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Anonymous User
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Sat Nov 21, 2020 1:40 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 12:54 am
lolwutpar wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 2:54 pm

San Diego is great, but if you like "big city" things like culture (art, museums, plays, concerts), fine dining, etc. you WILL miss it. But of course, there are big upsides, too, such as mild weather and great outdoor options.
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 2:55 pm

This is OP — this move definitely happens, but I don't have a lot of insight into how often it works out. My office had a lateral join from NYC/DC a little over a year ago and they had zero ties to SD. As the other commenter mentioned, their "why SD" was also essentially it seems like an amazing place to live and raise a family. Definitely visit (or at least say you're familiar with SD) since there is a slight concern that people will lateral in from larger markets, realize that they miss the bigger city vibe, and then leave for like LA/SF.

Does your firm have an office in SD? My office has also had a few transfers from major markets since the pandemic started. I personally think you and your wife should try to make this move. While the pandemic has been rough, it's definitely easier to get through when you live in a place with great weather and lots of outdoor activities that are fairly spread out. Also, SD is expensive, but it's relatively affordable compared to other coastal cities, and I think the quality of life makes it worth it.

Are you in lit or corporate?

Thanks to you both for the responses. Very encouraging. In no particular order:

- I don't consider us to be into big-city culture -- basically what I think of as NYC culture. We occasionally go to the museums here, we went to Hamilton, etc., but while we appreciate the arts/concerts/etc., they aren't a big part of our lives. We also aren't really foodies (we do like Mexican, which is a plus for SD, although I'm guessing it's more authentic than what we're used to). When I said above that we're interested in SD culture, I basically meant a culture of outdoors/chill/SoCal/liberal-ish.

- By contrast, we love the outdoors, and it's really important to us. And we love good weather (who doesn't, but we really do). I don't know if seasonal affective disorder is a real thing, but I get depressed in Chicago when outside becomes unusable for at least five straight months. And my wife can't handle heat and humidity very well.

- We're going to live and work remotely in SD for a month in early 2021 to get a feel for the place. No better time to do it than now, when I haven't been into the office for 7 months and probably won't be until summer. We're splitting our time between downtown Chula Vista, North Park, and Carlsbad. Hoping to get a better sense of the place. And perhaps that would help with a "why SD" question down the line. We've visited sporadically before and loved it, but we've never had an extended stay.

- I'm in general lit. My firm has an LA office, but not SD, unfortunately. One thing I've thought about trying is to "transfer" to our LA office -- i.e., have that office as my "home base" -- but basically work remotely, since the last 8 months have shown that I can do that with zero real effect on my value/productivity. Then, if I ever need to change jobs, I'll already have a foothold in the market. Not sure if my firm will go for it, as I'm fairly senior and that play would probably be perceived as opting out of the partnership track (and my firm is basically up or out). If not, I'm willing to change jobs, but I know that will be tough without ties. That said, I have a pretty strong resume.

- We'd like to own a modest, fairly nice home with a backyard (even if not a big one) in a decent neighborhood (doesn't have to be trendy), with a family in mind fairly soon. It seems like that combo requires at least $800k, but probably closer to $1m. Our nest egg is more than big enough for a downpayment on a house like that, but it makes me queasy to own that much home, in part because I don't want to be tied to a $3k mortgage and the kind of job that comes with it. I might just have to get over it.

Thanks again for your thoughts.
One of the nice things about SD (and California in general) is that you can enjoy the beach, mountains, and desert all pretty easily. Like you can get from SD to Joshua Tree in under 3 hours. You and your wife should definitely check out Julian when you’re here for a month. Julian is a quaint little mountain town that’s about an hour drive from SD with some decent hiking trails, and the Julian Pie Company has some pretty killer apple pies.

I wouldn’t worry too much about your “why SD.” It sounds like you definitely have a sufficient reason for moving to SD that will come across as genuine. Lolwutpar can probably provide you with insights into lateraling if you decide to do it since they recently made that move.

If you have any questions about lit in SD, I’m happy to answer any questions. I’m also in lit. That transfer plan seems like a solid plan if you don’t want to try to lateral directly into SD. Fwiw, I have a friend from law school who landed a job in OC, and her fiancée was able to transfer to his firm’s LA office from NYC. He worked there for a little less than a year before lateraling to a firm in OC, so it’s definitely doable.

I’m not sure if you saw my other comment about where people tend to live, but several more senior associates at my firm who have small children have fairly recently purchased homes in Carlsbad (decent neighborhoods and homes with backyards) for close to $1m.

Anonymous User
Posts: 428105
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Sat Nov 21, 2020 3:03 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 1:40 pm

One of the nice things about SD (and California in general) is that you can enjoy the beach, mountains, and desert all pretty easily. Like you can get from SD to Joshua Tree in under 3 hours. You and your wife should definitely check out Julian when you’re here for a month. Julian is a quaint little mountain town that’s about an hour drive from SD with some decent hiking trails, and the Julian Pie Company has some pretty killer apple pies.

I wouldn’t worry too much about your “why SD.” It sounds like you definitely have a sufficient reason for moving to SD that will come across as genuine. Lolwutpar can probably provide you with insights into lateraling if you decide to do it since they recently made that move.

If you have any questions about lit in SD, I’m happy to answer any questions. I’m also in lit. That transfer plan seems like a solid plan if you don’t want to try to lateral directly into SD. Fwiw, I have a friend from law school who landed a job in OC, and her fiancée was able to transfer to his firm’s LA office from NYC. He worked there for a little less than a year before lateraling to a firm in OC, so it’s definitely doable.

I’m not sure if you saw my other comment about where people tend to live, but several more senior associates at my firm who have small children have fairly recently purchased homes in Carlsbad (decent neighborhoods and homes with backyards) for close to $1m.
Thanks for the Julian recommendation. Hiking and apple pie sounds like the perfect combination.

For lit, what's the market like outside of big shops? I'd be interested in a solid mid-sized firm, or even a reputable plaintiff's firm. I don't think my personality is compatible with BL long term.

Thanks for the heads up on Carlsbad. I'm glad we're staying there for a bit next year. I'm not wild about a longer commute, but you can't have everything.

Anonymous User
Posts: 428105
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Sat Nov 21, 2020 4:00 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 3:03 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 1:40 pm

One of the nice things about SD (and California in general) is that you can enjoy the beach, mountains, and desert all pretty easily. Like you can get from SD to Joshua Tree in under 3 hours. You and your wife should definitely check out Julian when you’re here for a month. Julian is a quaint little mountain town that’s about an hour drive from SD with some decent hiking trails, and the Julian Pie Company has some pretty killer apple pies.

I wouldn’t worry too much about your “why SD.” It sounds like you definitely have a sufficient reason for moving to SD that will come across as genuine. Lolwutpar can probably provide you with insights into lateraling if you decide to do it since they recently made that move.

If you have any questions about lit in SD, I’m happy to answer any questions. I’m also in lit. That transfer plan seems like a solid plan if you don’t want to try to lateral directly into SD. Fwiw, I have a friend from law school who landed a job in OC, and her fiancée was able to transfer to his firm’s LA office from NYC. He worked there for a little less than a year before lateraling to a firm in OC, so it’s definitely doable.

I’m not sure if you saw my other comment about where people tend to live, but several more senior associates at my firm who have small children have fairly recently purchased homes in Carlsbad (decent neighborhoods and homes with backyards) for close to $1m.
Thanks for the Julian recommendation. Hiking and apple pie sounds like the perfect combination.

For lit, what's the market like outside of big shops? I'd be interested in a solid mid-sized firm, or even a reputable plaintiff's firm. I don't think my personality is compatible with BL long term.

Thanks for the heads up on Carlsbad. I'm glad we're staying there for a bit next year. I'm not wild about a longer commute, but you can't have everything.
Unfortunately, there aren't a lot of solid mid-sized firms here. It probably has something to do with the fact that SD is a smaller legal market, a lot of big law associates tend to stick around longer than in other markets, and some senior associates leave to hang their own shingle. For mid-sized firms, I would personally consider Allen Matkins — they are CA firm mainly known for their real estate work, but have a solid litigation group in SD. The people are very laidback in my experience and it seems like they have a better work-life balance (comp is also probably going to be better than some other mid-sized firms here—a 7th year is probably looking at like $235K base, bonuses are tiered and based on billable hours, and the firm does 401K matching). Other mid-sized firms that come to mind are Stoel Rives (I believe they mainly do energy work at the moment, but they've been trying to grow the office), Procopio, Dinsmore & Shohl, Best Best & Krieger, Higgs Fletcher & Mack, Seltzer Caplan, Paul Plevin is a great firm if you want to try to switch to L&E lit (I've known a few people who have made this change), and Hooper, Lundy & Bookman (solid health care-focused firm with lit). Robbins Geller is probably the best plaintiff's firm here and it's a fairly large office since it's the firm's headquarters.

A lot of people also go into government. CA DOJ has a large office in SD, offers solid pay, and a pretty good work-life. There's also a large USAO office — the Major Frauds and Public Corruption Section handles some pretty high profile and interesting cases here (also largely made up of ex big law associates).

Hope that helps!

Anonymous User
Posts: 428105
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Sat Nov 21, 2020 11:30 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 4:00 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 3:03 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 1:40 pm

One of the nice things about SD (and California in general) is that you can enjoy the beach, mountains, and desert all pretty easily. Like you can get from SD to Joshua Tree in under 3 hours. You and your wife should definitely check out Julian when you’re here for a month. Julian is a quaint little mountain town that’s about an hour drive from SD with some decent hiking trails, and the Julian Pie Company has some pretty killer apple pies.

I wouldn’t worry too much about your “why SD.” It sounds like you definitely have a sufficient reason for moving to SD that will come across as genuine. Lolwutpar can probably provide you with insights into lateraling if you decide to do it since they recently made that move.

If you have any questions about lit in SD, I’m happy to answer any questions. I’m also in lit. That transfer plan seems like a solid plan if you don’t want to try to lateral directly into SD. Fwiw, I have a friend from law school who landed a job in OC, and her fiancée was able to transfer to his firm’s LA office from NYC. He worked there for a little less than a year before lateraling to a firm in OC, so it’s definitely doable.

I’m not sure if you saw my other comment about where people tend to live, but several more senior associates at my firm who have small children have fairly recently purchased homes in Carlsbad (decent neighborhoods and homes with backyards) for close to $1m.
Thanks for the Julian recommendation. Hiking and apple pie sounds like the perfect combination.

For lit, what's the market like outside of big shops? I'd be interested in a solid mid-sized firm, or even a reputable plaintiff's firm. I don't think my personality is compatible with BL long term.

Thanks for the heads up on Carlsbad. I'm glad we're staying there for a bit next year. I'm not wild about a longer commute, but you can't have everything.
Unfortunately, there aren't a lot of solid mid-sized firms here. It probably has something to do with the fact that SD is a smaller legal market, a lot of big law associates tend to stick around longer than in other markets, and some senior associates leave to hang their own shingle. For mid-sized firms, I would personally consider Allen Matkins — they are CA firm mainly known for their real estate work, but have a solid litigation group in SD. The people are very laidback in my experience and it seems like they have a better work-life balance (comp is also probably going to be better than some other mid-sized firms here—a 7th year is probably looking at like $235K base, bonuses are tiered and based on billable hours, and the firm does 401K matching). Other mid-sized firms that come to mind are Stoel Rives (I believe they mainly do energy work at the moment, but they've been trying to grow the office), Procopio, Dinsmore & Shohl, Best Best & Krieger, Higgs Fletcher & Mack, Seltzer Caplan, Paul Plevin is a great firm if you want to try to switch to L&E lit (I've known a few people who have made this change), and Hooper, Lundy & Bookman (solid health care-focused firm with lit). Robbins Geller is probably the best plaintiff's firm here and it's a fairly large office since it's the firm's headquarters.

A lot of people also go into government. CA DOJ has a large office in SD, offers solid pay, and a pretty good work-life. There's also a large USAO office — the Major Frauds and Public Corruption Section handles some pretty high profile and interesting cases here (also largely made up of ex big law associates).

Hope that helps!
This is a wealth of information. Incredibly helpful. Thank you.

Anonymous User
Posts: 428105
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Sun Nov 29, 2020 1:30 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 11:30 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 4:00 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 3:03 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 1:40 pm

One of the nice things about SD (and California in general) is that you can enjoy the beach, mountains, and desert all pretty easily. Like you can get from SD to Joshua Tree in under 3 hours. You and your wife should definitely check out Julian when you’re here for a month. Julian is a quaint little mountain town that’s about an hour drive from SD with some decent hiking trails, and the Julian Pie Company has some pretty killer apple pies.

I wouldn’t worry too much about your “why SD.” It sounds like you definitely have a sufficient reason for moving to SD that will come across as genuine. Lolwutpar can probably provide you with insights into lateraling if you decide to do it since they recently made that move.

If you have any questions about lit in SD, I’m happy to answer any questions. I’m also in lit. That transfer plan seems like a solid plan if you don’t want to try to lateral directly into SD. Fwiw, I have a friend from law school who landed a job in OC, and her fiancée was able to transfer to his firm’s LA office from NYC. He worked there for a little less than a year before lateraling to a firm in OC, so it’s definitely doable.

I’m not sure if you saw my other comment about where people tend to live, but several more senior associates at my firm who have small children have fairly recently purchased homes in Carlsbad (decent neighborhoods and homes with backyards) for close to $1m.
Thanks for the Julian recommendation. Hiking and apple pie sounds like the perfect combination.

For lit, what's the market like outside of big shops? I'd be interested in a solid mid-sized firm, or even a reputable plaintiff's firm. I don't think my personality is compatible with BL long term.

Thanks for the heads up on Carlsbad. I'm glad we're staying there for a bit next year. I'm not wild about a longer commute, but you can't have everything.
Unfortunately, there aren't a lot of solid mid-sized firms here. It probably has something to do with the fact that SD is a smaller legal market, a lot of big law associates tend to stick around longer than in other markets, and some senior associates leave to hang their own shingle. For mid-sized firms, I would personally consider Allen Matkins — they are CA firm mainly known for their real estate work, but have a solid litigation group in SD. The people are very laidback in my experience and it seems like they have a better work-life balance (comp is also probably going to be better than some other mid-sized firms here—a 7th year is probably looking at like $235K base, bonuses are tiered and based on billable hours, and the firm does 401K matching). Other mid-sized firms that come to mind are Stoel Rives (I believe they mainly do energy work at the moment, but they've been trying to grow the office), Procopio, Dinsmore & Shohl, Best Best & Krieger, Higgs Fletcher & Mack, Seltzer Caplan, Paul Plevin is a great firm if you want to try to switch to L&E lit (I've known a few people who have made this change), and Hooper, Lundy & Bookman (solid health care-focused firm with lit). Robbins Geller is probably the best plaintiff's firm here and it's a fairly large office since it's the firm's headquarters.

A lot of people also go into government. CA DOJ has a large office in SD, offers solid pay, and a pretty good work-life. There's also a large USAO office — the Major Frauds and Public Corruption Section handles some pretty high profile and interesting cases here (also largely made up of ex big law associates).

Hope that helps!
This is a wealth of information. Incredibly helpful. Thank you.
I just found out that the California Bar doesn't have reciprocity with any other states. Taking the bar again (even the one-day version) would be a huge buzzkill. Ugh.

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Anonymous User
Posts: 428105
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Dec 03, 2020 3:00 am

This thread seems pretty accurate and generally agreed that SD is a good place to work for biglaw. It is still biglaw and there are notable exceptions (for example Paul Hastings has a bad rep afaik), but mostly places are pretty chill. When I work with partners in NY I'm like whoa fuck off. Even LA culture is markedly different.

Also whoever said in this thread that they were looking for a home with a nice sized yard between 800k-1m, realistically I would add another 200k if you're anywhere near the 5 (east or west) in north county. If you go down into clairemont i guess you could find an old house for around 800-900k. The other person said they had colleagues buy in carlsbad for around 1m, but stuff like that is going to be rare if it's worth buying (for family purposes) and I think the norm is closer to 1.2m these days.

Anonymous User
Posts: 428105
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Dec 03, 2020 11:18 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 3:00 am

Also whoever said in this thread that they were looking for a home with a nice sized yard between 800k-1m, realistically I would add another 200k if you're anywhere near the 5 (east or west) in north county. If you go down into clairemont i guess you could find an old house for around 800-900k. The other person said they had colleagues buy in carlsbad for around 1m, but stuff like that is going to be rare if it's worth buying (for family purposes) and I think the norm is closer to 1.2m these days.
Thanks for this.

Are there any good cheaper neighborhoods that people don't live in because they're bad for commuting (I assume that why you're referring to the 5), but would be suitable for a post-COVID world in which we aren't in the office every day?

Anonymous User
Posts: 428105
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Dec 03, 2020 1:44 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Nov 29, 2020 1:30 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 11:30 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 4:00 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 3:03 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 1:40 pm

One of the nice things about SD (and California in general) is that you can enjoy the beach, mountains, and desert all pretty easily. Like you can get from SD to Joshua Tree in under 3 hours. You and your wife should definitely check out Julian when you’re here for a month. Julian is a quaint little mountain town that’s about an hour drive from SD with some decent hiking trails, and the Julian Pie Company has some pretty killer apple pies.

I wouldn’t worry too much about your “why SD.” It sounds like you definitely have a sufficient reason for moving to SD that will come across as genuine. Lolwutpar can probably provide you with insights into lateraling if you decide to do it since they recently made that move.

If you have any questions about lit in SD, I’m happy to answer any questions. I’m also in lit. That transfer plan seems like a solid plan if you don’t want to try to lateral directly into SD. Fwiw, I have a friend from law school who landed a job in OC, and her fiancée was able to transfer to his firm’s LA office from NYC. He worked there for a little less than a year before lateraling to a firm in OC, so it’s definitely doable.

I’m not sure if you saw my other comment about where people tend to live, but several more senior associates at my firm who have small children have fairly recently purchased homes in Carlsbad (decent neighborhoods and homes with backyards) for close to $1m.
Thanks for the Julian recommendation. Hiking and apple pie sounds like the perfect combination.

For lit, what's the market like outside of big shops? I'd be interested in a solid mid-sized firm, or even a reputable plaintiff's firm. I don't think my personality is compatible with BL long term.

Thanks for the heads up on Carlsbad. I'm glad we're staying there for a bit next year. I'm not wild about a longer commute, but you can't have everything.
Unfortunately, there aren't a lot of solid mid-sized firms here. It probably has something to do with the fact that SD is a smaller legal market, a lot of big law associates tend to stick around longer than in other markets, and some senior associates leave to hang their own shingle. For mid-sized firms, I would personally consider Allen Matkins — they are CA firm mainly known for their real estate work, but have a solid litigation group in SD. The people are very laidback in my experience and it seems like they have a better work-life balance (comp is also probably going to be better than some other mid-sized firms here—a 7th year is probably looking at like $235K base, bonuses are tiered and based on billable hours, and the firm does 401K matching). Other mid-sized firms that come to mind are Stoel Rives (I believe they mainly do energy work at the moment, but they've been trying to grow the office), Procopio, Dinsmore & Shohl, Best Best & Krieger, Higgs Fletcher & Mack, Seltzer Caplan, Paul Plevin is a great firm if you want to try to switch to L&E lit (I've known a few people who have made this change), and Hooper, Lundy & Bookman (solid health care-focused firm with lit). Robbins Geller is probably the best plaintiff's firm here and it's a fairly large office since it's the firm's headquarters.

A lot of people also go into government. CA DOJ has a large office in SD, offers solid pay, and a pretty good work-life. There's also a large USAO office — the Major Frauds and Public Corruption Section handles some pretty high profile and interesting cases here (also largely made up of ex big law associates).

Hope that helps!
This is a wealth of information. Incredibly helpful. Thank you.
I just found out that the California Bar doesn't have reciprocity with any other states. Taking the bar again (even the one-day version) would be a huge buzzkill. Ugh.
Yeah, it's definitely a bummer, but fwiw, I have a colleague who lateraled from the east coast a few years ago and they said that taking the bar again wasn't nearly as bad the second time around. CA also lowered its passing score a few months ago.

Anonymous User
Posts: 428105
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Dec 03, 2020 2:38 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 11:18 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 3:00 am

Also whoever said in this thread that they were looking for a home with a nice sized yard between 800k-1m, realistically I would add another 200k if you're anywhere near the 5 (east or west) in north county. If you go down into clairemont i guess you could find an old house for around 800-900k. The other person said they had colleagues buy in carlsbad for around 1m, but stuff like that is going to be rare if it's worth buying (for family purposes) and I think the norm is closer to 1.2m these days.
Thanks for this.

Are there any good cheaper neighborhoods that people don't live in because they're bad for commuting (I assume that why you're referring to the 5), but would be suitable for a post-COVID world in which we aren't in the office every day?
I don't know about costs specifically, but I've met a lot of professional families that live in 4S ranch and Del Sur, and they told me they chose those communities because they could get more house for the price. For example, I knew a guy that sold a $2M house in Del Mar to move to a bigger, cheaper house in Del Sur. Those families say good things about the communities. For me, though, I moved to San Diego to have easy access to surfing, so I'm not willing to move too far east. As a result, I'm going to rent for life because any house I'd consider acceptable in the neighborhoods I like are going for over $2M, and I'd rather not owe the bank that much.

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Anonymous User
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Dec 03, 2020 3:07 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 2:38 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 11:18 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 3:00 am

Also whoever said in this thread that they were looking for a home with a nice sized yard between 800k-1m, realistically I would add another 200k if you're anywhere near the 5 (east or west) in north county. If you go down into clairemont i guess you could find an old house for around 800-900k. The other person said they had colleagues buy in carlsbad for around 1m, but stuff like that is going to be rare if it's worth buying (for family purposes) and I think the norm is closer to 1.2m these days.
Thanks for this.

Are there any good cheaper neighborhoods that people don't live in because they're bad for commuting (I assume that why you're referring to the 5), but would be suitable for a post-COVID world in which we aren't in the office every day?
I don't know about costs specifically, but I've met a lot of professional families that live in 4S ranch and Del Sur, and they told me they chose those communities because they could get more house for the price. For example, I knew a guy that sold a $2M house in Del Mar to move to a bigger, cheaper house in Del Sur. Those families say good things about the communities. For me, though, I moved to San Diego to have easy access to surfing, so I'm not willing to move too far east. As a result, I'm going to rent for life because any house I'd consider acceptable in the neighborhoods I like are going for over $2M, and I'd rather not owe the bank that much.
Got it, thanks. I think we'd want to stay closer to the cost as well, primarily for the weather. My understanding is that it gets quite a bit hotter/colder more than 10 miles from the coast. But yeah, $2M is a non-starter. That's partially why we're interested in west Chula, although maybe those neighborhoods are too sketchy.
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 1:44 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Nov 29, 2020 1:30 pm

I just found out that the California Bar doesn't have reciprocity with any other states. Taking the bar again (even the one-day version) would be a huge buzzkill. Ugh.
Yeah, it's definitely a bummer, but fwiw, I have a colleague who lateraled from the east coast a few years ago and they said that taking the bar again wasn't nearly as bad the second time around. CA also lowered its passing score a few months ago.
Cool, thanks.

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logical seasoning

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Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by logical seasoning » Thu Dec 03, 2020 10:39 pm

What do you know of Government Jobs in San Diego? I know the AG's office has a branch, but anything else?

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Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:48 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 3:07 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 2:38 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 11:18 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 3:00 am

Also whoever said in this thread that they were looking for a home with a nice sized yard between 800k-1m, realistically I would add another 200k if you're anywhere near the 5 (east or west) in north county. If you go down into clairemont i guess you could find an old house for around 800-900k. The other person said they had colleagues buy in carlsbad for around 1m, but stuff like that is going to be rare if it's worth buying (for family purposes) and I think the norm is closer to 1.2m these days.
Thanks for this.

Are there any good cheaper neighborhoods that people don't live in because they're bad for commuting (I assume that why you're referring to the 5), but would be suitable for a post-COVID world in which we aren't in the office every day?
I don't know about costs specifically, but I've met a lot of professional families that live in 4S ranch and Del Sur, and they told me they chose those communities because they could get more house for the price. For example, I knew a guy that sold a $2M house in Del Mar to move to a bigger, cheaper house in Del Sur. Those families say good things about the communities. For me, though, I moved to San Diego to have easy access to surfing, so I'm not willing to move too far east. As a result, I'm going to rent for life because any house I'd consider acceptable in the neighborhoods I like are going for over $2M, and I'd rather not owe the bank that much.
Got it, thanks. I think we'd want to stay closer to the cost as well, primarily for the weather. My understanding is that it gets quite a bit hotter/colder more than 10 miles from the coast. But yeah, $2M is a non-starter. That's partially why we're interested in west Chula, although maybe those neighborhoods are too sketchy.
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 1:44 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Sun Nov 29, 2020 1:30 pm

I just found out that the California Bar doesn't have reciprocity with any other states. Taking the bar again (even the one-day version) would be a huge buzzkill. Ugh.
Yeah, it's definitely a bummer, but fwiw, I have a colleague who lateraled from the east coast a few years ago and they said that taking the bar again wasn't nearly as bad the second time around. CA also lowered its passing score a few months ago.
Cool, thanks.

Chula Vista is going to be a haul from most firms. Like I mentioned before, I think Clairemont is probably a good area to keep an eye on (just south of university city). The houses are going to be a bit older, but it's centrally located and a bit cheaper.
logical seasoning wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 10:39 pm
What do you know of Government Jobs in San Diego? I know the AG's office has a branch, but anything else?

AG's office, AUSA, City of San Diego (and other cities I guess), the County, and Navy all have regular openings. There aren't a lot of other federal or state jobs here for attorneys here unless you're willing to do ICE. Most state stuff is located in Sacramento with SF and LA having some as well.

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logical seasoning

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Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by logical seasoning » Fri Dec 04, 2020 8:39 pm

logical seasoning wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 10:39 pm
What do you know of Government Jobs in San Diego? I know the AG's office has a branch, but anything else?

AG's office, AUSA, City of San Diego (and other cities I guess), the County, and Navy all have regular openings. There aren't a lot of other federal or state jobs here for attorneys here unless you're willing to do ICE. Most state stuff is located in Sacramento with SF and LA having some as well.
[/quote]

Thank you, yeah I am in Sacramento living that sweet Govt life and am not sure I can do much else in the law. However, my family is down in SD and I don't see myself crafting a life in Sac long term.

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Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Sat Dec 05, 2020 4:53 pm

logical seasoning wrote:
Fri Dec 04, 2020 8:39 pm
logical seasoning wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 10:39 pm
What do you know of Government Jobs in San Diego? I know the AG's office has a branch, but anything else?

AG's office, AUSA, City of San Diego (and other cities I guess), the County, and Navy all have regular openings. There aren't a lot of other federal or state jobs here for attorneys here unless you're willing to do ICE. Most state stuff is located in Sacramento with SF and LA having some as well.
Thank you, yeah I am in Sacramento living that sweet Govt life and am not sure I can do much else in the law. However, my family is down in SD and I don't see myself crafting a life in Sac long term.
[/quote]

I hear you, I am in biglaw right now, but wish I was in govt -- just not a ton of options down here. If some of the agencies actually employed attorneys at the regional offices it would be sweet. Do you think COVID will change how your govt office views telework?

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Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Sat Dec 05, 2020 5:24 pm

I grew up in University City (but no longer live in San Diego). It's a great neighborhood - it's relatively central (and incredibly convenient if you work near UTC), a good place to raise a family, and not nearly as expensive as the North County neighborhoods. I think some of the nicer suburbs off the 15 (north of the 52 - Scripps Ranch, Mt. Carmel, etc.) are a pretty good bang for your buck as well, although the weather is not as nice and the commute can be a pain. Clairemont is kind of a dump and the schools are not good at all, but Bay Park/Bay Ho are significantly nicer. Obviously the North County neighborhoods (and La Jolla) are the nicest and have the best schools, but you are definitely paying a premium for that.

I have no real view on the "nice" parts of Chula Vista/the South Bay, except to say that they are a huge pain to get to if you work in UTC or north of the merge. The commute is probably doable if you work downtown.

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Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by lolwutpar » Sat Dec 05, 2020 8:27 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Dec 05, 2020 5:24 pm
I grew up in University City (but no longer live in San Diego). It's a great neighborhood - it's relatively central (and incredibly convenient if you work near UTC), a good place to raise a family, and not nearly as expensive as the North County neighborhoods. I think some of the nicer suburbs off the 15 (north of the 52 - Scripps Ranch, Mt. Carmel, etc.) are a pretty good bang for your buck as well, although the weather is not as nice and the commute can be a pain. Clairemont is kind of a dump and the schools are not good at all, but Bay Park/Bay Ho are significantly nicer. Obviously the North County neighborhoods (and La Jolla) are the nicest and have the best schools, but you are definitely paying a premium for that.

I have no real view on the "nice" parts of Chula Vista/the South Bay, except to say that they are a huge pain to get to if you work in UTC or north of the merge. The commute is probably doable if you work downtown.
Clairemont has changed a lot and is still changing. As the older folks move out/die out, the houses are getting re-done and sold to mostly white collar professionals. Especially when you're west of Genesee on the Mount Streets and around the canyons, the houses ain't cheap and it's certainly not a dump. The schools are hit or miss - you have some great elementary schools and you have charter schools like High Tech High Mesa that may not be the BEST, but they are better than the other schools in Clairemont.

A decent house in Clairemont will be north of $800k these days. It's not cheap, but it's a better value than UTC and it's still an absurdly close commute to UTC if that's where you work. And you're closer to Convoy if you like Asian food and NP, Hillcrest, etc. if you want some semblance of nightlife or restaurants.

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Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Sun Dec 06, 2020 3:04 am

lolwutpar wrote:
Sat Dec 05, 2020 8:27 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Sat Dec 05, 2020 5:24 pm
I grew up in University City (but no longer live in San Diego). It's a great neighborhood - it's relatively central (and incredibly convenient if you work near UTC), a good place to raise a family, and not nearly as expensive as the North County neighborhoods. I think some of the nicer suburbs off the 15 (north of the 52 - Scripps Ranch, Mt. Carmel, etc.) are a pretty good bang for your buck as well, although the weather is not as nice and the commute can be a pain. Clairemont is kind of a dump and the schools are not good at all, but Bay Park/Bay Ho are significantly nicer. Obviously the North County neighborhoods (and La Jolla) are the nicest and have the best schools, but you are definitely paying a premium for that.

I have no real view on the "nice" parts of Chula Vista/the South Bay, except to say that they are a huge pain to get to if you work in UTC or north of the merge. The commute is probably doable if you work downtown.
Clairemont has changed a lot and is still changing. As the older folks move out/die out, the houses are getting re-done and sold to mostly white collar professionals. Especially when you're west of Genesee on the Mount Streets and around the canyons, the houses ain't cheap and it's certainly not a dump. The schools are hit or miss - you have some great elementary schools and you have charter schools like High Tech High Mesa that may not be the BEST, but they are better than the other schools in Clairemont.

A decent house in Clairemont will be north of $800k these days. It's not cheap, but it's a better value than UTC and it's still an absurdly close commute to UTC if that's where you work. And you're closer to Convoy if you like Asian food and NP, Hillcrest, etc. if you want some semblance of nightlife or restaurants.
I’m the former UC resident. I haven’t lived in San Diego for over a decade so you might be right, and Claremont west of Genesee is certainly better than the rest of Clairemont (especially as you go further south).

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Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Fri Dec 11, 2020 4:41 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 2:38 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 11:18 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 3:00 am

Also whoever said in this thread that they were looking for a home with a nice sized yard between 800k-1m, realistically I would add another 200k if you're anywhere near the 5 (east or west) in north county. If you go down into clairemont i guess you could find an old house for around 800-900k. The other person said they had colleagues buy in carlsbad for around 1m, but stuff like that is going to be rare if it's worth buying (for family purposes) and I think the norm is closer to 1.2m these days.
Thanks for this.

Are there any good cheaper neighborhoods that people don't live in because they're bad for commuting (I assume that why you're referring to the 5), but would be suitable for a post-COVID world in which we aren't in the office every day?
I don't know about costs specifically, but I've met a lot of professional families that live in 4S ranch and Del Sur, and they told me they chose those communities because they could get more house for the price. For example, I knew a guy that sold a $2M house in Del Mar to move to a bigger, cheaper house in Del Sur. Those families say good things about the communities. For me, though, I moved to San Diego to have easy access to surfing, so I'm not willing to move too far east. As a result, I'm going to rent for life because any house I'd consider acceptable in the neighborhoods I like are going for over $2M, and I'd rather not owe the bank that much.
There's also Rancho Penasquitos (just south of Del Sur) if you're okay with about 40 year old housing stock. There's an elementary school there that has a Mandarin immersion program if that's something you care about. The district is aiming to expand the program through high school. Poway has some great homes under $2M (large lots, single-story mansions) if you're willing to endure the summer heat. Great schools all along that 56 stretch and along the coast there in North County. Check out Piggington's Econo-Almanac for more information on the housing market there. It has a pretty active forum, with useful local information from residents. Finance attorney in NYC, but moving to SD. Can answer questions if helpful.

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Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Fri Dec 11, 2020 5:32 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 4:41 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 2:38 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 11:18 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 3:00 am

Also whoever said in this thread that they were looking for a home with a nice sized yard between 800k-1m, realistically I would add another 200k if you're anywhere near the 5 (east or west) in north county. If you go down into clairemont i guess you could find an old house for around 800-900k. The other person said they had colleagues buy in carlsbad for around 1m, but stuff like that is going to be rare if it's worth buying (for family purposes) and I think the norm is closer to 1.2m these days.
Thanks for this.

Are there any good cheaper neighborhoods that people don't live in because they're bad for commuting (I assume that why you're referring to the 5), but would be suitable for a post-COVID world in which we aren't in the office every day?
I don't know about costs specifically, but I've met a lot of professional families that live in 4S ranch and Del Sur, and they told me they chose those communities because they could get more house for the price. For example, I knew a guy that sold a $2M house in Del Mar to move to a bigger, cheaper house in Del Sur. Those families say good things about the communities. For me, though, I moved to San Diego to have easy access to surfing, so I'm not willing to move too far east. As a result, I'm going to rent for life because any house I'd consider acceptable in the neighborhoods I like are going for over $2M, and I'd rather not owe the bank that much.
There's also Rancho Penasquitos (just south of Del Sur) if you're okay with about 40 year old housing stock. There's an elementary school there that has a Mandarin immersion program if that's something you care about. The district is aiming to expand the program through high school. Poway has some great homes under $2M (large lots, single-story mansions) if you're willing to endure the summer heat. Great schools all along that 56 stretch and along the coast there in North County. Check out Piggington's Econo-Almanac for more information on the housing market there. It has a pretty active forum, with useful local information from residents. Finance attorney in NYC, but moving to SD. Can answer questions if helpful.
What made you decide to transfer/lateral to SD? How hard was it to land in SD? Is your firm giving you any time off to study for the CA bar?

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Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Fri Dec 11, 2020 5:42 pm

Not sure if this is because of COVID, but it seems like a lot of people at my firm are trying to transfer to SD right now.

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Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Fri Dec 11, 2020 5:48 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 5:42 pm
Not sure if this is because of COVID, but it seems like a lot of people at my firm are trying to transfer to SD right now.
San Diego real estate is crazy fucking expensive right now. It's like all the people that left high density cities chose SD. Totally sucks.

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Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Fri Dec 11, 2020 5:53 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 5:48 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 5:42 pm
Not sure if this is because of COVID, but it seems like a lot of people at my firm are trying to transfer to SD right now.
San Diego real estate is crazy fucking expensive right now. It's like all the people that left high density cities chose SD. Totally sucks.
Right? It's insane. One of my friends listed their home and received an all-cash offer above asking the same day.

I was talking to a partner the other day and he mentioned that our office has received roughly 10 transfer requests in the last couple of months, which is pretty mind-blowing when you consider the size of most of the big firms here.

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Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by lolwutpar » Fri Dec 11, 2020 6:29 pm

If you're already in California, San Diego RE is cheaper than LA and the Bay. And you have the weather factor. I can see why people would want to flock here. The houses are downright bargains compared to the Bay.

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Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Fri Dec 11, 2020 7:22 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 5:32 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 4:41 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 2:38 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 11:18 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 3:00 am

Also whoever said in this thread that they were looking for a home with a nice sized yard between 800k-1m, realistically I would add another 200k if you're anywhere near the 5 (east or west) in north county. If you go down into clairemont i guess you could find an old house for around 800-900k. The other person said they had colleagues buy in carlsbad for around 1m, but stuff like that is going to be rare if it's worth buying (for family purposes) and I think the norm is closer to 1.2m these days.
Thanks for this.

Are there any good cheaper neighborhoods that people don't live in because they're bad for commuting (I assume that why you're referring to the 5), but would be suitable for a post-COVID world in which we aren't in the office every day?
I don't know about costs specifically, but I've met a lot of professional families that live in 4S ranch and Del Sur, and they told me they chose those communities because they could get more house for the price. For example, I knew a guy that sold a $2M house in Del Mar to move to a bigger, cheaper house in Del Sur. Those families say good things about the communities. For me, though, I moved to San Diego to have easy access to surfing, so I'm not willing to move too far east. As a result, I'm going to rent for life because any house I'd consider acceptable in the neighborhoods I like are going for over $2M, and I'd rather not owe the bank that much.
There's also Rancho Penasquitos (just south of Del Sur) if you're okay with about 40 year old housing stock. There's an elementary school there that has a Mandarin immersion program if that's something you care about. The district is aiming to expand the program through high school. Poway has some great homes under $2M (large lots, single-story mansions) if you're willing to endure the summer heat. Great schools all along that 56 stretch and along the coast there in North County. Check out Piggington's Econo-Almanac for more information on the housing market there. It has a pretty active forum, with useful local information from residents. Finance attorney in NYC, but moving to SD. Can answer questions if helpful.
What made you decide to transfer/lateral to SD? How hard was it to land in SD? Is your firm giving you any time off to study for the CA bar?
From CA originally and moving back there to raise family. Alternative is to stay in NY and move up to Westchester (will enjoy a lower state income tax that way), but we're going to give it a try in SD first. May ultimately move out of SD depending on how the career goes. Already have the CA bar, but most firms will give you time to study and take the bar.

Someone had commented elsewhere, but yes... the SD RE market is on fire. Glad to see Rancho P. is still relatively affordable; not sure why though given it's in an excellent location... so if someone has any insight, please do share.

SD legal market for leveraged finance is almost non-existent, so there were limited options when I lateralled (most of these jobs being in LA). It seems like there's a small (but larger than finance for sure) footprint for M&A and capital markets, probably tied to the EC/VC practice.

Just another thing to add about the neighborhoods along the 56—if it’s 80F in Del Mar/Carmel Valley (by the coast), it’ll be about 90F in Rancho P./Del Sur/4S and 100F in Poway (east of the 15), but evening temperatures are about the same I think (50-60F).

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Re: San Diego Legal Market AMA

Post by Anonymous User » Sat Dec 12, 2020 9:06 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri Dec 11, 2020 4:41 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 2:38 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 11:18 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Dec 03, 2020 3:00 am

Also whoever said in this thread that they were looking for a home with a nice sized yard between 800k-1m, realistically I would add another 200k if you're anywhere near the 5 (east or west) in north county. If you go down into clairemont i guess you could find an old house for around 800-900k. The other person said they had colleagues buy in carlsbad for around 1m, but stuff like that is going to be rare if it's worth buying (for family purposes) and I think the norm is closer to 1.2m these days.
Thanks for this.

Are there any good cheaper neighborhoods that people don't live in because they're bad for commuting (I assume that why you're referring to the 5), but would be suitable for a post-COVID world in which we aren't in the office every day?
I don't know about costs specifically, but I've met a lot of professional families that live in 4S ranch and Del Sur, and they told me they chose those communities because they could get more house for the price. For example, I knew a guy that sold a $2M house in Del Mar to move to a bigger, cheaper house in Del Sur. Those families say good things about the communities. For me, though, I moved to San Diego to have easy access to surfing, so I'm not willing to move too far east. As a result, I'm going to rent for life because any house I'd consider acceptable in the neighborhoods I like are going for over $2M, and I'd rather not owe the bank that much.
There's also Rancho Penasquitos (just south of Del Sur) if you're okay with about 40 year old housing stock. There's an elementary school there that has a Mandarin immersion program if that's something you care about. The district is aiming to expand the program through high school. Poway has some great homes under $2M (large lots, single-story mansions) if you're willing to endure the summer heat. Great schools all along that 56 stretch and along the coast there in North County. Check out Piggington's Econo-Almanac for more information on the housing market there. It has a pretty active forum, with useful local information from residents. Finance attorney in NYC, but moving to SD. Can answer questions if helpful.
OP here--thanks for the tips, especially about Piggington's. Interesting stuff. Maybe I'll hold off a year or two and see if the COVID-inspired frenzy calms down at all.

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