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State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Tue May 19, 2020 1:46 pm
by Anonymous User
Can anyone weigh in on the state of BK hiring right now? Any insight as to Kirland/Weil's strategy to bulk up their BK groups?
On a more specific note, does anyone want to take a stab at what the market will look like for DE/SDNY BK clerks whose terms will be ending in 2021?
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Tue May 19, 2020 4:30 pm
by Anonymous User
Anon For obvious reasons - I received a nice big signing bonus to switch firms as a restructuring associate. I don’t think everyone lateraling among restructuring practices right now is getting one, but I know some are.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Tue May 19, 2020 5:11 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue May 19, 2020 4:30 pm
Anon For obvious reasons - I received a nice big signing bonus to switch firms as a restructuring associate. I don’t think everyone lateraling among restructuring practices right now is getting one, but I know some are.
Any more info on the firms? I understand if you can't be any more specific.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Wed May 20, 2020 11:06 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue May 19, 2020 5:11 pm
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue May 19, 2020 4:30 pm
Anon For obvious reasons - I received a nice big signing bonus to switch firms as a restructuring associate. I don’t think everyone lateraling among restructuring practices right now is getting one, but I know some are.
Any more info on the firms? I understand if you can't be any more specific.
The top shops - wouldn’t expect a bonus from DLA restructuring or anything like that
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Thu May 21, 2020 6:53 pm
by Anonymous User
Mid-level here. Market has been very hot. We can basically relocate wherever we want and there are some signing bonuses available.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Thu May 21, 2020 8:19 pm
by Sackboy
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed May 20, 2020 11:06 pm
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue May 19, 2020 5:11 pm
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Tue May 19, 2020 4:30 pm
Anon For obvious reasons - I received a nice big signing bonus to switch firms as a restructuring associate. I don’t think everyone lateraling among restructuring practices right now is getting one, but I know some are.
Any more info on the firms? I understand if you can't be any more specific.
The top shops - wouldn’t expect a bonus from DLA restructuring or anything like that
I'd be wary of taking the $$$ at Kirkland/Weil, assuming those are the firms offering big lateral bonuses (Kirkland definitely has a history of it). When this all dies down, I'm sure it's going to be a fight to stay on when they cull the heard. If I'm somewhere that's already lean and that went from moderately busy to very busy, I'd probably just stick it out there, because I'm probably not on the chopping block when things return back to normal. I've heard some BK horror stories after some big restructurings have ended, though not necessarily at Kirkland/Weil.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 4:30 pm
by Anonymous User
Anon Kirkland bk associate.
We've been insanely busy, but we haven't added any associates during this time. I wouldn't know if there are hires in the works, but don't think we will add significantly. We've been steadily growing our group the past several years already, and they've been staffing cases with a lot of corporate associates.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 4:38 pm
by decimalsanddollars
I think the "top shops, not DLA" is kinda the opposite of what's actually going on. Most firms that can hire right now are trying to beef up their just-okay bk/restr practices, rather than the big debtor shops adding bodies (as anon K&E indicated). I'd be looking one notch below the top for hot hiring right now.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 5:28 pm
by jarofsoup
I am not sure that taking the sign up bonus for a place like Weil or Kirkland is worth it.
I know Weil laid off associates after Westinghouse ended. Sure they will do so after this big rush. Plus I really don’t want to work 300 hours a month.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 8:08 pm
by Anonymous User
I have restructuring lit and M&A experience. I am in M&A. Advice for me, a junior aiming to switch to BK/RS pls? How to sell myself? How can I leverage existing experience to that area - I honestly have little idea, a lot of RS seems quite financy. I will soon be out of a job and M&A is dead.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 8:21 pm
by Anonymous User
You have worked on bankruptcy and done finance. You want to do 100% bankruptcy.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Fri May 22, 2020 11:01 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Fri May 22, 2020 8:08 pm
I have restructuring lit and M&A experience. I am in M&A. Advice for me, a junior aiming to switch to BK/RS pls? How to sell myself? How can I leverage existing experience to that area - I honestly have little idea, a lot of RS seems quite financy. I will soon be out of a job and M&A is dead.
Anon bk associate again. To poster above you, would be surprised KE is giving lateral bonuses. Really don't think we are hiring at all. Sound advice to stay away from this place right now, hours are inhumane. Hoping things will normalize come July.
In terms of leveraging yourself, probably most important thing is being able to demonstrate a genuine interest in bk. Otherwise, normal interview stuff. Highlight areas that are applicable.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Wed Jul 08, 2020 1:04 am
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Fri May 22, 2020 11:01 pm
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Fri May 22, 2020 8:08 pm
I have restructuring lit and M&A experience. I am in M&A. Advice for me, a junior aiming to switch to BK/RS pls? How to sell myself? How can I leverage existing experience to that area - I honestly have little idea, a lot of RS seems quite financy. I will soon be out of a job and M&A is dead.
Anon bk associate again. To poster above you, would be surprised KE is giving lateral bonuses. Really don't think we are hiring at all. Sound advice to stay away from this place right now, hours are inhumane. Hoping things will normalize come July.
In terms of leveraging yourself, probably most important thing is being able to demonstrate a genuine interest in bk. Otherwise, normal interview stuff. Highlight areas that are applicable.
So now that July is here, have things normalized?
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Wed Jul 08, 2020 1:24 pm
by Anonymous User
jarofsoup wrote: ↑Fri May 22, 2020 5:28 pm
I am not sure that taking the sign up bonus for a place like Weil or Kirkland is worth it.
I know Weil laid off associates after Westinghouse ended. Sure they will do so after this big rush. Plus I really don’t want to work 300 hours a month.
Bizarre post that isn't remotely true. Weil in particular has been incredibly busy essentially nonstop since the big lateral hires they made in 2015.
As to the OP, Weil and KE are both absurdly busy at the moment (I'm talking 3,000 + hours average across the entire group). Both are actively looking to hire and I have anecdotally heard are offering signing bonuses. Latham has also been hiring associates and partners like crazy though no signing bonuses. Not as familiar with other firms but would expect them to be hiring as well.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Wed Jul 08, 2020 1:31 pm
by jarofsoup
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Jul 08, 2020 1:24 pm
jarofsoup wrote: ↑Fri May 22, 2020 5:28 pm
I am not sure that taking the sign up bonus for a place like Weil or Kirkland is worth it.
I know Weil laid off associates after Westinghouse ended. Sure they will do so after this big rush. Plus I really don’t want to work 300 hours a month.
Bizarre post that isn't remotely true. Weil in particular has been incredibly busy essentially nonstop since the big lateral hires they made in 2015.
As to the OP, Weil and KE are both absurdly busy at the moment (I'm talking 3,000 + hours average across the entire group). Both are actively looking to hire and I have anecdotally heard are offering signing bonuses. Latham has also been hiring associates and partners like crazy though no signing bonuses. Not as familiar with other firms but would expect them to be hiring as well.
Do you work at Weil? How do you know it is not true?
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Wed Jul 08, 2020 1:43 pm
by Anonymous User
jarofsoup wrote: ↑Wed Jul 08, 2020 1:31 pm
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Wed Jul 08, 2020 1:24 pm
jarofsoup wrote: ↑Fri May 22, 2020 5:28 pm
I am not sure that taking the sign up bonus for a place like Weil or Kirkland is worth it.
I know Weil laid off associates after Westinghouse ended. Sure they will do so after this big rush. Plus I really don’t want to work 300 hours a month.
Bizarre post that isn't remotely true. Weil in particular has been incredibly busy essentially nonstop since the big lateral hires they made in 2015.
As to the OP, Weil and KE are both absurdly busy at the moment (I'm talking 3,000 + hours average across the entire group). Both are actively looking to hire and I have anecdotally heard are offering signing bonuses. Latham has also been hiring associates and partners like crazy though no signing bonuses. Not as familiar with other firms but would expect them to be hiring as well.
Do you work at Weil? How do you know it is not true?
Because I worked at Weil in their restructuring group at the time, though I don't anymore. Aside from that, Westinghouse emerged from chapter 11 two weeks before Sears filed and two months before PG&E filed. Weil wasn't looking to downsize at that time.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Wed Jul 08, 2020 2:50 pm
by jarofsoup
If you say so....
Anyway you are right that Latham is going gangbusters. I would also imagine that the Delaware shops are very busy.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:48 am
by Anonymous User
jarofsoup wrote: ↑Wed Jul 08, 2020 2:50 pm
If you say so....
Anyway you are right that Latham is going gangbusters. I would also imagine that the Delaware shops are very busy.
Weil BFR aggressively pushes out substandard associates even when they are slammed (maybe because of it, not in spite of it). That’s not up for debate
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:45 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:48 am
jarofsoup wrote: ↑Wed Jul 08, 2020 2:50 pm
If you say so....
Anyway you are right that Latham is going gangbusters. I would also imagine that the Delaware shops are very busy.
Weil BFR aggressively pushes out substandard associates even when they are slammed (maybe because of it, not in spite of it). That’s not up for debate
Are they pushed out, or do they quit of their own volition? I saw posts about a string of associate departures from Weil in mid-late 2019, when they were already understaffed. As it was described to me, it sounded like they quit, not that they were shoved out the door.
I'd be very surprised to hear that the group would shoot itself in the foot by reducing headcount, especially when they're already falling well behind Kirkland on market share. I have zero insider knowledge of what's going on here, but it looks to me like a staffing problem, not a reputational problem. The work is out there, and Weil's reputation seems to be just as good as Kirkland's. So I can only conclude that Weil's considerably lower number of filings is because they can't staff additional work (supported by way lower headcount overall), not an inability to obtain it ab initio.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Thu Jul 09, 2020 1:53 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:45 pm
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:48 am
jarofsoup wrote: ↑Wed Jul 08, 2020 2:50 pm
If you say so....
Anyway you are right that Latham is going gangbusters. I would also imagine that the Delaware shops are very busy.
Weil BFR aggressively pushes out substandard associates even when they are slammed (maybe because of it, not in spite of it). That’s not up for debate
Are they pushed out, or do they quit of their own volition? I saw posts about a string of associate departures from Weil in mid-late 2019, when they were already understaffed. As it was described to me, it sounded like they quit, not that they were shoved out the door.
I'd be very surprised to hear that the group would shoot itself in the foot by reducing headcount, especially when they're already falling well behind Kirkland on market share. I have zero insider knowledge of what's going on here, but it looks to me like a staffing problem, not a reputational problem. The work is out there, and Weil's reputation seems to be just as good as Kirkland's. So I can only conclude that Weil's considerably lower number of filings is because they can't staff additional work (supported by way lower headcount overall), not an inability to obtain it ab initio.
Former Weil associate from above, there's been considerable turnover in the last two years in large part due to workload, the large majority of which were voluntary. I can think of two or three associates that were "pushed out" and I will say that they were... deserved. I'm not really sure where the "aggressively" pushing out associates thing is coming from. Look, the group is slammed, they're not trying to reduce headcount and have everyone work that much harder.
Also think market share in this context can be a bit misleading, the KE group is significantly bigger than Weil's group. Doing a quick search on the respective websites you'll see ~100 people in restructuring at Weil and ~450 at KE. KE was on fire earlier this year with filings and Weil has been on fire more recently (I count 4 in the past few weeks (including some big names: Brooks Brothers, Chuck E. Cheese, 24 Hour Fitness). I imagine Weil is at capacity, and I imagine KE is too. Which goes back to the original point of the thread, which is that both are hiring, and both will probably give you a signing bonus to go there.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:05 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:45 pm
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:48 am
jarofsoup wrote: ↑Wed Jul 08, 2020 2:50 pm
If you say so....
Anyway you are right that Latham is going gangbusters. I would also imagine that the Delaware shops are very busy.
Weil BFR aggressively pushes out substandard associates even when they are slammed (maybe because of it, not in spite of it). That’s not up for debate
Are they pushed out, or do they quit of their own volition? I saw posts about a string of associate departures from Weil in mid-late 2019, when they were already understaffed. As it was described to me, it sounded like they quit, not that they were shoved out the door.
I'd be very surprised to hear that the group would shoot itself in the foot by reducing headcount, especially when they're already falling well behind Kirkland on market share. I have zero insider knowledge of what's going on here, but it looks to me like a staffing problem, not a reputational problem. The work is out there, and Weil's reputation seems to be just as good as Kirkland's. So I can only conclude that Weil's considerably lower number of filings is because they can't staff additional work (supported by way lower headcount overall), not an inability to obtain it ab initio.
Many on both sides - plenty quitting and being pushed out. Tons of turnover in the group, which is certainly playing a role in how far behind kirkland they have fallen
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:08 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 1:53 pm
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:45 pm
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:48 am
jarofsoup wrote: ↑Wed Jul 08, 2020 2:50 pm
If you say so....
Anyway you are right that Latham is going gangbusters. I would also imagine that the Delaware shops are very busy.
Weil BFR aggressively pushes out substandard associates even when they are slammed (maybe because of it, not in spite of it). That’s not up for debate
Are they pushed out, or do they quit of their own volition? I saw posts about a string of associate departures from Weil in mid-late 2019, when they were already understaffed. As it was described to me, it sounded like they quit, not that they were shoved out the door.
I'd be very surprised to hear that the group would shoot itself in the foot by reducing headcount, especially when they're already falling well behind Kirkland on market share. I have zero insider knowledge of what's going on here, but it looks to me like a staffing problem, not a reputational problem. The work is out there, and Weil's reputation seems to be just as good as Kirkland's. So I can only conclude that Weil's considerably lower number of filings is because they can't staff additional work (supported by way lower headcount overall), not an inability to obtain it ab initio.
Former Weil associate from above, there's been considerable turnover in the last two years in large part due to workload, the large majority of which were voluntary. I can think of two or three associates that were "pushed out" and I will say that they were... deserved. I'm not really sure where the "aggressively" pushing out associates thing is coming from. Look, the group is slammed, they're not trying to reduce headcount and have everyone work that much harder.
Also think market share in this context can be a bit misleading, the KE group is significantly bigger than Weil's group. Doing a quick search on the respective websites you'll see ~100 people in restructuring at Weil and ~450 at KE. KE was on fire earlier this year with filings and Weil has been on fire more recently (I count 4 in the past few weeks (including some big names: Brooks Brothers, Chuck E. Cheese, 24 Hour Fitness). I imagine Weil is at capacity, and I imagine KE is too. Which goes back to the original point of the thread, which is that both are hiring, and both will probably give you a signing bonus to go there.
2 or 3 is a very significant undercount
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:17 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 1:53 pm
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:45 pm
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:48 am
jarofsoup wrote: ↑Wed Jul 08, 2020 2:50 pm
If you say so....
Anyway you are right that Latham is going gangbusters. I would also imagine that the Delaware shops are very busy.
Weil BFR aggressively pushes out substandard associates even when they are slammed (maybe because of it, not in spite of it). That’s not up for debate
Are they pushed out, or do they quit of their own volition? I saw posts about a string of associate departures from Weil in mid-late 2019, when they were already understaffed. As it was described to me, it sounded like they quit, not that they were shoved out the door.
I'd be very surprised to hear that the group would shoot itself in the foot by reducing headcount, especially when they're already falling well behind Kirkland on market share. I have zero insider knowledge of what's going on here, but it looks to me like a staffing problem, not a reputational problem. The work is out there, and Weil's reputation seems to be just as good as Kirkland's. So I can only conclude that Weil's considerably lower number of filings is because they can't staff additional work (supported by way lower headcount overall), not an inability to obtain it ab initio.
Former Weil associate from above, there's been considerable turnover in the last two years in large part due to workload, the large majority of which were voluntary. I can think of two or three associates that were "pushed out" and I will say that they were... deserved. I'm not really sure where the "aggressively" pushing out associates thing is coming from. Look, the group is slammed, they're not trying to reduce headcount and have everyone work that much harder.
Also think market share in this context can be a bit misleading, the KE group is significantly bigger than Weil's group. Doing a quick search on the respective websites you'll see ~100 people in restructuring at Weil and ~450 at KE. KE was on fire earlier this year with filings and Weil has been on fire more recently (I count 4 in the past few weeks (including some big names: Brooks Brothers, Chuck E. Cheese, 24 Hour Fitness). I imagine Weil is at capacity, and I imagine KE is too. Which goes back to the original point of the thread, which is that both are hiring, and both will probably give you a signing bonus to go there.
Right, this all makes sense to me. I want to point out, though, that the number of people classed as being in "restructuring" at Kirkland is kind of bullshit. If you skim through some of their profiles, a lot of them are just M&A, O&G, etc. associates that have clearly been reclassed as being in "restructuring" to match the current environment. A good chunk of them have literally zero restructuring work on their profiles, though I'm sure they actually are doing restructuring work at this point. I assume Weil (and like, every other firm with a semblance of a BK practice) is doing the same though, so it's not all that meaningful.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:32 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 1:53 pm
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 12:45 pm
Anonymous User wrote: ↑Thu Jul 09, 2020 2:48 am
jarofsoup wrote: ↑Wed Jul 08, 2020 2:50 pm
If you say so....
Anyway you are right that Latham is going gangbusters. I would also imagine that the Delaware shops are very busy.
Weil BFR aggressively pushes out substandard associates even when they are slammed (maybe because of it, not in spite of it). That’s not up for debate
Are they pushed out, or do they quit of their own volition? I saw posts about a string of associate departures from Weil in mid-late 2019, when they were already understaffed. As it was described to me, it sounded like they quit, not that they were shoved out the door.
I'd be very surprised to hear that the group would shoot itself in the foot by reducing headcount, especially when they're already falling well behind Kirkland on market share. I have zero insider knowledge of what's going on here, but it looks to me like a staffing problem, not a reputational problem. The work is out there, and Weil's reputation seems to be just as good as Kirkland's. So I can only conclude that Weil's considerably lower number of filings is because they can't staff additional work (supported by way lower headcount overall), not an inability to obtain it ab initio.
Former Weil associate from above, there's been considerable turnover in the last two years in large part due to workload, the large majority of which were voluntary. I can think of two or three associates that were "pushed out" and I will say that they were... deserved. I'm not really sure where the "aggressively" pushing out associates thing is coming from. Look, the group is slammed, they're not trying to reduce headcount and have everyone work that much harder.
Also think market share in this context can be a bit misleading, the KE group is significantly bigger than Weil's group. Doing a quick search on the respective websites you'll see ~100 people in restructuring at Weil and ~450 at KE. KE was on fire earlier this year with filings and Weil has been on fire more recently (I count 4 in the past few weeks (including some big names: Brooks Brothers, Chuck E. Cheese, 24 Hour Fitness). I imagine Weil is at capacity, and I imagine KE is too. Which goes back to the original point of the thread, which is that both are hiring, and both will probably give you a signing bonus to go there.
Anon KE associate. Not getting into the Weil v. KE dispute. Just chipping in because the 450 figure is not accurate. A lot of litigators/corp folks that regularly help out on restructuring matters, list it on their bios. But, actual bk lawyers is more like 180. More broadly, yes, the Kirkland group is bigger, but not 4.5x bigger.
Re: State of bankruptcy/restructuring hiring?
Posted: Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:34 pm
by Anonymous User
Anon creditor side band 1. We wanted a few good midlevels and recently poached them (last ~3 months) from other band 1/2 shops. We're busy but we're not K&E/Weil hours. Think reasonable estimate for group midlevels is 23-2400 this year.
I think there are many crossover aspects to bk and you don't need to like be able to draft debt docs to be a valuable associate. I like having people with M&A experience if transactions are being thrown around.
The real sweet sauce for rx is 1: having a genuine interest in the practice, 2: having both corporate and lit skills / mindsets. you can't do the job if you don't want to do both.