possibly others. Does anyone know what these deals are like or have any thoughts? Salary, partnership tracks, whether there's any real integration, etc.? I was considering moving to one of these firms in the near-ish future but I'm now somewhat concerned. Presumably a lot more are coming.
I know Dentons is a verein so it might not mean much beyond networking, tech sharing, etc. But this strategy seems high-risk, with the potential to dilute whatever prestige these firms (previously) and Dentons (currently) have, cause political problems with rapid expansion into very different markets very quickly, add a bunch of not-great partners to the firm (none of these are the top firms in their markets afaik), eventually erode partnership tracks and prospects in satellites, etc. It looks like Bingham Greenebaum was somewhat struggling pre-merger and others might've been as well.
I am very close with a Cohen & Grigsby partner. Your intuition is correct: it doesn't mean much in terms of day-to-day firm life. The firm is now called "Dentons Cohen & Grigsby," its management is essentially independent, etc. It's mostly a referral system (and, to a lesser extent, a branding one: apparently clients like the idea of a "global" law firm on their side even if they're only doing local deals.) Apparently they're also trying to be a one-stop shop for BigLaw / major corporate clients looking for local counsel across America. From our conversations it sounds more like a franchise agreement than a merger.
OP. Thank you, this is helpful.
Re: Dentons Project "Golden Spike"
Posted: Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:43 pm
by Anonymous User
avenuem wrote: ↑Tue Dec 29, 2020 9:33 pm
malibustacy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 3:45 pm
The Walmart of law firms.
Does Dentons pay market, at least during first years? Salary data not available on NALP or Vault, but ranked in the 50s on vault.
They do not pay market
Re: Dentons Project "Golden Spike"
Posted: Tue Jan 12, 2021 4:55 pm
by Anonymous User
Yea I was recently recruited to lateral into Dentons in a secondary market (like TX/FL/GA/NC) from a boutique firm in that same market that does that specific practice area. I don't like my current boutique gig but I also am not excited about Denton's except potential to work remotely anywhere/across nation (since the practice group I'd be in is small and all over)and salary. Anyone have any insights into what its like to work at Dentons (and not one of newly merged smaller firms)?